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Japan -still denying

Should Japan do more to acknowledge its WW2 guilt?

  • No-lets just move on FFS

    Votes: 21 28.8%
  • Yes-starting with the kids

    Votes: 44 60.3%
  • What wartime guilt?

    Votes: 1 1.4%
  • Bought aToyota once-marvellous! Pass the Sake

    Votes: 7 9.6%

  • Total voters
    73
  • Poll closed .

Goatman

ADC
Book Reviewer
Earlier thread 'Hiroshima-60 years on' refers - qv
http://www.arrse.co.uk/community/threads/hiroshima-60-years-on.17832/

With the anniversary of Hiroshima looming this story is worth bearing in mind:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-33754932

Encylopedia Britannica's view of Nanking for contrast;

http://www.britannica.com/event/Nanjing-Massacre

Nanking Massacre, also called Rape of Nanjing,(December 1937–January 1938),

mass killing and ravaging of Chinese citizens and capitulated soldiers by soldiers of the Japanese Imperial Army after its seizure of Nanjing, China, on December 13, 1937, during the Sino-Japanese War that preceded WWII.

The number of Chinese killed in the massacre has been subject to much debate, with most estimates ranging from 100,000 to more than 300,000.

The destruction of Nanjing—which had been the capital of the Nationalist Chinese from 1928 to 1937—was ordered by Matsui Iwane, commanding general of the Central China Front Army that captured the city. Over the next several weeks, Japanese soldiers carried out Matsui’s orders, perpetrating numerous mass executions and tens of thousands of rapes. The army looted and burned the surrounding towns and the city, destroying more than a third of the buildings. In 1940 the Japanese made Nanjing the capital of their Chinese puppet government headed by Wang Ching-wei (Wang Jingwei). Shortly after the end of World War II, Matsui and Tani Hisao, a lieutenant general who had personally participated in acts of murder and rape, were found guilty of war crimes by the International Military Tribunal for the Far East and were executed.
----------endit----------

The former soldier in the BBC item has it bang to rights-

"It's ridiculous... Mr Abe speaks as if this is something he witnessed, but he didn't. I did," says Mr Matsumoto.

"Someone told me this, 'One who fails to look back and perceive the past will repeat their wrongdoing'. But Mr Abe thinks we should erase anything bad Japan had done in the past and pretend nothing happened. That is why I cannot forgive him," he adds.



if Germany can make Holocaust denial a crime-why can't modern Japan?

just askin' like


edit;
mods-plse edit poll title to 'Should Japan do MORE to aknowledge ww2 guilt?'
My apologies - laptop meltdown!
 
Last edited:

Auld-Yin

ADC
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
Reviews Editor
The Nile is in Egypt not Japan you fule.

Just getting that out of the way so we can carry on..
The largest part of the Nile is in Sudan. Just saying like.

Happy Instant Sunshine Day.
 

Goatman

ADC
Book Reviewer
ah yes......Earth humor! Arf,arf

sorry the Pole is incompry..inkumpree.....gibberish

mods PLEASE amend
[I blame that Bill Gates]

BBC item is worth clicking through
 
if Germany can make Holocaust denial a crime-why can't modern Japan?

just askin' like

Possibly because the Japanese value free speech more than the boxheads?
 

Goatman

ADC
Book Reviewer
Balls do they
 

O Zangado

War Hero
I should like to hear from the Jap PM as to why, exactly, the Septics felt constrained to drop "Instant Sunshine" on Hiroshima and then Nakasaki. Not like the Japs did anything to provoke such barbarism, raids on Darwin and the occupation of the South Sea Islands and the Philippines, for example.
 
Back in the 1991-1995 the US Post Office issued sheets of stamps each year depicting a number of historical events for the year. In 1995 the designs included a stamp on Hiroshima. The Japanese got very upset and protested loudly and President Clinton cancelled the stamp design and apologized to the Japanese people for Hiroshima (Clinton excelled at apologizing for things other people did)

Oddly, in December of 1991 the Japanese Post Office had issued a stamp honoring the heroes of December 7th who had attacked Pearl Harbor. No one asked them to apologize for that.
 

Goatman

ADC
Book Reviewer
The Japanese got very upset and protested loudly and President Clinton cancelled the stamp design and apologized to the Japanese people for Hiroshima (Clinton excelled at apologizing for things other people did) .

Gawd-no wonder millions of apparently sane and sober Americans turned to Dubya
 
For those who may doubt that Japan issues a Pearl Harbor stamp.

pearl-harbor-attack-stamp.jpg
 
Ha, I asked a Japanese student that stayed with me, about WW2...In his mind - the yanks fired the first shot. I offered to show him some different literature and he told me he had been 'warned we had a different point of view'.
 

