Military Modelling

51st RTR (Leeds Rifles) when they were still part of 25th Tank Bde - second in seniority to North Irish Horse) if you can still find Gerry Chester's website on the above & I gleaned a lot of info from it as they later became the principal manoeuvre unit for 25th Armoured Engineer Bde RE after NIH left for 21st Tank Bde.

Why do I not recall SCC2 being used on Tanks, sometimes on carriers and for all Bailey Bridges in Italy.

Pretty sure the Brit Green SCC15 was used.

A veteran I spoke to said that they always applied mud to the brighter Tac signs - yellow or white but artistically it doesn't make for an attractive model - do you want me to look up when they got rid of the RAF style roundel for white star?
Also, white Maple Leaf applied to black diabolo after Coriano.
Good info mate! I think the roundel was replaced by the star from about mid 1943. Colourwise as I said above, I chose SCC 2 as the Mk IV was an older variant so reckoned they probably wouldn't have bothered to repaint them. Very difficult to tell from the pictures, which by the way are original colour photos not colourised. As to tank names, it looks like B Sqn possibly used battle honours.
 
I can dig out Mike Starters Sicily and Italy tomorrow if you like.

As part of 25TB 51RTR was Ist Army in Tunisia but I can't remember whether they had that distinctive two colour camo that was used there.

There was an specific MTP for further campaigns into Sicily and Italy once they amalgamated into 8th Army. 142 RAC (7th Bn The Suffolk's) was the junior unit of that formation
 
I can dig out Mike Starters Sicily and Italy tomorrow if you like.

As part of 25TB 51RTR was Ist Army in Tunisia but I can't remember whether they had that distinctive two colour camo that was used there.

There was an specific MTP for further campaigns into Sicily and Italy once they amalgamated into 8th Army. 142 RAC (7th Bn The Suffolk's) was the junior unit of that formation
Just been reading up on 51st RTR. After the Tunisian campaign finished they stayed in North Africa for nearly a year before they were redeployed to Italy. They landed in Naples in April 1944 where they were re-equipped with new Churchills. That's the same month that the official camouflage colour changed from SCC 2 to SCC 15. If they were re-equipped on arrival then those vehicles would have been in depot in Italy for a while and would not have been repainted unless they seriously needed it. By that logic the majority of their tanks would have been painted SCC 2 and probably still would have been when those photos were taken in July.
 
Just been reading up on 51st RTR. After the Tunisian campaign finished they stayed in North Africa for nearly a year before they were redeployed to Italy. They landed in Naples in April 1944 where they were re-equipped with new Churchills. That's the same month that the official camouflage colour changed from SCC 2 to SCC 15. If they were re-equipped on arrival then those vehicles would have been in depot in Italy for a while and would not have been repainted unless they seriously needed it. By that logic the majority of their tanks would have been painted SCC 2 and probably still would have been when those photos were taken in July.
Hmmm - I suspect you're being optimistic - I'll have a look later.

A lot of those tanks were just new to a unit - repaired etc - some Armoured Divs we re-roled into NWE and left their kit. I'm not sure if Brit units allocated to US Army retained Churchill or got Sherman etc. I know that despite all Hobart's Funnies, 8th Army created their own, Churchill NA 75 is one example, the Engineer improvisations were another

Do green filters modulate colour considerably? That and some Appenine dust may be calling
 
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Quick shufti at MAFVA - bit unclear.
I'm trying to relocate a diagrammatic database I referenced myself recently although there was an excellent article 'hiding in plain sight' - no longer supported it seems.
 
Just been reading up on 51st RTR. After the Tunisian campaign finished they stayed in North Africa for nearly a year before they were redeployed to Italy. They landed in Naples in April 1944 where they were re-equipped with new Churchills.
Curiouser and curiouser about a Mk.I turning up in Aug '44.
 
Curiouser and curiouser about a Mk.I turning up in Aug '44.
They probably kept them for their HE capability. Most of the tanks in that series of pictures are Mk IV's armed with the 6 Pdr, which was a pretty rubbish gun for infantry support. The Mk I CS would have been a very useful addition.

