LS & GC

#1
Can anybody shed any light for me.

Enlisted sep 71, Discharged Jan 87. Never received the LS & GC, had a very short spell out of Army, around 80 days to be precise. reenlisted and my red book shows 15 years 150 days, Military conduct Exemplary.

am I entitled to the LS & GC then ???? :twisted:
 
#2
Nope.

When we were in it was 18 years undetected crime before you got it.

Probably why you never got one.


*now awaits qouting of actuall rules and regs from someone whou actually knows what they are talking about. :)
 

oldbaldy

LE
Moderator
#3
Steven said:
Nope.

When we were in it was 18 years undetected crime before you got it.

Probably why you never got one.


*now awaits qouting of actuall rules and regs from someone whou actually knows what they are talking about. :)
A little bit out:
Prior to 1 December 1977, 18 years service was required for consideration for the LS&GCM.
MOD linky
 
#4
Thanks for that, shame they cannot backdate it, ie if you enlisted prior to 1977 but continued to serve after that but did not complete 18 yrs you could still be eligble.

Never mind worth a try
 
#5
I think it was retrospective when they changed from 18 to 15 years. So service prior to 1977 did count towards the revised 15 years qualification.

LS&GC is not an automatic 'time served' entitlment however and I know more than one ex-regular with Exemplary in his discharge book who still did not get it due to a regimental entry when he was a young private.

You can ask the medals office for guidance, but I have not heard of a case of the LS&GC being awarded 20 years after discharge. But all it costs is the price of a stamp:

Service Personnel and Veterans Agency
(Joint Personnel Administration Centre)
Ministry Of Defence Medal Office
Building 250
Royal Air Force Innsworth
Gloucester
GL3 1HW

Or you can try the helpline:

JPAC Enquiry Centre:
Tel: 0141 224 3600
Veterans Freephone: 0800 085 3600

http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/DefenceFor/Veterans/Medals/ContactingTheMedalOffice.htm
 
#6
oldbaldy said:
Steven said:
Nope.

When we were in it was 18 years undetected crime before you got it.

Probably why you never got one.


*now awaits qouting of actuall rules and regs from someone whou actually knows what they are talking about. :)
A little bit out:
Prior to 1 December 1977, 18 years service was required for consideration for the LS&GCM.
MOD linky
See knew I would get it wrongish.

Still if he did 6 years before and 10 years after then he didn't qualify on both counts. :lol:
 
#7
Steven said:
Still if he did 6 years before and 10 years after then he didn't qualify on both counts. :lol:
How does 15 years 150 days not qualify for 15 years total in 1987, when service both before and after 1977 counts?

The entitlement may have changed but you only needed to have served 15 continuous years when he became eligible (provided he had a clean regimental conduct sheet that is)

Same as his reckonable service prior to and after 1975 counts towards his preserved pension years under AFPS 75 which he does not recieve till he is 60 (If he remembers to ask for it)

Mine certainly did on both counts.
 
#9
It doesn't need to be unbroken for LS&GC just total, regular reckonable service from age 17.5 - QRs:

Long Service and Good Conduct Medal (Military)
5.393. The Personnel Records Division of Personnel, Pay and Pensions Administration is to notify units of the names
of those soldiers who are eligible by length of service to be considered for the award of the Long Service and Good
Conduct Medal (Military) (LS&GC(M)), together with particulars of any regimental entries incurred during previous
engagements. (For officers refer to para 10.010.) When the soldier has actually completed 15 years reckonable service
the commanding officer, who at this stage is the sole judge of the requisite standard of conduct, is to decide whether or
not to initiate a recommendation. In addition, Personnel Records Division is to notify commanding officers of all
soldiers who are within their last six months of service and are not holders of the Long Service and Good Conduct
Medal. Commanding officers are then to take action in accordance with paras 5.394 or 5.395. Recommendations are to
be treated in confidence and are not to be divulged to candidates. Qualifying service may consist of:
PT. 10 HONOURS AND AWARDS 5.391
QR(Army) 5/10-43 Amdt
a. Regular Army service of a soldier from 17½ years of age.
b. Mobilised or embodied service in any Militia or Territorial Force of the Empire, or Colour service in any
permanent military force of the Commonwealth which has not qualified for the award of any other long service
or efficiency award, provided the soldier is serving on a normal Regular Army engagement at the time of
recommendation for the medal or clasp.
c. Previous service in the Royal Navy, Royal Marines or Royal Air Force, if declared on attestation, provided that
during such service the character and conduct of the individual were of such a standard as to qualify for the
Long Service and Good Conduct Medal under the regulations which obtain in the Royal Navy, Royal Marines
and Royal Air Force, respectively.
5.394. Non recommendation. If the commanding officer decides he will not submit a recommendation, he is to
complete and retain as a confidential document an AF B 176A and forward a copy, along with a certified true copy of
the regimental conduct sheet, direct to the appropriate Capbadge Section within the Regular Record of Service Wing of
Personnel Records Division at the Army Personnel Centre for an entry in the soldier's record of service as `LSGCM
NOT RECOMMENDED (Date)'. The non-recommendation and certified true copy of the regimental conduct sheet will
be forwarded to the Army Medal Office, by the Army Personnel Centre for information and retention.
5.395. Recommendation. Only those soldiers who are in every way worthy of the distinction and whose conduct has
been irreproachable throughout their service should be recommended. The standard of `Irreproachable', which is higher
than the minimum standard required for a grading of `Exemplary' defined in paras 9.448 to 9.459, will normally be a
regimental conduct sheet completely clear of any disciplinary entry. In exceptional and really deserving cases, however,
a recommendation for the award of the medal may be submitted if in the opinion of the commanding officer the
offences recorded on the soldier's conduct sheets are trivial or of a technical nature where there is no evidence of
deliberate misconduct. All such cases are referred to a selection board and are invariably to be supported by a statement
by the commanding officer giving the reason why it is considered that the normal qualification should be set aside and,
to assist the selection board in deciding whether, or to what extent, an offence may be condoned, by a further statement
giving full details of the circumstances in which each offence entered on the regimental conduct sheets was committed.
Any mitigating feature should be stated and included in either of the above statements.
5.396. Submission. Recommendations for the medal or clasp are to be submitted to the appropriate Capbadge Section
within the Regular Record of Service Wing of Personnel Records Division on AFB 176 (Revised)(original only)
together with photostat copies of Afs B 120 and 121 and, if applicable, the statements called for in para 5.395. When an
AFB 120 or 121 is devoid of disciplinary entries the undermentioned certificate, signed and dated personally by the
commanding officer, should be included in lieu of the photostat copies:
`I have personally scrutinised the AF B 120 or 121 of No ______
Rank ___Name __________ and certify that there are no disciplinary entries recorded’.


