London's burning

One of the root causes may well centre on the purpose of compartmentalisation.

A building designer may describe it as providing a 30 minute window (from the start of the fire) to enable the safe evacuation of the building. The LFB seem to have treated it as a justification to keep occupants out of their way while they dealt with what they initially perceived to be a small, easily-handled fire.
Building designers don't get to decide the purpose of compartmentalisation, it's clearly defined in the building regs. And LFB did exactly the right thing in keeping occupants out of their way - evacuation shouldn't even have been a consideration until the compartment had been breached, which wasn't apparent until the initial fire had already been dealt with.
 
Would I be right in assuming the focus is now on everything people think the Fire Brigade did wrong and that questions such as Was Compartmentalisation in any way compromised because
Residents stacked rubbish in communal areas or because a number of doors were inexplicably of a much (cheaper) inferior design to that mandated by the building regs and indeed fitted and replaced by the council will be carefully ignored lest it be determined the actions of some residents contributed to the disaster.
 
Would I be right in assuming the focus is now on everything people think the Fire Brigade did wrong and that questions such as Was Compartmentalisation in any way compromised because
Residents stacked rubbish in communal areas or because a number of doors were inexplicably of a much (cheaper) inferior design to that mandated by the building regs and indeed fitted and replaced by the council will be carefully ignored lest it be determined the actions of some residents contributed to the disaster.
At times It does come across as a bit of a witch hunt against the LFB, and of course the press love this sort of thing. I would hope the inquiry see the big picture, but I'd be surprised if the boring bits about building design and construction get as much attention.
 
The interesting part will be into the people responsible for the failure of governance, their connections to each other and their connection to the contractors. This was a top down feck up without doubt.
 
And the latest fraudster is convicted...

A man who claimed his sister and nephew died in the Grenfell Tower fire to secure accommodation and more than £40,000 has been convicted of fraud.

Abolaji Onafuye, 54, from Hammersmith, west London, claimed the cash after telling volunteers he was related to two real victims of the fire.

He was put up in a hotel for nearly a year before being moved to a flat.

Onafuye denied fraud, but was convicted at Isleworth Crown Court of two counts of frauds by false representation.
I note the amount he scammed has increased by more than 20% since first reported.
 

seaweed

LE
Book Reviewer
RIP
Onafuye is of course a misprint for Smith.
 
The interesting part will be into the people responsible for the failure of governance, their connections to each other and their connection to the contractors. This was a top down feck up without doubt.
Just heard on Radio news, stage 2 of the inquiry - including the questions about the building itself - delayed until the end of next year i.e. 2019. Can't see how this is helpful at all.
 
Just heard on Radio news, stage 2 of the inquiry - including the questions about the building itself - delayed until the end of next year i.e. 2019. Can't see how this is helpful at all.
The good news is the police criminal enquiry is continuing.
 
News didn't give any detail, but that's good point. So we have Inquest adjourned for the Inquiry, Inquiry adjourned for the police investigation. Have I missed anything?
Perhaps they're deferring until the "witnesses" have finished their custodial sentences and are settled in their new homes.
 

Cutaway

LE
Kit Reviewer
Perhaps they're deferring until the "witnesses" have finished their custodial sentences and are settled in their new homes.
Real homes or those they hallucinate about ?
 

MrMemory

War Hero
Grenfell Fraud Totals latest - The Dirty Dozen!

The latest additions to the Grenfell compo party brings the total to 12 specimens up for fraud including the most ambitious to date, Sharife Elouahbi who as someone claiming all his family died in the blaze managed to wangle £300 per week for food just for himself! He was only flagged up when someone had the temerity to suggest that a man with 28 previous convictions for 54 offences including robbery, assault and handling stolen goods might not be of the highest character.



Latest Total £619,831.35


Sharife Elouahbi - £103,000
Koffi Kouakou - £30,000
Abdelkarim Rekaya-£88,183.70
Yonatan Eyob-£86,831.56
Elaine Douglas-£67,125.35
Jenny McDonagh-£62,000
Tommy Brooks-£58,396.89
Antonio Gouveia-£53,456.76
Derrick Peters-£38,784
Joyce Msokeri-£19,000
An Nguyen-£11,270
Mohammad Ali Gamoota-£1,784

Biggest Grenfell Tower fraudster faces years more behind bars after lying to get £103,000 benefits | Daily Mail Online
Latest stats in:

Sinners to date = 14
Cash scammed = £659831.35

New members:
Abolaji Onafuye £35000
Mohammed Syed Rinku £5000
(Rinku is also an illegal immigrant)
 

Arkanstigger

War Hero
Perhaps they're deferring until the "witnesses" have finished their custodial sentences and are settled in their new homes.
Can't vouch for the veracity of this, but an aquaintace with a Civil Engineering background told me the police enquiry will involve 300 different companies, which sounds like a lot of sub-sub-sub-contractors pointing at their sub-contractors when it comes to responsibilty.
 
Can't vouch for the veracity of this, but an aquaintace with a Civil Engineering background told me the police enquiry will involve 300 different companies, which sounds like a lot of sub-sub-sub-contractors pointing at their sub-contractors when it comes to responsibilty.
Good move then to adjourn the inquiry and let someone else sort that out!
 
Then add in investigative and prosecution / defence costs!
And incarceration at £30k per scrote per year.
And I'll wager my left nut not one of them is deported within a year of "finishing" their sentence.

Me? I'd hang the f**kers.
 
Can't vouch for the veracity of this, but an aquaintace with a Civil Engineering background told me the police enquiry will involve 300 different companies, which sounds like a lot of sub-sub-sub-contractors pointing at their sub-contractors when it comes to responsibilty.
I suppose it depends on how deep they want to go - there's quite a lot of manufacturing processes. Take just the windows, for example. One company makes the glass, another provides the coatings, another forms the double-glazed units using sealants from perhaps two other companies. A company provides the extrusions which are painted by a different company and assembled by another company using components provided by maybe half a dozen other companies. The frames are fitted by a company which may have labour supplied by two or three companies. The waterproofing membrane will have been supplied by a further company, glued using an adhesive made by another company onto the insulation supplied by yet another, perhaps installed by a different company using sub-contract labour using materials made by a further two or three companies. All designed perhaps by a further company, underwritten by another and the installation managed by yet another. Then it could have been checked by another company.

A lot of these processes might at first glance seem to be irrelevant to a fire hazard but joining two inert materials might make an ert material. The wrong sealants in a double-glazed unit might reduce its fire resistance. Fitting a double-glazed unit the wrong way round can cause it to burst on a sunny day, the same applies if the unit manufacturer puts the glass sheets the wrong way round - just because of the barely visible coatings (which few people actually bother to check). Simple mistakes can have a disproportionate effect.
 
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