Israels ancient punishment

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by ANZAC_BISCUIT, Sep 26, 2006.

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    According to wikipedia, the term 'salting the earth' “refers to the practice of spreading salt on fields to make them incapable of being used for crop-growing.

    This was done in ancient times at the end of some wars as an extremely punitive scorched earth tactic.”

    According to ‘War's Lethal Harvest’, a Washington Post article describing Israel’s use of cluster bombs in Lebanon;

    I’ll tell you what the logic was. To punish the South Lebanese populace for supporting Hezbollah.

    Israel has ‘salted the earth’ of South Lebanon. This scored earth policy is a war crime, plain and simple. And it’s not the first time they’ve done it.

    I never thought I’d look back on Reagan with any fondness, but in comparison to today’s president, he seems like a decent, humane leader!

    I sincerely hope, though seriously doubt, that the US will sanction Israel for this utterly immoral collective punishment against Lebanon’s civilians.

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    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/25/AR2006092501500_pf.html

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  2. Maybe we sould have an "It's all about Isreal" thread in the interest of balance.
     
  3. Cluster munitions are an area weapon that are used by virtually all nations. They are not designed to fail to explode and do not have anti-handling fuses, therefore they are not proscribed in the Geneva Convention.

    The unfortunate fact is that they have a high failure rate of 10-15%. Believe it or not pretty similar to any LSA weapon system (have you been on a grenade range lately??), it's just that there are so many of them in each container. The idea that Israel fired sub-munitions as some sort of 'salting the earth' policy is plain bollocks. This is classic tin foil hat syndrome. Israel retains AP and AT mines and could have delivered these to achieve the effect described but didn't.

    As an EOD operator I know how dangerous these things can be but they are no more dangerous than any other item of fired or dropped UXO. War is messy and the aftermath will take a considerable time to clear up, with or without cluster munitions.

    Probably the dumbest conspiracy theory yet.
     
  4. Take your point SF , but there are over 300K unexploded munitions surveyed by the UN and other non-partisan Mine clearance agencies.

    A lot of these munitions appear to have found their way into areas that can't be described as 'strategically important'

    The last death toll quoted, regarding UXB's I think is 22.

    It may not have been deliberate, but I don't see Israel rushing to offer to help clear up the mess.
     
  5. PTP,

    Cluster munitions are used on tactical and operational targets. Targets do not need to be 'stategically significant'. Indeed the targetting process for something strategic would probably result in a LGB rather than a CBU strike.

    Be cautious of estimates of submunitions. Someone has taken the data provided by the Israelis (which they readily gave to the UN) and estimated the failure rate to come up with those figures, there is no way that MAG etc can have done all the surveys in the short time they have had on the ground.

    Clearance should be prioritised to those areas closest to urban populations and vital infrastructure. My experience of the UN and NGO clearance coys is that it will be prioritised to whoever gives the biggest backhander or where the most publicity is (this is very cynical and I know there are some good guys but 9 years of being involved has left a bitter taste in my mouth)..

    I am not saying that there is no threat from the ordnance ( I know all too wel the risks involved) but you cannot expect to fight a conventional war (and that in the broadest terms was what occured) and not expect cluster munitions to be used. I agree that the Israelis should be contributing towards the clear up.
     
  6. http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=275276

    The Green Patrol... What is it? Maybe it is Israeli governmental structure? It is a private army, something like Hezbollah.
     
  7. Tinfoil hats on boys and girls! Agree with Mark can we have one thread containing all conspiracy theories and other non-news stories against Israel (and perhaps one for the USA)?
     
  8. May I ask for 'it's all about Russia' thread. I would be happy to look at anti-Russian posts and comment them.
     
  9. I agree Sergey, if one minority group has a thread of it own and all discussions related to it are contained within then all should. That however would be a stupid idea (particularly if the minority group was particularly prominent in current affairs eg. Muslims).
     
  10. Given the size and power of the Jewish vite in the US I think any sanctions are highly unlikely. If I were an Israeli I would be thinking "Learn your lesson Hezbollah"... and I suspect they will be licking their wounds for some time to come.
     
  11. Bugger me! A sensible post in an anti Israel thread...... surely not!

    Just gotta wait for PTP to pipe up with some Guardianesque comments in response...... oh no wait one I'm too late.
     
  12. [quote="Mr_BridgerIf I were an Israeli I would be thinking "Learn your lesson Hezbollah"... and I suspect they will be licking their wounds for some time to come.[/quote]

    Yes, I imagine the Israelis will be licking their wounds for many months. All that effort and still they lost. When will they learn that it is simply not possible to defeat a organisation like Hezbollah by treating it as if you were fighting an armored division ?

    That thet knew they were losing is shown by their attempt to punish the Lebanese by destroying their infrastructure etc etc.

    War criminals.
     
  13. Salted Earth doesn't sound very nice! Marmite Egg Banjos on the other hand are lovely!
     
  14. WW - any more of this and you'll find yourself on a 'Its all about marmite' thread, along with the other naughty boys.

    And it still mings.
     
  15. Yes, I imagine the Israelis will be licking their wounds for many months. All that effort and still they lost. When will they learn that it is simply not possible to defeat a organisation like Hezbollah by treating it as if you were fighting an armored division ?

    That thet knew they were losing is shown by their attempt to punish the Lebanese by destroying their infrastructure etc etc.

    War criminals.[/quote]

    Saladin... an interesting point of view, but not one which I will side with on this ocassion. Who lost the most manpower, equipment and support. Who is suffering more in the short, medium and long term?

    Even the illustrious (?) IRA realised in the end that terrorism was getting them nowhere after 30+ years. one suspects that the more rational and moderate members of HezB will be manouevring to gain control. Nasrallah has eaten humble pie.