Would be worth a call to JPAC in this case - only problem is who will recommend you for the medal - hopefully JPAC will be able to help on this one as well.

Good luck

PW
 
#11
paywog said:
It doesn't need to be unbroken for LS&GC just total, regular reckonable service from age 17.5 - QRs:

Long Service and Good Conduct Medal (Military)
5.393. The Personnel Records Division of Personnel, Pay and Pensions Administration is to notify units of the names
of those soldiers who are eligible by length of service to be considered for the award of the Long Service and Good
Conduct Medal (Military) (LS&GC(M)), together with particulars of any regimental entries incurred during previous
engagements. (For officers refer to para 10.010.) When the soldier has actually completed 15 years reckonable service
the commanding officer, who at this stage is the sole judge of the requisite standard of conduct, is to decide whether or
not to initiate a recommendation. In addition, Personnel Records Division is to notify commanding officers of all
soldiers who are within their last six months of service and are not holders of the Long Service and Good Conduct
Medal. Commanding officers are then to take action in accordance with paras 5.394 or 5.395. Recommendations are to
be treated in confidence and are not to be divulged to candidates. Qualifying service may consist of:
PT. 10 HONOURS AND AWARDS 5.391
QR(Army) 5/10-43 Amdt
a. Regular Army service of a soldier from 17½ years of age.
b. Mobilised or embodied service in any Militia or Territorial Force of the Empire, or Colour service in any
permanent military force of the Commonwealth which has not qualified for the award of any other long service
or efficiency award, provided the soldier is serving on a normal Regular Army engagement at the time of
recommendation for the medal or clasp.
c. Previous service in the Royal Navy, Royal Marines or Royal Air Force, if declared on attestation, provided that
during such service the character and conduct of the individual were of such a standard as to qualify for the
Long Service and Good Conduct Medal under the regulations which obtain in the Royal Navy, Royal Marines
and Royal Air Force, respectively.
5.394. Non recommendation. If the commanding officer decides he will not submit a recommendation, he is to
complete and retain as a confidential document an AF B 176A and forward a copy, along with a certified true copy of
the regimental conduct sheet, direct to the appropriate Capbadge Section within the Regular Record of Service Wing of
Personnel Records Division at the Army Personnel Centre for an entry in the soldier's record of service as `LSGCM
NOT RECOMMENDED (Date)'. The non-recommendation and certified true copy of the regimental conduct sheet will
be forwarded to the Army Medal Office, by the Army Personnel Centre for information and retention.
5.395. Recommendation. Only those soldiers who are in every way worthy of the distinction and whose conduct has
been irreproachable throughout their service should be recommended. The standard of `Irreproachable', which is higher
than the minimum standard required for a grading of `Exemplary' defined in paras 9.448 to 9.459, will normally be a
regimental conduct sheet completely clear of any disciplinary entry. In exceptional and really deserving cases, however,
a recommendation for the award of the medal may be submitted if in the opinion of the commanding officer the
offences recorded on the soldier's conduct sheets are trivial or of a technical nature where there is no evidence of
deliberate misconduct. All such cases are referred to a selection board and are invariably to be supported by a statement
by the commanding officer giving the reason why it is considered that the normal qualification should be set aside and,
to assist the selection board in deciding whether, or to what extent, an offence may be condoned, by a further statement
giving full details of the circumstances in which each offence entered on the regimental conduct sheets was committed.
Any mitigating feature should be stated and included in either of the above statements.
5.396. Submission. Recommendations for the medal or clasp are to be submitted to the appropriate Capbadge Section
within the Regular Record of Service Wing of Personnel Records Division on AFB 176 (Revised)(original only)
together with photostat copies of Afs B 120 and 121 and, if applicable, the statements called for in para 5.395. When an
AFB 120 or 121 is devoid of disciplinary entries the undermentioned certificate, signed and dated personally by the
commanding officer, should be included in lieu of the photostat copies:
`I have personally scrutinised the AF B 120 or 121 of No ______
Rank ___Name __________ and certify that there are no disciplinary entries recorded’.


Would be worth a call to JPAC in this case - only problem is who will recommend you for the medal - hopefully JPAC will be able to help on this one as well.

Good luck

PW
Wouldn't Glasgow apply for you, or you could try the Veterans Agency.
 

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