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MERS Coronavirus warning
- Thread starter jarrod248
- Start date
PhotEx
LE
They charge for flu jabs
I suspect the company I work for will have us queued up for mandatory jabs that they will pay for.
They're quite serious about this flu thingy.
They're quite serious about this flu thingy.
terminal
LE
Former French President Valéry Giscard d'Estaing has died of COVID-19.
Valéry Giscard d'Estaing, former French president who helped reshape Europe, dead of COVID-19
The rest of the news story is about his political career.
Valéry Giscard d'Estaing, former French president who helped reshape Europe, dead of COVID-19
The rest of the news story is about his political career.
Sweden's still not into excess deaths:
Nick Dipples
LE
Again, Michael Levitt is a great example of how you can be accomplished in one field and then be a total fúcking retard about everything else.
Nick Dipples
LE
The deaths in Sweden lag by multiple days/weeks. Still going up.
Nick Dipples
LE
Aaand finally from the Swedish health service
Sweden's still in the normal range in your graph, well well below 'substantial increase' and well in the margins of the normal range.
Hasn't anyone told them there's a deadly pandemic on the go?
Nick Dipples
LE
See the other graphs for why (especially the last one - orange = excess mortality), or is that too complicated for you?
Michael levitt has been continuously wrong throughout the pandemic. He's a complete fúckwit.
The lethal nonsense of Michael Levitt
“It is not easy when people start listening to all the nonsense you talk. Suddenly, there are many more opportunities and enticements than one can ever manage.” – Michael Levitt, …
liorpachter.wordpress.com
See the other graphs for why (especially the last one - orange = excess mortality), or is that too complicated for you?
Michael levitt has been continuously wrong throughout the pandemic. He's a complete fúckwit.
The lethal nonsense of Michael Levitt
“It is not easy when people start listening to all the nonsense you talk. Suddenly, there are many more opportunities and enticements than one can ever manage.” – Michael Levitt, …
Yes, the Nobel prize winning scientist is a 'complete fuckwit' says the bloke from the internet called 'Nick Dipples'.
Spot on.
I can also see the graph that YOU provided and state some facts about it:
1. Deaths in Sweden are now in well within the normal range, like no-one knows there's a deadly pandemic going on.
2. Deaths are really well below the 'substantial increase'.
Nick Dipples
LE
That graph demonstrates the level of excess deaths in early 2020 is way higher than in surrounding countries.
The second graph shows that the current number of deaths is both underreported and approaching the early 2020 figure.
The 3rd graph shows that even with the underrporting there are excess deaths.
I apologise for expecting you to link multiple thoughts together unaided.
The second graph shows that the current number of deaths is both underreported and approaching the early 2020 figure.
The 3rd graph shows that even with the underrporting there are excess deaths.
I apologise for expecting you to link multiple thoughts together unaided.
We all know what happened in early 2020, mucka, and the current excess deaths - even with the under reporting - are still in the normal range and very much under the substantial increase line.
I'll make a note in my google diary and revisit in two weeks to see how it turns out.
terminal
LE
Here's the COVID-19 summary for Thursday.
Coronavirus: What's happening in Canada around the world on Dec. 3
Infections hit a new high in Russia, with 28,145 cases on Thursday.
In Japan, the city of Osaka is telling residents to stay home as much as possible due to rising infections and hospitalisations. Osaka reported 386 new cases, and hospitals are becoming overcrowded.
South Africa are increasing restrictions in Eastern Cape, limiting indoor gatherings, extending the curfew, and prohibiting public consumption of alcohol (it's not clear what is covered in the last item).
Iran have passed 1 million total cases, and saw 13,922 new cases on Thursday. They also had 358 new deaths, with the total to date being 49,348.
Coronavirus: What's happening in Canada around the world on Dec. 3
Infections hit a new high in Russia, with 28,145 cases on Thursday.
In Japan, the city of Osaka is telling residents to stay home as much as possible due to rising infections and hospitalisations. Osaka reported 386 new cases, and hospitals are becoming overcrowded.
South Africa are increasing restrictions in Eastern Cape, limiting indoor gatherings, extending the curfew, and prohibiting public consumption of alcohol (it's not clear what is covered in the last item).
Iran have passed 1 million total cases, and saw 13,922 new cases on Thursday. They also had 358 new deaths, with the total to date being 49,348.
terminal
LE
Pfizer have cut their vaccine production target for December in half due to shortages of raw materials. They are now expecting to be able to produce 50 million doses. This will be enough to vaccinate 25 million people.