Edited to add: When I said new Churchills, I meant new to them. They had Mk III's in Tunisia and when they arrived in Naples they were re-equipped with Mk IV's.
 
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Curiouser and curiouser about a Mk.I turning up in Aug '44.
Looks like Gerry Chester's webpage may be down but any Google search with him may provide links that are worth pursuing.

Unlike many veteran accounts his were very accurate and we'll documented.
I recall he was instrumental in completely debunking a book about Tiger 131s capture and starting to set the record straight.

There may still be the 'Churchill Register' that sometimes explains individual tanks histories. But I'll re-iterate, 8th Army in Italy had to improvise and extemporise with make do and mend rather than receive new kit from Britain.
 

Legs

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Book Reviewer
We had one of those monsters out in Wildenrath in case one of them weird Phantoms turned up :-D
How well I remember the sound, the FEELING, when one of those bad boys took off at full reheat as one stood at the end of the runway at Wildenrath. The deep thunder that rolled in one's chest as the Phantom flew overhead with it's dark trail of exhaust smoke gently rolling over the countryside. As a 10/11 year old it was the most amazing thing. And then a Pembroke followed a few minutes later, the propellers sounding like an insect in comparison.
 
How well I remember the sound, the FEELING, when one of those bad boys took off at full reheat as one stood at the end of the runway at Wildenrath. The deep thunder that rolled in one's chest as the Phantom flew overhead with it's dark trail of exhaust smoke gently rolling over the countryside. As a 10/11 year old it was the most amazing thing. And then a Pembroke followed a few minutes later, the propellers sounding like an insect in comparison.
Just a quick drift.
When we were in the Falklands, the RAF was still operating Phantoms down there. This was 1990, BTW. One of our lads had just completed P Coy, and someone told him that he had picked to do a parachute jump from one of said Phantoms. And he believed it. The c**k.
 
Added a bridge classification and made a start on the weathering. Dogs are demanding a walk now so I'll have to carry on later.

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@brewmeister
- What appears to be a relevant quote from Mike Starmers 'Sicily and Italy 1943-45'
It may have been possible though unlikely (insofar as I can find no documentary evidence. Most Churchill's would have had their N.Africa/Tunisia can and whilst these were found to be unsuitable for Italy some units still had them.
B Vehicles and carriers of 78th Div were certainly supplied in. SCC2 from Britain.
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From Dennis Oliver's 'British Armor(sic) in Sicily and Italy' Concord Publications Company 'Armor At War Series

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The Churchill's are British Olive Drab, the Carrier SCC2
 
Further to the above.

One aspect I have noticed is that the UIN,which changed as units left or joined, were usually displayed once promulgated and known and these really place the date of the vehicle if either the unit or date is known.
 
Well boys, if you are considering a Wingnut Wings kit in the near to medium term, I’d get your arse in gear and get it bought now before prices rocket - they are about to go into administration (so the word on the QT goes). Moulds are done in New Zealand and manufacturing is in........ yup. China. The decision is rumoured to be taking place to protect the other businesses the lad who owns wingnut wings has interests in.

No Lanc and the demise of an ace manufacturer if the rumour mill is correct. It will be a shame. The rumours are not being denied. Allegedly..
 
For a rather clunky kit I think it turned out alright. The old ammo box is a control for SCC 2, it shows how much environment can change colours. Time to build the Dragon version now.

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I can't recall if this has been posted before, so I'll share it anyway. A good reference for British WW2 vehicles camouflage colours. If you look around on the web there are mixes for various model paints too:

 
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Well boys, if you are considering a Wingnut Wings kit in the near to medium term, I’d get your arse in gear and get it bought now before prices rocket - they are about to go into administration (so the word on the QT goes). Moulds are done in New Zealand and manufacturing is in........ yup. China. The decision is rumoured to be taking place to protect the other businesses the lad who owns wingnut wings has interests in.

No Lanc and the demise of an ace manufacturer if the rumour mill is correct. It will be a shame. The rumours are not being denied. Allegedly..
Pity. The 1/32 stressed skin Lanc looked really interesting.
 
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