MBT in a C130 and A400 payload?

#1
Chaps,

Having a discussion with a friend who says that the C130 can move MBT's and has seen a Chally 2 in the back and that the A400 has less payload than a Herc.

This seems to go against what i knew of the types, please can someone give me an expert opinion?

Thanks
 
#3
He's a bit wrong. C-130 will not accommodate an MBT. The USAF gives the following payloads for the various models of C-130.

Maximum Allowable Payload:
C-130E, 42,000 pounds (19,090 kilograms)
C-130H, 42,000 pounds (19,090 kilograms)
C-130J, 42,000 pounds (19,090 kilograms)
C-130J-30, 44,000 (19,958 kilograms)
Maximum Normal Payload:
C-130E, 36,500 pounds (16,590 kilograms)
C-130H, 36,500 pounds (16,590 kilograms)
C-130J, 34,000 pounds (15,422 kilograms)
C-130J-30, 36,000 pounds (16,329 kilograms)

A400M has a stated max payload of just over 37,000kg.

CR2 weighs somewhere in the order of 62,000kg... So if your mate wants to fit a Chally in the back of either, then good luck to him.

You can get CVR(T) in the back of a Herc - the Rockapes used to do (1980s, IIRC) an airshow demonstration piece where a Herc came in doing something approximating to a Khe Sanh approach, landed and disgorged a number of rocks plus a Scorpion. They then 'seized the airfield' after charging about firing blanks (coupled with some simulated explosions).
 
#5
Your friend needs to do some research. You could not get a CR2 into a Herc let alone get airborne afterwards. You might just get one into an A400M but you will not get airborne. The C-17 will lift an M1 Abrams (about 63 tonnes), so might lift a CR2.
 
#6
A Tracked Rapier used to just fit into a Herc with about two inches clearance all round. However a TR was only about half the size and a fifth of the weight of an MBT....
 
#7
You can get CVR(T) in the back of a Herc - the Rockapes used to do (1980s, IIRC) an airshow demonstration piece where a Herc came in doing something approximating to a Khe Sanh approach, landed and disgorged a number of rocks plus a Scorpion. They then 'seized the airfield' after charging about firing blanks (coupled with some simulated explosions).[/QUOTE]

Do you have a link to the painting they must have commissioned?
 
#9
Chaps,

Having a discussion with a friend who says that the C130 can move MBT's and has seen a Chally 2 in the back and that the A400 has less payload than a Herc.

This seems to go against what i knew of the types, please can someone give me an expert opinion?

Thanks
Your friend is presumably confused between C-17 and C-130. C-17 can move MBTs (although I'm not sure whether it's currently cleared to carry CR2) and has a bigger payload than an A400.

A400 has about twice the payload of a C-130, and C-17 has about twice the payload of an A400.
 
#12
They probably hire out either the big Russia birds or the C17 for the big stuff....Remember that CR2 and the others are 60+ tonne when fully kitted but strip off the armour packs and all the stowed kit and fuel and you can drop the weight down quite a bit.

Just checked - C17 will take 77,000 Kg in the back so easily take a CR2.

S_R
 
#13
Chaps,

Having a discussion with a friend who says that the C130 can move MBT's and has seen a Chally 2 in the back and that the A400 has less payload than a Herc.

This seems to go against what i knew of the types, please can someone give me an expert opinion?

Thanks

Your mate is wrong,

The following platforms(MSP's), with 7 RHA kit rigged for drop will fit in the aircraft with not much clearance either side so you can see a chally 2 having a problem squeezing in

pinz-on-msp.jpg


pinz-on-msp-rear.jpg
 
#17
In my early days as a scruffy crab, the heaviest thing I had to load was an RE Allis Chalmers digger thingy onto one of our brand-new Hercs (it was a lonnng time ago). I don't think the digger was anywhere near the weight of a tank. It was a bloody tight fit and just about maxxed out both on payload and dimensions - the aircraft was on Op Sheepskin bound for Anguilla. The hardest part of loading was inserting a wooden block between the chassis and the arms which held the bucket - took feckin ages to get it in the right position and involved lots of harsh words and contorted limbs. Whichever f**kwit at JATE thought that one up as part of the TDS needed shafting with a pineapple. Sorry for the thread-drift.
 
#18
Your friend needs to do some research. You could not get a CR2 into a Herc let alone get airborne afterwards. You might just get one into an A400M but you will not get airborne. The C-17 will lift an M1 Abrams (about 63 tonnes), so might lift a CR2.
During my time at 5 AB Bde Log Bn they did a couple of these for displays. IIRC it was only landrovers in the back, so not quite ally looking tanks 'n stuff but the main thing I can remember was the ******* awful stench of puke, warm engines and fumes. How I got involved in all that I don't know, I was a clerk ffs!! There must've been some pencils that needed sharpening on the DZ or something.
 
#19
You can get CVR(T) in the back of a Herc - the Rockapes used to do (1980s, IIRC) an airshow demonstration piece where a Herc came in doing something approximating to a Khe Sanh approach, landed and disgorged a number of rocks plus a Scorpion. They then 'seized the airfield' after charging about firing blanks (coupled with some simulated explosions).
I saw this demo at RAF Northolt on an open day back in the 90's, I think. The only difference was it was either one or two stripped down Land Rovers.

I thought the charge down to the earth by the c130 pulling out at the last moment was pretty impressive.
 
#20
You can get 1x CVRT in a C130, loaded last as the WMIK etc goes on first. in the event of a non start the CVRT gets pushed of by the WMIK, hence double spare tyres fitted during TALO, RAL, FALs. at the time this use to be a well practised routine for the RAF Regt, (before the slaggings) "defend or retake any airfields". Rad in to that possible autobahns for Harrier Ops.

5AB HCR then also did quite a few with Gurka support, 2x mock ups IIRC on the parade square at Aldershot.

During a certain Op, RAF Regt Sqn tasked to retake an airfield, supporting them. Rehersed, practised, reccie etc, only foreign country denies A/F by parking airline coaches set distant apart.

During loading of C130, 1 inch clearance is needed but when item is secured 3 inches must be obtained. Largest items moved in a C130, tracked rapier, Lynx, LRIC!!!!, 40 ft ISO, sub telescope etc etc, size does not always equate weight.

A400 lots of work going on but will certainly be a stop gap between C130 and C17 and a great bit of kit.

C17, will take a MBT, lots of room but weight maxed, or 1x Ch47, 1x Merlin, Sea king, 3x Appache.

As an impartial observer of this site interesting to see first C17 in to Mali had both RAF Movers on and RAF Regt, Its a pity Bastion and Brize terminal is front of house as its an eye opener to actually see just what else goes on, where and with whom.
 

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