Lack of raw materials blamed for slashed supply target of Pfizer's COVID-19 vaccine
Lack of raw materials blamed for slashed supply target of Pfizer's COVID-19 vaccine
lastwalt
LE
Which of the ingredients are they short of? The recipe:
Fillet of a fenny snake,
In the caldron boil and bake;
Eye of newt and toe of frog,
Wool of bat and tongue of dog,
Adder's fork and blind-worm's sting,
Lizard's leg and howlet's wing,
For a charm of powerful trouble,
Like a hell-broth boil and bubble.
Tedsson
LE
I would suggest leaving out the bat.
Tedsson
LE
They do in Britain as well.
I was in the doctors/chemist last week and the chemist was offering flu vaccinations. £60 for Joe Public and £30 for pensioners.
Being a pensioner and having just had a free flu vaccination (and a free pneumonia one) I passed on the offer.
lastwalt
LE
It’s probably a “de-activated” bat.
exsniffer
Old-Salt
I saw this on the Long Rider blog and thought it worth posting on. David Warburton q Tory MP has set out his reasons for voting against the 3 tier system of controls, It s a fairly wrong read but he makes some interesting (IMHO) points particularly comparing deaths caused by the restrictions as compared with deaths caused by Covid. The comments about the restrictions setting a dangerous precedent for removing our civil liberties is particularly worrying.
I have seven key reservations which I outline below – and led me to vote against the tier system. For the sake of clarity I’ve outlined them below in bullet-point form:
1, First, the regulations fail in their essentials. For government regulations to work (which can only be achieved through public consent), they must be clear, and underpinned by cohesive internal logic. But the rules that have been proposed are contradictory and, in many cases, seem almost arbitrary. From last orders at 10pm but 11pm closing (do we all order four rounds at 10pm, or do venues have to pay staff for an hour with no takings?), to the vaguely defined ‘substantial meal’. From allowing soft drinks all day but alcohol only with food, to an astonishingly labyrinthine and impossibly convoluted ‘bubble’ system, with no obvious sense of cause and effect. From work meetings being allowed in public or private places (only for self-employed), to no one allowed to meet from separate households either outdoors or indoors, unless they’re on a train or travelling.
2, I have been asking (both publicly on social media and in private conversations with Ministers) for the data – a cost benefit analysis – which informed the decisions around the Tier system. Apparently the Cabinet Office had been putting this together all weekend for us, which sadly suggests that the data was not the basis for the proposed rules. The crucial question we have to ask ourselves is what is the cost to lives, to livelihoods, to businesses, to mental health, suicides, to all non-Covid related heath and – of course – the future of the economy of the restrictions, against the likely lives saved from those same restrictions.
The ONS have calculated that there will be / will have been 200,000 excess non-Covid deaths caused by the restrictions. This is nearly four times the number of presumed Covid deaths. Bristol University put the figure at 560,000. While I don’t suggest these figures are anything other than an estimate (given the circumstances and fast-moving picture), they should nonetheless give us pause to question the wisdom of continuing a course of action that has produced them.
3, The regional basis for the tiering is problematic. The apparent incidence of Covid-19 is inflated in areas (like our own) that are affected by nearby towns or cities. And many, having had lockdown for a month, find themselves moving into stricter restrictions than were imposed before lockdown. This would seem to imply that lockdown was ineffective. Which itself would imply that the stricter Tier system will also be ineffective. Figures show that the previous Tiered system was having an effect on infections, whereas lockdown did not have a proportionately greater effect. So why will 99% of country continue under effective lockdown?
There is also a clear implication that the Tiers will continue until Easter. This will be devastating to lives and businesses in our area – while costing all of us, and future generations, almost £1 billion a day. It’s imperative that businesses are allowed to open – including those in the hospitality and tourism sector which contribute so much to the economy of the West Country. The restrictions have gone a long way towards the destruction of hospitality and tourism (and much else) in the West Country.
4, The NHS pressure argument is dubious. We have seven unused Nightingale hospitals in England (more in the other countries of the union). The excess deaths are barely above the annual average, and there is capacity even in regular hospitals. But even if the NHS does suffer pressure ,this is not unprecedented – and has been the case every winter for year upon year under successive governments of both main parties. But this has never before been regarded as a reason to make it illegal for people to be allowed to take risks with their health.
5, The data showing massive increases in infections/deaths has been shown to be dubious at almost every turn. For the under 60s, there is a 1 in 300,000 chance of death. For the over 60s, there is a 99% survival rate. For the over 80s, it’s still 90%.
6, There is an alternative to hand – based on individual responsibility that we exercise in our own lives anyway. We should allow the vulnerable to isolate and protect themselves, as with any other virus – no-one suffering from ‘flu goes to visit and then embrace elderly relatives.
7, I have very real anxieties about the precedent that’s being set here: of the state arrogating itself the power to impose such stringent measures on its population when the data upon which this is based is chancy and uncertain. Liberty is like innocence, easy to remove and extremely difficult to regain. And a future government with less benign intentions could easily use this precedent to interfere further – and for malign motives.
