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JPA - specific feedback of faults - Computing.co.uk

Legs

ADC
Book Reviewer
#21
MikeJenvey said:
I won't paste all the replies from the thread on PPRuNe, but this is my latest post from there:

Anyway, spoke with Sarah this morning, the plot thickens....... shall we say the "opposition" might be getting worried!! Sarah says big thanks for all the contributions so far (she is aware of the "gagging" DIN), & reiterates that anything sent direct to her is in complete confidence - more inputs welcome via PM to me (cut 'n paste of message text only, no screen-name, etc) or email directly to her:


Sarah.Arnott@incisivemedia.com


Probably at least one more week timescale for feedback (maybe more), so please keep the horror stories rolling in. Not quite enough for a book yet, but not far off it!!

However, this load of twaddle HAS to be included, just to show the corporate mentality of EDS:

From EDS's website
Q: From EDS’ perspective, what other client initiatives stand out as shared services successes?
A: Trudy McKnight

There are also some remarkable examples if you look outside the United States. For example, EDS recently implemented the Joint Personnel Administration (JPA) system for the UK Armed Forces Personnel Administration Agency (now known as the Service Personnel and Veterans Agency).

JPA is an innovative, envelope-pushing application modernization program that makes comprehensive use of Oracle Suite functionality. The program has enabled a world-class business transformation in the way that the Ministry of Defence (MOD) provides pay, pension, and personnel administration services to the UK Armed Forces. JPA has allowed the ministry to harmonize and rationalize pay and allowances across all three services; supports remote secure system access whether on land, at sea, or on operational duties worldwide; and provides self-service access for more than 300,000 users to view pay slips, change personal details, and submit on-line expenses and leave requests. JPA also supports a one-stop Enquiry Centre that handles 20,000 calls a week.

As you’d expect, the benefits for the MOD have been significant. Less administration is required to deliver an improved service; information needs to be entered only once, reducing errors and saving time; management reporting has been improved; and the time to introduce new policy or legislative changes has been reduced.

The business benefits from JPA to the MOD started to flow almost immediately. In its first full year of operation, the program is expected to deliver overall savings of £100 million, which is being redirected to operations."

"JPA is an innovative, envelope-pushing application modernization program" etc, so you must all be wrong.


The site also has her email address:

trudy.mcknight@eds.com
See, that's the kind of IT system that we need, not the cr@p JPA system we've got. Can MoD not look into replaceing JPA with this?
 
#22
Grownup_Rafbrat said:
And of course, the High-ups in the Bank/MOD/DWP/Client end up with jobs or directorships in Accenture, EDS, IBM, CSC, BT ad nauseam.

After nearly 30 years in the IT Industry, I'm totally disillusioned by this mess, and frankly shocked that any IT works at all. Ever.

Rant over. Better go and lie down now.
Are their any good IT contractors?
 
#23
polar said:
Grownup_Rafbrat said:
And of course, the High-ups in the Bank/MOD/DWP/Client end up with jobs or directorships in Accenture, EDS, IBM, CSC, BT ad nauseam.

After nearly 30 years in the IT Industry, I'm totally disillusioned by this mess, and frankly shocked that any IT works at all. Ever.

Rant over. Better go and lie down now.
Are their any good IT contractors?
One or two mate, but they are very thin on the ground. When you do come across one you are amazed at how good they are until you realise they are really only doing the job as it should be done and that a huge number of people in IT in general are really just not up to it. Grownup's description was spot on.
 
#24
MikeJenvey said:
I won't paste all the replies from the thread on PPRuNe, but this is my latest post from there:

Anyway, spoke with Sarah this morning, the plot thickens....... shall we say the "opposition" might be getting worried!! Sarah says big thanks for all the contributions so far (she is aware of the "gagging" DIN), & reiterates that anything sent direct to her is in complete confidence - more inputs welcome via PM to me (cut 'n paste of message text only, no screen-name, etc) or email directly to her:


Sarah.Arnott@incisivemedia.com


Probably at least one more week timescale for feedback (maybe more), so please keep the horror stories rolling in. Not quite enough for a book yet, but not far off it!!

