Military Law

#1
Hello.
In the morning on the way to work I was pulled and over the limit from the night before drinking.
Naughty I know! and I'm sure I'll be paying for it later.

What I would like to know is what are the repercussions with the TA been caught drink driving?

I remember once told. We come under civvi law and military law.

Will I be kicked out the TA?
 

The_Duke

LE
Moderator
#2
No, but if your TA job is as a driver, you may find yourself having an uncomfortable conversation with your OC.

Make sure you inform your chain of command - it is a notifiable event.
 

Ravers

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#3
I wouldn't even bother mentioning it. Unless your TA job involves driving and you get a ban then how will the TA find out? The few regular lads I knew who got in the shite for DD only got found out because they had to take time off to go to court, the punishments they received from the mob were fairly minor and were mostly stoppages of leave or career checks (a hold on promotion for a year). Other lads I knew who managed to fix their court date over a leave period got away with no snags as their unit were none the wiser.
 

Ravers

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#5
globoloco22 said:
I'm a TA CMT this involves driving!
Oh, well in that case, as with all TA queries, ask your PSI. :D
 
#6
It's one of those things where you have to tell your Chain of Command and take the hit. If for any reason they find out about it and you didn't declare it, then you are seriously in the poo.

The resulting penalty will depend on how far over the limit you were. I seem to recall, don't quote me on this though, that if you were less than 3 and a half times over the limit then the going rate was a Career Check for a first offence of that type, which basically means you won't get a LS&GC medal. Avobe that though and you are into the realms of potential discharge.

This is based on the previous system, not the current Armed Forces Act though, but I imagine it won't be too different.
 
#7
I was just over the limt nowhere near double the limit it was 42, legal limit 36 i think.

What are the chances of things like promotion prospects and moving forward.

Am I still deployable is prob the main one.
 

The_Duke

LE
Moderator
#8
globoloco22 said:
I'm a TA CMT this involves driving!
So you can still perform some of your job, but not part of it. I doubt you will be sacked, and to be honest I doubt (but cannot state for certain) that they will bring any disciplinary action against you as it did not occur on "army time". That said, don't expect a great grade on your Judgement or Reliability entries on your next SJAR.

You definately need to disclose it as better you have the conversation now rather that when your name appears on the driver duty lists.
 
#9
Ravers said:
I wouldn't even bother mentioning it. Unless your TA job involves driving and you get a ban then how will the TA find out? The few regular lads I knew who got in the shite for DD only got found out because they had to take time off to go to court, the punishments they received from the mob were fairly minor and were mostly stoppages of leave or career checks (a hold on promotion for a year). Other lads I knew who managed to fix their court date over a leave period got away with no snags as their unit were none the wiser.
I would hate to see the integrity entry on your CR....
 
#10
Unless you were heading for the TAC, you can't be charged with a military offence for the DD bit. If the event hits the media and it comes out that your in the TA, there's an unlikely chance that you'd be hit with damaging the reputation of the Army.

As you won't be able to perform your current duties to the full, this could be the time to consider a career change, at least temporarily, to maintain promotion prospects. Has your unit got any non-driving vacancies? Any other units within walking distance?
 

The_Duke

LE
Moderator
#11
putteesinmyhands said:
Unless you were heading for the TAC, you can't be charged with a military offence for the DD bit. If the event hits the media and it comes out that your in the TA, there's an unlikely chance that you'd be hit with damaging the reputation of the Army.

As you won't be able to perform your current duties to the full, this could be the time to consider a career change, at least temporarily, to maintain promotion prospects. Has your unit got any non-driving vacancies? Any other units within walking distance?
I would hazard a guess that a change in job will not overshadow the serious implications of a DD in terms of judgement, reliability, common sense etc.

It would be hard to write up "this man displays all of the attributes of a (insert next rank up) and must be promoted immediately" after a DD conviction which in turn required a change in role because he was unable to complete all of the functions of the role he used to do.
 

