Kennedy fights back over soft on crime claim

#1
One for PTP :D

Charles Kennedy was plunged into a "soft on crime" controversy yesterday after indicating that women shoplifters would not face jail under the Liberal Democrats.

Launching the party's law and order mini-manifesto, Mr Kennedy indicated that with so many people re-offending after jail sentences, prison did not work for many criminals.

"Prison is necessary, but when 60 per cent of offenders come out of prison just to commit more crime, we say prison must be made to work," he said.

Mr Kennedy proposed more education for prisoners, including teaching them a trade where possible.

Asked about which sort of categories of crime might not involve a prison sentence under a Liberal Democrat government, he replied: "Take the instance of women in prison for shoplifting offences."

Mr Kennedy asked "what is achieved by such a set of circumstances?

"We have women behind bars, separated in many cases from children - that is not good for the family unit.

"Would it be better if that person was rehabilitated in the community rather than being incarcerated?"

The statement was immediately seized on by the Tories as proof that the Liberal Democrats were soft on crime.

David Davis, the shadow home secretary, said: "This is a reinforcement of what we already know about the Liberal Democrats. "After all, they already believe that first-time burglars of either sex should not go to jail."

However, the Liberal Democrats, under Mark Oaten, the crime spokesman, have sought to develop the idea of "tough liberalism" to show the party can be trusted to tackle crime.

Unveiling the law and order package, the Liberal Democrats proposed a "tough, disciplined" but effective approach to fighting crime, including promising "payback" for victims of crime.

At the heart of the agenda is the provision of extra 10,000 police officers, with much of the £1.2 billion cost coming from ditching Labour's plans for identity cards.

But attention yesterday focused on the Liberal Democrats' plans to send fewer criminals to prison. Experience indicated that making offenders pay back to victims and communities affected by crimes was more effective.

Mr Kennedy yesterday defended the plans by saying that Labour's current approach was failing.

"Despite all the rhetoric, Labour's approach to crime has failed. It has fed rather than diminished the climate of fear," he said.

With a swipe at both Tony Blair and Michael Howard, he added: "The real liberal approach to law and order issues can be tough without descending into populist illiberalism.

"That is the real alternative at this election: visible policing, payback for victims, punishment and rehabilitation for prisoners. Effective solutions on law and order that work."
Kennedy on crime
 
#2
Hw many comments have been taken out of context in that piece 8O

I appreciate David Davis is doing his job as a Polly , and of course it takes some heat off the boy Flight.

The main thrust of Charlie Krankies' proposal, is we don't imprison women with kids, i.e. Mum gets lifted, kids into care,dramas, more expense incurred, all for a 50 quid skirt etc.

The arguments about first time burglars revolves around "prison corrupts"

Get a first time burglar, bang him up, you're effectively sending him to Crims university. He gets out, and graduates to something else.

There was a discussion between some of us some time ago about 'Secure training centres" ie . somewhere where first time or light offenders would be forced to attend to damn well learn something of benefit to society. The basic idea is you are educated in a fairly hard regime and come out, with a qualification recognised by employers and a clean sheet. Re-offend after that , and the book got thrown at you.

Oh you'd be fitter too. Not sure how far the proposal meant to go, but I liked the idea of MCTC with workshops :twisted:
 
#3
PartTimePongo said:
Hw many comments have been taken out of context in that piece 8O

I appreciate David Davis is doing his job as a Polly , and of course it takes some heat off the boy Flight.

The main thrust of Charlie Krankies' proposal, is we don't imprison women with kids, i.e. Mum gets lifted, kids into care,dramas, more expense incurred, all for a 50 quid skirt etc.

The arguments about first time burglars revolves around "prison corrupts"

Get a first time burglar, bang him up, you're effectively sending him to Crims university. He gets out, and graduates to something else.

There was a discussion between some of us some time ago about 'Secure training centres" ie . somewhere where first time or light offenders would be forced to attend to damn well learn something of benefit to society. The basic idea is you are educated in a fairly hard regime and come out, with a qualification recognised by employers and a clean sheet. Re-offend after that , and the book got thrown at you.

Oh you'd be fitter too. Not sure how far the proposal meant to go, but I liked the idea of MCTC with workshops :twisted:
See thats thr thing PTP, an institution like the one you describe would be wholy desireable and would undoubtedly get the backing of the vast majority of the country, the only problem with it is that it has been done before, its known as prison :twisted:

Unfortunately the PC brigade have transformed prison from a punishment/detterent into a holiday camp/University of crime for todays crims. :roll:
 

luke

War Hero
#4
A pretty biased piece from the Torygraph

I don't agree with the Ginge on a lot of his crime proposals, but prison as it stands is not working, and banging up offenders such as drug addicts is not helping.
 
#5
We have the highest crime rate in the developed world and the most lenient penal code.

Well fc*k me! My dog can work out the correlation on that one.

Prison DOES work if the sentence is severe enough to act as a deterrent. A two year MINIMUM mandatory jail term (with time added for bad behavior) for burglary would cut it to a fraction of the present rate.

Lock the scum up I say
 
#6
sandy_boots said:
We have the highest crime rate in the developed world and the most lenient penal code.

Well fc*k me! My dog can work out the correlation on that one.

Prison DOES work if the sentence is severe enough to act as a deterrent. A two year MINIMUM mandatory jail term (with time added for bad behavior) for burglary would cut it to a fraction of the present rate.

Lock the scum up I say
Lock the scum up? Far too soft, let them out each day for at least 12 hours on a healthy fresh air safari holiday known as the chain gang. get em cleaning up canals, rubbish strewn road verges etc, keeps the place tidy, costs fcuk all and if one of them tries to do a runer and gets dragged under a truck...the rest follow!
 
#7
Agree with sandy – says it very well. The drinking gwar has no real idea – you cannot say it is fair and justified to not send a woman to prison because she has a child. Imprisonment is not about saving money it is about punishment and rehabilitation. That is just woolly thinking, to steal a pollie term. Besides why is a scotish MP in parliament anyway, bloody porridge wogs :twisted:
 
#9
jonwilly said:
"MCTC with workshops"
yes and plenty of physical training, would work wonders.
john
Probably make them fitter than the coppers trying to catch thenm the next time! :wink:
 

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