However, this load of twaddle HAS to be included, just to show the corporate mentality of EDS:

From EDS's website
Q: From EDS’ perspective, what other client initiatives stand out as shared services successes?
A: Trudy McKnight

There are also some remarkable examples if you look outside the United States. For example, EDS recently implemented the Joint Personnel Administration (JPA) system for the UK Armed Forces Personnel Administration Agency (now known as the Service Personnel and Veterans Agency).

JPA also supports a one-stop Enquiry Centre that handles 20,000 calls a week.


The site also has her email address:

trudy.mcknight@eds.com


So why does it receive that amount per week :? And based on a 5 day working week of 9 hours a day they handle 444 calls per hour :? Confirms they are talking sh*te.
 
#25
Vent_Tube_Tester said:
MikeJenvey said:
I won't paste all the replies from the thread on PPRuNe, but this is my latest post from there:

Anyway, spoke with Sarah this morning, the plot thickens....... shall we say the "opposition" might be getting worried!! Sarah says big thanks for all the contributions so far (she is aware of the "gagging" DIN), & reiterates that anything sent direct to her is in complete confidence - more inputs welcome via PM to me (cut 'n paste of message text only, no screen-name, etc) or email directly to her:


Sarah.Arnott@incisivemedia.com


Probably at least one more week timescale for feedback (maybe more), so please keep the horror stories rolling in. Not quite enough for a book yet, but not far off it!!

However, this load of twaddle HAS to be included, just to show the corporate mentality of EDS:

From EDS's website
Q: From EDS’ perspective, what other client initiatives stand out as shared services successes?
A: Trudy McKnight

There are also some remarkable examples if you look outside the United States. For example, EDS recently implemented the Joint Personnel Administration (JPA) system for the UK Armed Forces Personnel Administration Agency (now known as the Service Personnel and Veterans Agency).

JPA also supports a one-stop Enquiry Centre that handles 20,000 calls a week.


The site also has her email address:

trudy.mcknight@eds.com


So why does it receive that amount per week :? And based on a 5 day working week of 9 hours a day they handle 444 calls per hour :? Confirms they are talking sh*te.


I very much doubt that they answer that number of calls and deal with them. Call Centres have a natty little counter on their telephone sytem which can count every incoming call dialled in even if the caller is in a queue and gives up or redials ten times a minute trying to jump the queue. So what they might mean is 20000 failed or dropped calls.
 
#27
MikeJenvey said:
Thought that this might be of interest here - a cut & paste from a thread I have just started on PPRuNe.

Rather than hijack any other JPA thread, this is an attempt to focus on specific JPA/JPAC faults that can be forwarded onto someone who might be able to influence things......

This began when someone shortlisted JPA for an award - Computing Awards for Excellence 2007 - it's under "Public Sector Project of the Year" Now, whilst the Drugs Squad finds the person concerned, there is a chance to add your feedback either via the comments here (15 pages so far - no complimentary remarks at all) or if you wish, straight to a more direct source.

The chief reporter from Computing contacted me asking for information; I have her permission to list her contact details:

I am the chief reporter for Computing.

You posted some comments about the shortlisting of the JPA for the Computing Awards and I wondered whether you would be willing to have a chat with me about what the problems with the system are/were. I am happy for our conversation to be entirely informal and off the record if you would prefer.

All the very best
Sarah
020 7316 9629
Sarah.Arnott@incisivemedia.com
Over to you guys!! :wink:
Over 22 pages of comments on JPA non favourable. Is anyone listening in the management of EDS/SPVA?
 

oldbaldy

LE
Moderator
#28
Look what they have to say about themselves:
There are also some remarkable examples if you look outside the United States. For example, EDS recently implemented the Joint Personnel Administration (JPA) system for the UK Armed Forces Personnel Administration Agency (now known as the Service Personnel and Veterans Agency).

JPA is an innovative, envelope-pushing application modernization program that makes comprehensive use of Oracle Suite functionality. The program has enabled a world-class business transformation in the way that the Ministry of Defence (MOD) provides pay, pension, and personnel administration services to the UK Armed Forces. JPA has allowed the ministry to harmonize and rationalize pay and allowances across all three services; supports remote secure system access whether on land, at sea, or on operational duties worldwide; and provides self-service access for more than 300,000 users to view pay slips, change personal details, and submit on-line expenses and leave requests. JPA also supports a one-stop Enquiry Centre that handles 20,000 calls a week.