Ravers

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#12
msr said:
Ravers said:
I wouldn't even bother mentioning it. Unless your TA job involves driving and you get a ban then how will the TA find out? The few regular lads I knew who got in the shite for DD only got found out because they had to take time off to go to court, the punishments they received from the mob were fairly minor and were mostly stoppages of leave or career checks (a hold on promotion for a year). Other lads I knew who managed to fix their court date over a leave period got away with no snags as their unit were none the wiser.
I would hate to see the integrity entry on your CR....
Didn't even know there was an integrity entry on my CR!
The most important lesson I was ever taught was to not get caught. :D

Seriously though, if an incident occurs outside of Army time, that has no effect on your career (TA or regular) why bother making a song and dance about it?
Although obviously in this case it will have an effect on the original poster as a large part of his TA job involves driving.
As far as I know the TA don't make random CRB checks on serving soldiers and the civvy courts are not obliged to inform the TA of any proceedings against it's members, so why bother bringing negative attention to yourself when it is not necessary?
 

The_Duke

LE
Moderator
#13
Because it is on the list of notifiable events, and it will come to light anyway. If his role involves driving (which it does), then he will have to get his name off the list of drivers. For non specific driver roled TA units, soldiers with the correct paperwork, Fams, FMT etc are like hens teeth - so it will still come to light anyway.

SPSI - "Bloggs, you are driving the waggon tonight."

Bloggs - "No, I can't"

SPSI - "Why not?"

Bloggs - "Because I can't"

(Continues until Bloggs admits to losing his licence, or risks losing his teeth as the SPSI reaches the end of his tether)
 
#14
3.044.
[snip]
TA personnel are therefore to report any change of circumstances, including those listed below, to their sub unit headquarters without delay:

Change of Next of Kin details.

Civil Offences, including alleged offences for which proceedings are pending.

Any conviction arising from a civil offence.

Divorce/Separation.

Births.

Marriages.

Deaths.

Change of Address.

Change of Employment.

Gaining of any educational or professional qualifications not previously declared.

Any change in medical or dental condition (other than minor illnesses or minor injuries) which is under treatment by civilian practitioners/specialists or hospitals. Any planned absence out of the United Kingdom.

Reporting of Civil Proceedings Against an Officer or Soldier
3.117. An officer or soldier against whom proceedings by the civil authority are pending, for any offence, is to report the facts forthwith to his commanding officer, and is also in due course to report the outcome of the proceedings including details of any sentence imposed. This applies whether or not the alleged offence was committed while the individual was subject to military law. This paragraph does not apply to minor road traffic offences under the Road Traffic Act unless they result in disqualification.
 
#15
Ok so before this get's out of hand let me explain more clearly.

The night before I had a few drinks at home. I'm not a big drinker never really liked the tatse. I was unaware I was drunk just the morning hangover.

I drove to work. Civvi work. I'm a medical practitioner! on my way to work they had vehicle check point set up where I was tested.

Due in Court tomorrow, No solicitor no pleads of non guilt no excuses whats done is done. I am a good person no previous convictions work hard and study harder. My opinion is yes i was over the limit. what i did not do was drive to the pub, drink then intentionally drive home knowing I've drunk. In my line of work I've seen too many aftermaths of drink driving related accidents.

I AM telling my TAC, NOT IN ANYWAY am I trying to avoid telling anyone.
all I was asking what are the consequences!

In terms of promotions deployability. Is the I'm a CMT at a non medical unit and regarded very highly as well as performing very highly with numerous reccomendations for commissioning. I was Ex reg who performed to high standards from the Army technical college.

All I'm asking is will this tar my prospects with the TA and what are the punishments.
 
#16
It was either well into the early hours, or more than few...

The answer to your question can only come from your unit.
 
#17
Post judgement msr! Not early hours/ And yes was a few.

I'm not either going in to the phyisological reponses on how alcohol affects the human body
With common sense you would know that alcohol affects different people body compositions and types at different stages of time.

Many factors including physcological response physiological.
from last time of oral intake, state of health to strenghts of alcohol.


Instead of presuming msr! JUST ASK
 
#18
If you blew 42 were you given the opportunity to give a urine/blood sample. If you were, you should have taken it.
 
#19
If you blew 42 are you not entitled to a blood/urine test? If I remember 36 is the limit but you are not prosecuted untill you blow 40, 40 to 50 you have the mentioned blood/urine test and if you blow over 50 thats your lot. Thats how I was instructed (Civvy plod) but it was a number of years ago.
 
#20
In response Mr monkey!
Yes I did get offered the other sample test, I declined.

its if you blow over 49 you dont get offered the tests.

In all fairness this has nothing to do with my query.
 

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