Command_doh

LE
Book Reviewer
I am prepared to forgive Japan, on the basis that their birds are so damned shaggable and the porn is the most delightfully fucked up on the planet.

And, topically, it is the Yank's fault the above is unfortunately pixilated. They introduced the 'obscenity law' into statute after putting Japan back in their box with the two big bombs. Another reason to be pissed off with America!
 
Balls do they
Constitutionally, they do. As a result of the experience of the 20s and 30s when the militarists passed laws banning public opposition, the Japanese government cannot constitutionally pass laws curtailing the public's right to free speech, regardless of how unpalatable.

Road to Hell and all that...
 
Constitutionally, they do. As a result of the experience of the 20s and 30s when the militarists passed laws banning public opposition, the Japanese government cannot constitutionally pass laws curtailing the public's right to free speech, regardless of how unpalatable.

Road to Hell and all that...

Well that will piss off the outrage merchants.
 
For centuries in Japan the only voices were those of the ruling classes, which had contempt for all lesser mortals. This lead to Japan's military and other agencies committing atrocities on a large scale and not just during the War, but for many years before that. Basically, the Japanese saw nothing wrong in killing and torturing people, after all the Bushido mob saw nothing wrong in being told to commit seppuku at the whim of some high ranking official, or the emperor himself. And public speaking by any other than officials (apart from story telling) was prohibited by law, so there was no free speech.

In modern Japan, there is now a strict code which prevents the government from restricting free speech. The result is of course there are now people who deny that Japan did anything wrong, just as there are people in the west who deny the holocaust.

It goes with free speech.

Unfortunately in Japan, there is still no culture of facing up to the past and admitting fault (which is one of the reasons why the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power station disaster happened in March 2011 - many people knew that the power stations protective structures had been redesigned to save cost, but no one would say anything).

The World Nuclear Organisation Report into the disaster is here: http://www.world-nuclear.org/info/Safety-and-Security/Safety-of-Plants/Fukushima-Accident/

Here is an excerpt from the independent enquiry report:

"The national Diet (Japan government) later set up a legally-constituted Nuclear Accident Independent Investigation Commission (NAIIC, or National Diet Investigation Commission) of ten members which started its work in December 2011. One of the purposes of NAIIC is to provide suggestions including the “re-examination of an optimal administrative organization” for nuclear safety regulation based on its investigation of the accident. NAIIC reported in July 2012, harshly criticizing the government, the plant operator and the country’s national culture. After conducting 900 hours of public hearings and interviews with more than 1,100 people and visiting several nuclear power plants, the commission’s report concluded that the accident was a “manmade disaster,” the result of “collusion between the government, the regulators and Tokyo Electric Power Co.” It said the “root causes were the organizational and regulatory systems that supported faulty rationales for decisions and actions.” The NAIIC criticized the regulator for insufficiently maintaining independence from the industry in developing and enforcing safety regulations, the government for inadequate emergency preparedness and management, and Tepco for its poor governance and lack of safety culture. The report called for fundamental changes across the industry, including the government and regulators, to increase openness, trustworthiness and focus on protecting public health and safety.

The NAIIC Chairman wrote: "What must be admitted – very painfully – is that this was a disaster 'Made in Japan.' Its fundamental causes are to be found in the ingrained conventions of Japanese culture: our reflexive obedience; our reluctance to question authority; our devotion to 'sticking with the program'; our groupism; and our insularity.” The mindset of government and industry led the country to avoid learning the lessons of the previous major nuclear accidents at Three Mile Island and Chernobyl. "The consequences of negligence at Fukushima stand out as catastrophic, but the mindset that supported it can be found across Japan. In recognizing that fact, each of us (every Japanese citizen) should reflect on our responsibility as individuals in a democratic society."

NAIIC reported that Tepco had been aware since 2006 that Fukushuima Daiichi could face a station blackout if flooded, as well as the potential loss of ultimate heat sink in the event of a major tsunami. However, the regulator, NISA, gave no instruction to the company to prepare for severe flooding, and even told all nuclear operators that it was not necessary to plan for station blackout. During the initial response to the tsunami, this lack of readiness for station blackout was compounded by a lack of planning and training for severe accident mitigation. Plans and procedures for venting and manual operation of emergency cooling were incomplete and their implementation in emergency circumstances proved very difficult as a result. NISA was also criticised for its "negligence and failure over the years" to prepare for a nuclear accident in terms of public information and evacuation, with previous governments equally culpable. Then Tepco’s difficulty in mitigation was compounded by government interference which undermined NISA.

Japanese culture hasn't changed that much from the way it was in the early 20th century and beyond.
 
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