JPA Frauds

Discussion in 'AGC, RAPTC and SASC' started by OriginalSnowy, Apr 12, 2009.

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  1. There is currently zero tolerance on JPA fraud, which has since led to a ridiculous amount of criminal investigations (something some of us warned of at JPA's inception).

    I welcome any comments on the matter.
  2. erm........given that fraud is a criminal offence, your point is what exactly?
  3. sure, here's a comment.

    don't do it.
  4. Don't get caught.
  5. Okay, I was trying to keep the debate as open as possible, but that obviously isn't working. :roll:

    Let me get the ball rolling, by asking a question: what is the most appropriate way of handling low level, mass JPA fraud?

    I don't want to know how it's currently handled (SIB).

    I don't want any bone, smart arrse answers (go and post to the NAAFI bar), I'd like a proper, grown-up debate.


  6. The way its being handled now? With the RMP nicking people, the way it should be. Once a few stiff punishments have been handed out maybe people with think twice before committing fraud.
  7. Use the existing disciplinary processes. What's new about this as an offence that should justify any other way of dealing with it?
  8. wow, you're really a bit of a patronising twat at times. if you don't like the answers you got, perhaps you should look to your vague opening post rather than blaming those who responded?

    how's that for a grown up answer? if you want a debate, why not start the ball rolling by proposing your alternatives to SIB action? seems fine to me - if you break the law, you get nicked. simple.
  9. What's new is that it is now policy that SIB will investigate each and every allegation of JPA fraud (no matter how trivial), whereas unit's were allowed to take administrative actions against offenders in many cases. Often, when an alleged fraud was committed, units would simply take the money back and place the offender on an automated audit list.

    I think we've opened a can of worms, personally.
  10. Yeah, fair one. In retrospect, it was a bit patronising, for which I apologise.
  11. There is a huge difference between fraud and a mistaken entry but £80,000 between 12 people stinks of fraud to me. It all comes down to self discipline or is that no longer expected in the Forces. Do I see a bit of told you so in your post Snowy?
  12. accepted.

    as for you alternative solution - if the only sanction was "give the money back and we'll check all your claims in future" - that's not much of a deterrent is it?

    if SIB action is a new measure as you suggest, one could infer that the old system was not working...
  13. :oops:
    I think there would not have been a problem if we still put our claims in to human beings, rather than setting up a system that (of course) soldiers are going to take advantage of.
  14. with every case there are circumstances, if its a genuine mistake, ie wrong rate used, then recover the money and interview at unit level, second offence remove users right to i expense, has to then use cmbt hr specs to claim, they will then drag their heels over the claim.

    if however its blatent ie every middle of the month an advance or every month a gyho claim, then record evidence and pass to legal

    what else is there to do?