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Minority Ethnics within the army.

#1
BTW 'Minority Ethnic' has now replaced 'Ethnic Minority' in PC speak, and no I can't spot the difference either.
I have noticed in the past year or so, or more precisely since the commonwealth recruits have been trained and posted to units a drop off in UK born minorities within the army suddenly making the headlines in the 'I was bullied because of my colour', 'The army is racist' and other such headlines, yet there is not a jot from the newly arrived commonwealth recruits. Surely if the army was inherently racist, as some would like Joe Public to believe then it would be reported en-mass by now. I wonder if the former complainants have been exposed for the winging, work dodging scrotes they probably were? I also wonder,especially in light of the probable decoration in the near future of the soldier from Grenada if recruiting will become better from UK ethnic groups who now realize that whatever they may have heard about racism in the army is complete arrse and it is a viable career choice?
 
#2
Very subtle the change there, look like all they've done is swap the two words around, obviously makes a world of difference to the PC brigade but is lost on simpletons like myself.

As for institutional racism how can an institution be racist individual people within the oragnisation yes but the organisation as a whole? Grip the individuals no matter what their rank and leave the rest of us well alone to get on with the job.

Zippy483
 
#3
IMO if a soldier could do the job, whatever his colour there would be no problem.

If the soldier was a waster, whatever his colour he would have the p*ss taken out of him, the ethnic's would always blame racism.

It's not p*ss because you are ethnic its p*ss of because you are a waste of space and happen to be ethnic.
 
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error_unknown

Guest
#4
zippy483 said:
As for institutional racism how can an institution be racist individual people within the oragnisation yes but the organisation as a whole?
So, would you argue that, for example, the BNP or the SS were not 'institutionally racist'?
 

Cutaway

LE
Kit Reviewer
#5
chickenpunk said:
zippy483 said:
As for institutional racism how can an institution be racist individual people within the oragnisation yes but the organisation as a whole?
So, would you argue that, for example, the BNP or the SS were not 'institutionally racist'?

I think the SS were victims of bad Public Relations.
:wink:
 
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error_unknown

Guest
#6
Cutaway said:
chickenpunk said:
zippy483 said:
As for institutional racism how can an institution be racist individual people within the oragnisation yes but the organisation as a whole?
So, would you argue that, for example, the BNP or the SS were not 'institutionally racist'?

I think the SS were victims of bad Public Relations.
:wink:
Very multiethnic too e.g :-

13. Waffen-Gebirgs-Division der SS Handschar (kroatische Nr. 1) was formed to use Bosnian Muslims to defend their home region against the partisans and Chetnik forces.

21. SS Waffen-Gebirgs-Division der SS Skanderbeg (albanische Nr. 1) was formed in 1944 and consisted mainly of volunteers from Albania and Kosovo.

:D
 
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error_unknown

Guest
#8
Benjaminw1 said:
Very multiethnic too e.g :-

13. Waffen-Gebirgs-Division der SS Handschar (kroatische Nr. 1) was formed to use Bosnian Muslims to defend their home region against the partisans and Chetnik forces.

21. SS Waffen-Gebirgs-Division der SS Skanderbeg (albanische Nr. 1) was formed in 1944 and consisted mainly of volunteers from Albania and Kosovo.

:D
Ah, but these weren't members of the SS, they were soldiers serving in units under the control of the SS. A minor distinction but one that was very important to Himmler. In theory, only Germanic aryans could be members of the SS.
 
#10
The Ethnic thing..........Early '60's saw a large influx of Fijians who nearly all went to Para/Cdo/SF. Almost to a man I would, [and once or twice did] trust any one of them to be at my back when push came to shove! Colour never entered into the scheme of things and they were never looked on as anything else but bloody good soldiers and friends, most of whom made SNCO. The Ghurkas at company strength always have been excellent. Also had the odd other 'ethnic' in those days and in the main with one or two exceptions were 'mauvais sujet'. Can remember an incident in Aldershot NAAFI about that time when a WI with three of his acolytes came up to a Fijian sitting with us and said "Are you with us brother?" upon which said, the Fijian promptly floored him and said "don't 'brother' me you black bastard" That was his way of dealing with racism from any quarter as far as he and the rest of the unit were concerned. Can't really comment on today's mix. Do the Ghurkas fit in well being attached to non Ghurka units?
 
#11
chickenpunk said:
Benjaminw1 said:
Very multiethnic too e.g :-

13. Waffen-Gebirgs-Division der SS Handschar (kroatische Nr. 1) was formed to use Bosnian Muslims to defend their home region against the partisans and Chetnik forces.

21. SS Waffen-Gebirgs-Division der SS Skanderbeg (albanische Nr. 1) was formed in 1944 and consisted mainly of volunteers from Albania and Kosovo.

:D
Ah, but these weren't members of the SS, they were soldiers serving in units under the control of the SS. A minor distinction but one that was very important to Himmler. In theory, only Germanic aryans could be members of the SS.
What about the French/Norwegian/Dutch etc SS units? Were these considered to be Germanic Aryan enough? Well I can believe it of the Norwegians, but the French!
 
