Martin Samuel Being Senstive again

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by RABC, Aug 21, 2009.

Welcome to the Army Rumour Service, ARRSE

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial military website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Link

    So lets slap a D notice on all casualty news then !!

    What a prat
  2. See that the editor decided on a "grief" shot.

    Must be destressing (IMHO) for the families of the deceased, that "their" greatest moments of sadness, will be used as stock imagery for the foreseeable future.
  3. At risk of being lumped in with Samuel, I think (to an extent) he has a point. Leave aside the tabloid nature of the column, with its unnecessary grief-porn, and there is a valuable debate to be had.

    We can hardly expect the public not to think there might be a danger of us descending to mawkishness when we've had the same debate on this site (see Wootton Bassett....all a bit Princess Di? thread).

    Similarly, the danger of airing our concerns in public has been questioned right from the House of Lords with Foulkes accusing Dannatt of 'giving succour' to the Taliban to Duffdike's spirited,if wrong, defence of his line on the 1WG officer.

    Given the Islamists' command of media ops, it is a battle we must consider. Where is the line between understandable grief (and we've all had dust in our eyes at some stage) and making the situation worse?
  4. Biped

    Biped LE Book Reviewer

    He's placed the families in the same categories as 'grief whores'.

    What sort of a cnut is this bloke?
  5. The cnut who ate all the pies by the look of him.
  6. I think it was Ho Chi Minh that said that the Americans had no stomach for a sustained war because the American people would not accept seeing the flag draped coffins of their fallen coming in day after day from a war in a foreign land that had nothing to do with them. He was right and it was the change in the public mood that caused the end of the war.
    I wonder how much longer the public mood in this country will sustain support for our continued presence in Afghanistan. A public that sees the continuing grief of families and identify themselves with that grief will not maintain support, they will demand withdrawal, especially in the light of the presence there being under-equipped.
    The US however, will probably remain buoyed up by the shame of those who remember how US Troops were treated on their return from Vietnam and the fact that, for them, this is very much a reply to a direct attack on their soil that can be traced back to Al Qaeda operating from Afghani bases.
  7. Biped

    Biped LE Book Reviewer

    When the flag-draped coffins actually mean something worthwhile, then the people will bear the cost.

    The public ask the questions, and they expect an answer.

    What is Vietnam about? Stopping the Communists taking over Vietnam.
    What are our aims? Stop the Communists.
    What will we gain? Nothing. A pointless, worthless country won't side with Russia.
    How long did it take? fooking ages - far too long.
    Did it work? No, arrses handed to them on a plate.
    Was it popular? No, very, very unpopular.


    What is Afghan about? Something to do with stopping terrorism.
    What are our aims? We're not really sure, except to hold Afghanistan.
    What will we gain? Nothing. Terrorists come from all over the place.
    How long will it take? fooking ages - far too long.
    Will it work? No.
    Was it popular? No, very, very unpopular.

    That sort of situational awareness as far as the UK public is concerned does not bode well after a dose of:

    What's this Iraq about? Saddam is going to end the world with WMDs.
    What are our aims? Regime change, better for the Iraqi people, and the world wil be a safer place.
    What will we gain? Fcuk all, it's all lies anyway.
    How long did it take? fooking ages - far too long.
    Did it work? No. Bombs still going off, but Saddam's dead, so George is happy.
    Was it popular? No, very, very unpopular.


    Contrast and compare:

    What's the Falklands about? Stopping the Argies take UK turf.
    What are our aims: Throw them out, free the grateful people.
    What will we gain: Prestige, British citizens protected far away. There's lots of oil and gas in the surrounding waters.
    How long did it take: In, smashed them out of the court, back home to tea, biscuits and medals.
    Did it work: Yep.
    Was it popular? Very, very popular.