Army Rumour Service

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

London's burning

Grownup_Rafbrat

LE
Book Reviewer
City of London Freemasonary is paying for two massive ALP's.
With a JCB to clear all the illegally parked vehicles away from the building so it can get near enough?
 
Inspection can't help with poor design, too late at that stage. Construction defects will be covered over and out of sight, and the Grenfell inquiry has already shown nobody has much idea about materials.
I live in a 7 floor apartment block. Merseyside FRS were very proactive in inspection of our block and demanding alterations - including some additions to ‘out of sight’ construction (additional ‘walls’ in roof spaces) and the deletion of a fire door for some reason.
 

Grownup_Rafbrat

LE
Book Reviewer
I live in a 7 floor apartment block. Merseyside FRS were very proactive in inspection of our block and demanding alterations - including some additions to ‘out of sight’ construction (additional ‘walls’ in roof spaces) and the deletion of a fire door for some reason.
Offspring has many tales of building designs submitted by architects where lifts would have to zigzag because the doors are in different places on each floor, services such as gas and electricity are 'forgotten ' or worse not provided with adequate housing, ventilation or inspection access, walls and doors aren't adequately fire rated....

Customers get upset when Fire Engineers demand the drawings be altered to comply with regulations and common sense, like it's THEIR fault.
 

Chef

LE
Offspring has many tales of building designs submitted by architects where lifts would have to zigzag because the doors are in different places on each floor, services such as gas and electricity are 'forgotten ' or worse not provided with adequate housing, ventilation or inspection access, walls and doors aren't adequately fire rated....

Customers get upset when Fire Engineers demand the drawings be altered to comply with regulations and common sense, like it's THEIR fault.
Easy peasy lemon squeezy;

 
With a JCB to clear all the illegally parked vehicles away from the building so it can get near enough?
Unknown.jpeg
 

Themanwho

LE
Book Reviewer
Fair enough. But it makes a very good visual metaphor and sums up the disdain shown to MP’s of all parties.
I have to disagree with you there. My idea of a good metaphor - visual or otherwise - is one that's not based on a lie.

I will agree that this lie does indicate the level of disdain shown to MPs of all Parties, by some people.
 
Fair enough. But it makes a very good visual metaphor and sums up the disdain shown to MP’s of all parties.

Sorry but that is like showing a picture of the river Mersey at high tide 5 years ago, then at low tide today and then using it to refute rising sea levels caused by global warming.

Fallacious pictures that have been refuted prove nothing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Yokel

LE
It was the Grenfall fire more than anything that prompted me to start a thread in the Science forum asking about emergency services and other non military use of unmanned systems. The Royal Marines have been experimenting with a small robot that can go inside buildings, climb stairs, and beam back TV pictures.

Equipped with a thermal imaging camera, could it be used to locate survivors?

Could unmanned vehicles be used move pumps and other equipment instead of relying on the muscle powers of firefighters.
 
Last edited:
Sorry but that is like showing a picture of the river Mersey at high tide 5 years ago, then at low tide today and then using it to refute rising sea levels caused by global warming.

Fallacious pictures that have been refuted prove nothing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Kindly address your complaint to the creator of the image.
Thank you.
 
On a different topic, since the Grenville fire have the Fire Brigades had access to any specialist equipment for fighting fires in high rise buildings or rescuing people from them?

What about extinguishing catastrophic cascading fires, such as cladding catching alight?
Some equipment changes have happened, as has been mentioned by other posters, there has been more procurement of higher reach vehicles such as aerial ladder platforms and turntable ladders, and as has also been mentioned previously, they’re not magic bullets and are still subject to limitations.
Some other innovations are things like escape hoods, basically a respirator that can be taken in by breathing apparatus crews to aid with evacuating residents through smoke logged compartments. Smoke curtains are another: A portable collapsible curtain which can be fitted over doorways to inhibit smoke travel. These are some of the equipment developments resulting from Grenfell.
The point remains though that all the intervention equipment out there is no substitute for structurally sound buildings with integrated prevention measures, underscored by robust, workable legislation and inspection regimes.
 
It was the Grenfall fire more than anything that prompted me to start a thread in the Science forum asking about emergency services and other non military use of unmanned systems. The Royal Marines have been experimenting with a small robot that can go inside buildings, climb stairs, and beam back TV pictures.

Equipped with a thermal imaging camera, could it be used to locate survivors?

Could unmanned vehicles be used move pumps and other equipment instead of relying on the muscle powers of firefighters.
Drones are much used at the minute. The ones I’ve seen have thermal imaging capability as well as conventional cameras. Technology is evolving all the time. We used to tackle wild fires using structural fire fighting PPE and hand beaters, whilst this still happens, dedicated PPE, specialist tracked vehicles and helicopters are now commonly seen. The same with floods. Not too long ago, attending a flood would be done in structural fire fighting PPE and even crews making makeshift rafts was not unheard of. Attending flooding invariably meant getting wet to the skin and taking risks that were foreseeable and avoidable, also different services didn’t collaborate much. Now you’ll see specialist flood PPE, inflatable walkways, rescue boats and assets designated as national for mutual support, which can be deployed throughout the country. Despite this latter point, FRS’s in England have no statutory duty to attend flooding, the other UK countries do.
 
Last edited:

Cutaway

LE
Kit Reviewer
The point remains though that all the intervention equipment out there is no substitute for structurally sound buildings with integrated prevention measures, underscored by robust, workable legislation and inspection regimes.
Unless there's some easy bucks to be made.
 

HSF

LE
It was the Grenfall fire more than anything that prompted me to start a thread in the Science forum asking about emergency services and other non military use of unmanned systems. The Royal Marines have been experimenting with a small robot that can go inside buildings, climb stairs, and beam back TV pictures.

Equipped with a thermal imaging camera, could it be used to locate survivors?

Could unmanned vehicles be used move pumps and other equipment instead of relying on the muscle powers of firefighters.

Drones are much used at the minute. The ones I’ve seen have thermal imaging capability as well as conventional cameras. Technology is evolving all the time. We used to tackle wild fires using structural fire fighting PPE and hand beaters, whilst this still happens, dedicated PPE, specialist tracked vehicles and helicopters are now commonly seen. The same with floods. Not too long ago, attending a flood would be done in structural fire fighting PPE and even crews making makeshift rafts was not unheard of. Attending flooding invariably meant getting wet to the skin and taking risks that were foreseeable and avoidable, also different services didn’t collaborate much. Now you’ll see specialist flood PPE, inflatable walkways, rescue boats and assets designated as national for mutual support, which can be deployed throughout the country. Despite this latter point, FRS’s in England have no statutory duty to attend flooding, the other UK countries do.
Poss Tokyo FD? has /had some sort of FF robot?.Not googled it yetbit busy in lodckdown
 
I wonder how much more will come to light as the layers are peeled back?
Grenfell cladding email: Keep poor test 'confidential'

From the article:

The inquiry has already heard that when cladding panels produced by Arconic were shaped into boxes or "cassettes" they became far more likely to burn.
In a test in 2004 they had been rated E on a scale from A1 to F, where F is worst.
The 2010 email was sent in response to discussions with a client in Spain, who had raised concerns about using the most flammable version of the cladding because Spain required a minimum class B.
Mr Schmidt told the inquiry earlier that lower fire safety restrictions in the UK encouraged sales of the most flammable version of the company's product, made from polyethylene, plastic, or PE as it was known in the industry.
He said other countries had gradually restricted sales of cladding made from polyethylene or PE, which burns easily. He believed Kazakhstan had banned it.
Despite that, the UK remained a "PE market", he said.
 

Latest Threads

Top