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Merge the three Services

A bit like the . . . wait for it! wait for it! . . . French National Gendarmerie? Where you switch in and out of military and civil police units.

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Not quite, simply using proper police to do policing. Why have 3 seperate military police forces ( 4, with MoD plod) all on different Tacos, all trained seperately/differently, when Civpol could do the job more effectively?
IF, big IF, they need to deploy abroad, the Common Military Syllabus phase 1 basic should suffice?
 

Truxx

LE
Interesting thread. Watching from the sidelines as a Trog and a Stacker illustrate the difficulty in merging Supply and Transport back into the same Corps, let alone the cooks and rest of the RAOC is perhaps illustrative of the problems that would be faced with merging entire Services.

If it’s not possible to reach a consensus view on something as seemingly simple as merging stores and the means to get the stores to the field, something complicated like marching round the square in the same manner is dead in the water :)
Edited for accuracy. But your point is well made. See also wimmin in the teeth arms.

As I said right at the start, the only real way of spending less on defence is to do less defence. Less folks with less capable toys doing fewer things less often and to a lower standard.

That said I think merging the services would be a great way to do all of that, by sleight of hand, in a single hit, particularly the lower standards bit.
 
Not quite, simply using proper police to do policing. Why have 3 seperate military police forces ( 4, with MoD plod) all on different Tacos, all trained seperately/differently, when Civpol could do the job more effectively?
IF, big IF, they need to deploy abroad, the Common Military Syllabus phase 1 basic should suffice?
What you are describing will never happen, unfortunately. Too many vested interests and little patches of turf to protect. I may be wrong, but I think that MOD Plod don't have a true policing role any more - certainly, their CID went years ago. They appear to have further relegated themselves to the role of Site Guard at certain fixed locations within the UK.

Edit - having worked with the National Gendarmerie in the past, I like the way they are configured and do their business.

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D

Deleted 3147

Guest
RN sailing block on River Humber to North of Cranwell for the small amount of time RN Officer Cadets (that's right, we'd lose Midshipman as an RN trainee officer rank too) spend on water

RN adopted Officer Cadets a long time ago. Your post just highlights the flawed assumptions people make when coming up with ridiculous plans such as these.

All sounds great until you scratch below the surface and look at the practicalities.
 
RN adopted Officer Cadets a long time ago. Your post just highlights the flawed assumptions people make when coming up with ridiculous plans such as these.

All sounds great until you scratch below the surface and look at the practicalities.
Interesting, how long ago? They were Midi's 2 years ago.

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Interesting thread. Watching from the sidelines as a Trog and a Stacker illustrate the difficulty in merging Supply and Transport into the same Corps, let alone the cooks and rest of the RAOC is perhaps illustrative of the problems that would be faced with merging entire Services.

If it’s not possible to reach a consensus view on something as seemingly simple as merging stores and the means to get the stores to the field, something complicated like marching round the square in the same manner is dead in the water :)
Where the RLC fucked up (one of the many times) was to try and fuse Trogs and Stackers together, it could have worked quite well with Trog and Stackers regiments being separate.
 
Interesting, how long ago? They were Midi's 2 years ago.

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I was an Officer Cadet back in the last millennium; I would imagine that @A2_Matelot was one in the millennium before that.

A Midshipman is equivalent to a 2nd Lt or Pilot Officer.
 
Interesting, how long ago? They were Midi's 2 years ago.

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In BRNC, the rank is non-substantive and only used in the initial phases of training, after which officers use their substantive rank of Midshipman.


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Sometimes I wonder why there isn’t/wasn’t more effort to at least collocate, if not integrate some functions. For example why was 3 ADTR in Duisburg, when the ammo was in Brecht. The guns were in Dortmund, so 3 ADTR needed to go west to get the ammo, then drive east again past Duisburg, Then most probably further east past Dortmund to where the guns had deployed to. Why not put the truck sqns in either Bracht, or dare I say it, the enormous airfield across the way?

In a similar vein, where’s the nearest RLC unit with trucks to Kineton or Longtown? Perhaps Abingdon for Kineton, but Longtown? Catterick?
 
I wonder if Midshipman has returned then
(Apologies for thread diversion)

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Nope - always been Midshipmen around.
 

Cyberhacker

Old-Salt
it could have worked quite well with Trog and Stackers regiments being separate.

I don't get this argument... why have separate Trog and Stackers regiments when as soon as a notice to deploy comes along, it's a case of task organisation - a bit from here, a bit from there. Why not be a standing "train as you fight" unit, with a unified chain of command?