So, given the economic, social, health, livelihood, business, mental health costs, the unemployment, insolvencies – each of which is a personal tragedy – I could not, in good conscience, vote to compromise lives and destroy livelihoods. I recognise the pressures under which the Government is operating, and applaud many of the mitigation measures that have been implemented thus far. But I felt impelled to vote against a system which poses such an economic and social threat to our part of Somerset.
I do hope this explains my reasoning for my vote last night and my sincere thanks again for getting in touch.
All good wishes,
David
David Warburton MP
I have seven key reservations which I outline below – and led me to vote against the tier system. For the sake of clarity I’ve outlined them below in bullet-point form:
1, First, the regulations fail in their essentials. For government regulations to work (which can only be achieved through public consent), they must be clear, and underpinned by cohesive internal logic. But the rules that have been proposed are contradictory and, in many cases, seem almost arbitrary. From last orders at 10pm but 11pm closing (do we all order four rounds at 10pm, or do venues have to pay staff for an hour with no takings?), to the vaguely defined ‘substantial meal’. From allowing soft drinks all day but alcohol only with food, to an astonishingly labyrinthine and impossibly convoluted ‘bubble’ system, with no obvious sense of cause and effect. From work meetings being allowed in public or private places (only for self-employed), to no one allowed to meet from separate households either outdoors or indoors, unless they’re on a train or travelling.
2, I have been asking (both publicly on social media and in private conversations with Ministers) for the data – a cost benefit analysis – which informed the decisions around the Tier system. Apparently the Cabinet Office had been putting this together all weekend for us, which sadly suggests that the data was not the basis for the proposed rules. The crucial question we have to ask ourselves is what is the cost to lives, to livelihoods, to businesses, to mental health, suicides, to all non-Covid related heath and – of course – the future of the economy of the restrictions, against the likely lives saved from those same restrictions.
The ONS have calculated that there will be / will have been 200,000 excess non-Covid deaths caused by the restrictions. This is nearly four times the number of presumed Covid deaths. Bristol University put the figure at 560,000. While I don’t suggest these figures are anything other than an estimate (given the circumstances and fast-moving picture), they should nonetheless give us pause to question the wisdom of continuing a course of action that has produced them.
3, The regional basis for the tiering is problematic. The apparent incidence of Covid-19 is inflated in areas (like our own) that are affected by nearby towns or cities. And many, having had lockdown for a month, find themselves moving into stricter restrictions than were imposed before lockdown. This would seem to imply that lockdown was ineffective. Which itself would imply that the stricter Tier system will also be ineffective. Figures show that the previous Tiered system was having an effect on infections, whereas lockdown did not have a proportionately greater effect. So why will 99% of country continue under effective lockdown?
There is also a clear implication that the Tiers will continue until Easter. This will be devastating to lives and businesses in our area – while costing all of us, and future generations, almost £1 billion a day. It’s imperative that businesses are allowed to open – including those in the hospitality and tourism sector which contribute so much to the economy of the West Country. The restrictions have gone a long way towards the destruction of hospitality and tourism (and much else) in the West Country.
4, The NHS pressure argument is dubious. We have seven unused Nightingale hospitals in England (more in the other countries of the union). The excess deaths are barely above the annual average, and there is capacity even in regular hospitals. But even if the NHS does suffer pressure ,this is not unprecedented – and has been the case every winter for year upon year under successive governments of both main parties. But this has never before been regarded as a reason to make it illegal for people to be allowed to take risks with their health.
5, The data showing massive increases in infections/deaths has been shown to be dubious at almost every turn. For the under 60s, there is a 1 in 300,000 chance of death. For the over 60s, there is a 99% survival rate. For the over 80s, it’s still 90%.
6, There is an alternative to hand – based on individual responsibility that we exercise in our own lives anyway. We should allow the vulnerable to isolate and protect themselves, as with any other virus – no-one suffering from ‘flu goes to visit and then embrace elderly relatives.
7, I have very real anxieties about the precedent that’s being set here: of the state arrogating itself the power to impose such stringent measures on its population when the data upon which this is based is chancy and uncertain. Liberty is like innocence, easy to remove and extremely difficult to regain. And a future government with less benign intentions could easily use this precedent to interfere further – and for malign motives.
So, given the economic, social, health, livelihood, business, mental health costs, the unemployment, insolvencies – each of which is a personal tragedy – I could not, in good conscience, vote to compromise lives and destroy livelihoods. I recognise the pressures under which the Government is operating, and applaud many of the mitigation measures that have been implemented thus far. But I felt impelled to vote against a system which poses such an economic and social threat to our part of Somerset.
I do hope this explains my reasoning for my vote last night and my sincere thanks again for getting in touch.
All good wishes,
David
David Warburton MP
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