As you’d expect, the benefits for the MOD have been significant. Less administration is required to deliver an improved service; information needs to be entered only once, reducing errors and saving time; management reporting has been improved; and the time to introduce new policy or legislative changes has been reduced.

The business benefits from JPA to the MOD started to flow almost immediately. In its first full year of operation, the program is expected to deliver overall savings of £100 million, which is being redirected to operations.
Wow you are all so lucky


http://www.eds.com/news/features/3944/
 
#29
Selastra said:
I believe that JPA is an attept to push the responsibilty of admin onto the soldier and for the "system" to wash their hands of any administrative difficulties.
Just before the RAPC disbanded I knew a Pay Team who were involved in an 'experiment' with soldier's pay. At that time Officers were responsible for administering their own pay, but the soldier's pay was administered by the Pay Clerks (aka Military Accountants!). The experiment was to treat the soldiers payroll the same as officers and not even look at the statements unless the soldier actually queried something. It was a disaster - after two months the team called off the experiment on their own initiative. Bottom line is that the Army doesn't recruit soldiers for their Financial skills - part of the 'covenant' is that the Army will sort a lot of this for them (think we used to take it a bit far sometimes as I'm sure we weren't helping ppl longer term for when they returned to civ life.
 
#30
What is this JPA everyone is talking about? oh thats it, it'll be the system that most of my unit doesn't have access to as no one will issue passwords.
When quizzed over how we get access to JPA, the answer has been 'its only being given to people who need it' It doesn't matter how good a system is, or isn't, if not everyone can get access to it.
 
#34
#35
OK, peeps...... the story has gone to press - watch out for the extensive write-up this Thurs, electronically via here. Lots & lots of contacts, Sarah says very many thanks!! :boogie:

BUT, if there is the opportunity (it seems likely, especially as the opinions from "t'coal-face" & the "Ivory Towers" are soooo markedly different!), Sarah wants to pursue JPA further. So, one skirmish down, the battle will continue....... please keep sending her feedback, especially significant items that contradict the grossly-distorted party line!
 
#37
Yay its on the frot page of this weeks computing and a double page spread on 4 and 5. Great wotk guys
 

oldbaldy

LE
Moderator
#38
It's all your own fault.

The issue is that the data being input for the calculation is not necessarily right. That is because the system’s customers – individual service personnel accessing self-service terminals and units’ HR professionals – are not using it properly.

Both of these groups maintain that the system is not user-friendly, and that training was grossly insufficient. In acknowledgement of early difficulties, the military’s management has revised training for HR professionals.

But staff resistance is also a factor, according to SPVA change director Ali Sansome.

“There is a large degree of cultural change and the extent of resistance to it was underestimated by everyone, particularly in a military culture where staff do as they are told,” she said.

“The reality is that it takes people a lot longer to become comfortable with such radical changes. We are certainly seeing that those people most familiar with the legacy systems are having the most difficulty in making the transition.”

Efforts were put in upfront but it was not until the system was fully live that the nature of users’ difficulties were revealed.
http://www.computing.co.uk/computing/analysis/2201914/jpa-teething-trouble-causes

You couldn't make it up!
 
#39
Problems with the armed forces’ £100m Joint Personnel Administration (JPA) system are down to training and cultural change issues rather than the technology itself, according to the military administration.
http://www.computing.co.uk/computing/analysis/2201914/jpa-teething-trouble-causes


If they are trying to slope shoulders, they are doing it badly. Any decent Programme/Project manager should know that Training is part of the Programme/Project. Therefore, to simply say that "this bit works" is unacceptable. The Programme has not satisfied some of its objectives, they may say it has been succesfull simply because they have hit some monetary targets, but the fact that such a large proportion of its users are dissalussioned is a huge minus and they should have the decency to stop raving about "what a success it was"

Talk about "lessons learnt"!! Training has been the failure of many an IT project!!
 
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