Why didn't 19 CSS work? There must be more to it than cap-badge turf wars? The US Army's Brigade Support Battalions (comprising of supply, transport, maintenance and medical companies) seem to work well enough

It's the same with armour and infantry battlegroups... why not have a standing combined-arms battalion/regiment, under a common command... again, the US Army manage to keep four combat battalio/squadron identities alive per brigade (plus engineer, artillery and the BSB)
 

Truxx

LE
Where the RLC fucked up (one of the many times) was to try and fuse Trogs and Stackers together, it could have worked quite well with Trog and Stackers regiments being separate.
Actually it was the teeth arms wot dun it.

Much against the advice of the forming corps.

It was not even the answer to the question asked, which was a cry from GW1 loosely translated as "why can't we get our tanks fixed quicker?"

The answer of course was to merge spares supply and equipment support, but that is not what happened.

Expect it soon though.
 

jrwlynch

LE
Book Reviewer
I was an Officer Cadet back in the last millennium; I would imagine that @A2_Matelot was one in the millennium before that.

2008, I was an Officer Cadet; stepping to Acting Sublieutenant after somehow deceiving BRNC into letting me pass, then substantive rank after Fleet Board.
 
Not quite, simply using proper police to do policing. Why have 3 seperate military police forces ( 4, with MoD plod) all on different Tacos, all trained seperately/differently, when Civpol could do the job more effectively?
IF, big IF, they need to deploy abroad, the Common Military Syllabus phase 1 basic should suffice?
A bit like Sponsored Reserve?
 

Guns

ADC
Moderator
Book Reviewer
The Britannia training establishment was closed at the same time. The cadets under instruction were embarked on two cruisers to complete their programme under the old system. The headquarters of the cruisers was established at Bermuda, where suitable arrangements had been made to house the cadets. The cadets entered in September under the old system, and those entered in January 1906 (the last to be so entered), were received at the Royal Naval College, Dartmouth, where they were instructed, as far as possible, side by side with the cadets transferred from Osborne.

— Lord Tweedmouth, First Lord of the Admiralty, 26 February 1906

Been a fair while that Cadets are used.........
 
Yeah it's an Army thing.

Though we also have a whole Int Corps for it....

Though the new career model may mean that Int Corps officers take Int Officer roles at HQs, Signals take Regimental Signal Officer jobs etc etc

Especially if E1/E2/E3 gets scrapped and it's more of a free for all based on KSEB

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All jokes aside, that has potential to be incredibly embarrassing. Does anyone remember the young signals captain who famously answered a straightforward question from a VSO with, "I don't know the answer to that. I'm not a technical officer!"?
 

Alamo

LE
All jokes aside, that has potential to be incredibly embarrassing. Does anyone remember the young signals captain who famously answered a straightforward question from a VSO with, "I don't know the answer to that. I'm not a technical officer!"?
RSigs officers are a bunch of geography teachers ;)
 

Mattb

LE
The Britannia training establishment was closed at the same time. The cadets under instruction were embarked on two cruisers to complete their programme under the old system. The headquarters of the cruisers was established at Bermuda, where suitable arrangements had been made to house the cadets. The cadets entered in September under the old system, and those entered in January 1906 (the last to be so entered), were received at the Royal Naval College, Dartmouth, where they were instructed, as far as possible, side by side with the cadets transferred from Osborne.

— Lord Tweedmouth, First Lord of the Admiralty, 26 February 1906

Been a fair while that Cadets are used.........
In those days, were cadets at Dartmouth not children at a sort of beefed-up Welbeck though?
 
I don't get this argument... why have separate Trog and Stackers regiments when as soon as a notice to deploy comes along, it's a case of task organisation - a bit from here, a bit from there. Why not be a standing "train as you fight" unit, with a unified chain of command?

Why didn't 19 CSS work? There must be more to it than cap-badge turf wars? The US Army's Brigade Support Battalions (comprising of supply, transport, maintenance and medical companies) seem to work well enough

It's the same with armour and infantry battlegroups... why not have a standing combined-arms battalion/regiment, under a common command... again, the US Army manage to keep four combat battalio/squadron identities alive per brigade (plus engineer, artillery and the BSB)
What happened on Herrick 6,8, 12, telic 1 and 11 was trawls were sent out because we (stackers)didnt have enough bods. Being in a mixed unit is shit, you lose training potential from both trades and it a mix match when one Sqn is short, I did trog exercises in 4LSR and telic 11 a trog (and a chef) were trying to do a stackers job, (the trog didnt wear boots just incase he had to count pass ten).
Basically when we deploy the numbers for various needed will rarely be match what you have in mixed regiment.
 

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