#12
One of the recent polls on this site indicated that 1 in 5 of those polled are going to or are seriously considering voting BNP. We have phrases like “thieving gyppo”, “pikie cnuts” etc used constantly. A significant number of posts are basically along the line Muslim = terrorist. Any report of criminal activity is met with a mass of “string the bastards up”, “castrate them”, “throw them out of the country” etc etc. And the number of people who are able to back up arguments with the minutiae of the SS organization, ethnicity, equipment and leadership is quite remarkable.

I believe in free speech and enjoy the discussions that take place on this site. They do, however, often reveal attitudes in our organisation which are at least questionable in a democratic society.
 
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error_unknown

Guest
#13
CrapSpy said:
chickenpunk said:
Benjaminw1 said:
Very multiethnic too e.g :-

13. Waffen-Gebirgs-Division der SS Handschar (kroatische Nr. 1) was formed to use Bosnian Muslims to defend their home region against the partisans and Chetnik forces.

21. SS Waffen-Gebirgs-Division der SS Skanderbeg (albanische Nr. 1) was formed in 1944 and consisted mainly of volunteers from Albania and Kosovo.

:D
Ah, but these weren't members of the SS, they were soldiers serving in units under the control of the SS. A minor distinction but one that was very important to Himmler. In theory, only Germanic aryans could be members of the SS.
What about the French/Norwegian/Dutch etc SS units? Were these considered to be Germanic Aryan enough? Well I can believe it of the Norwegians, but the French!
As far as the SS was concerned, the Dutch, Danes, Norgies, Flemings and Brits were 'Germanic' peoples. However, if you were of German descent you could come from anywhere and still be considered a Volksdeutsche and thus eligible for SS membership. I don't think that the non-German 'Germanics' became actual members of the SS 'order' but all except the Brits (obviously!) had a version of the Allgemeine-SS at home which they could join. The French were definitely not considered Germanic: the Charlemagne Division was a 'Waffen-Grenadier-Division'.
 
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error_unknown

Guest
#14
RiojaDOC said:
One of the recent polls on this site indicated that 1 in 5 of those polled are going to or are seriously considering voting BNP. We have phrases like “thieving gyppo”, “pikie cnuts” etc used constantly. A significant number of posts are basically along the line Muslim = terrorist. Any report of criminal activity is met with a mass of “string the bastards up”, “castrate them”, “throw them out of the country” etc etc. And the number of people who are able to back up arguments with the minutiae of the SS organization, ethnicity, equipment and leadership is quite remarkable.

I believe in free speech and enjoy the discussions that take place on this site. They do, however, often reveal attitudes in our organisation which are at least questionable in a democratic society.
Is that aimed at me Boy?

Ok what attitudes questionable, or is this journo bs pc speak meaning fa?
 

Unknown_Quantity

War Hero
Moderator
#15
chickenpunk said:
zippy483 said:
As for institutional racism how can an institution be racist individual people within the oragnisation yes but the organisation as a whole?
So, would you argue that, for example, the BNP or the SS were not 'institutionally racist'?
I realise that you're being tongue in cheek but never-the-less; the BNP and the SS were set up by racists (in the case of the BNP for racists and in the case of the SS for a racist party). I completely agree with zippy on this one, lose the bad apples* and the problem is solved.

*Bad apples include the wingeing wasters who think they'll get something for nothing or are special because their superficially different.
 
#16
chickenpunk said:
As far as the SS was concerned, the Dutch, Danes, Norgies, Flemings and Brits were 'Germanic' peoples. However, if you were of German descent you could come from anywhere and still be considered a Volksdeutsche and thus eligible for SS membership. I don't think that the non-German 'Germanics' became actual members of the SS 'order' but all except the Brits (obviously!) had a version of the Allgemeine-SS at home which they could join. The French were definitely not considered Germanic: the Charlemagne Division was a 'Waffen-Grenadier-Division'.
There was a UK SS group, called the Britisches Freikorps:

http://www.feldgrau.com/gb.html



(edited for German grammar!)
 
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error_unknown

Guest
#17
Unknown_Quantity said:
I realise that you're being tongue in cheek but never-the-less; the BNP and the SS were set up by racists (in the case of the BNP for racists and in the case of the SS for a racist party). I completely agree with zippy on this one, lose the bad apples* and the problem is solved.

*Bad apples include the wingeing wasters who think they'll get something for nothing or are special because their superficially different.
I was being slightly tongue in cheek but the fact is that I suspect that the people who founded the modern British Army would have thought it inconceivable that people who weren't white Europeans could possibly be their intellectual or moral equals. A lot of people on this site, including me, date back to the time when, for example, the Guards and the Int Corps were effectively 'whites only' organisations and many other parts of the army wished they were too. Things have changed a lot - and for the better in my opinion - but a lot of the attitudes are still there; which is not to say I think the Army is a 'racist institution'. The point I was making is that it is perfectly possible for an institution to be racist.
 
#19
yeah but the Brit freikorps were only ever 30 strong at best, were mostly BUF who did a runner to Germany rather than face jail in UK, also were mostly self-important posers whom the SS had scant regard for and were only given weapons in the last days of the war!
Some unit! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
 

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