Islamophobia

Should respect and tolerance towards demographic groups be earned or given

  • Earned over time

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Given until discredited

    Votes: 0 0.0%

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Unknown_Quantity

War Hero
Moderator
#1
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3763049.stm

Britain has become "institutionally Islamophobic", according to a report by a group promoting racial justice.
The Runnymede Trust's Commission on British Muslims and Islamophobia said Muslims were being "demonised" and little was being done to help them.

Spokesman Imam Sajid said the situation seemed to have deteriorated since a previous study in 1997.

"We need action in employment, education, policing, legislation, media and many other areas," he said.

'Done nothing'

Targeted at central and local government, voluntary and private bodies, the 1997 report put forward 60 recommendations.

But a follow-up document to be released on Tuesday found little positive action had been taken.

"In 1997 we were given a promise that within a few years religious discrimination would be outlawed, diversity and plurality would be part of life and no sections of the British community would be excluded," Mr Sajid said.

But he said local authorities had "done nothing" since then to tackle issues such as power sharing, "resource sharing", consultation, or inclusion in race equality schemes.

Muslims as a whole were being blamed for the acts of a few, he said, adding: "That's called an institutionally Islamophobic society".

He pointed out that the unemployment rate across Muslim communities was currently 15% while for the population in general it was 1%.

"In a few places changes have been made but good practices in one part of the country are not being practised in other parts of the country.

"Where I live local authorities refuse to recognise religious hate crimes while the Metropolitan Police in London are actively monitoring and even reporting to the Safety Forum such crimes.

"Why aren't these things being done collectively and in a co-ordinated way?"
Since it is still rare to hear outright condemnation of many misguided and religiously motivated crimes by the greater muslim community (due to poor press relations maybe?), I am strongly of the opinion that the muslims of Britain could do a lot more to help themselves.

As to the poll question, I have in mind groups such as devout christians/muslims/hindus/sikhs, political groups (BNP, any socialist groups) and ethanic communities.
 
#2
I believe if the islamic community were better intigrated into this society, and made the effort to assimilate themselves, this would be much less of a problem.
Irish Catholics living in England aren't accused of being involved with the IRA, the "guilt by common demographic" theory is restricted mainly to Muslims. Maybe it is Islamophobia, but only because they have so effectively segregated themselves.

the generalisations made above are only those which I believe to be reasonable
 
#3
UQ - without wanting to come over as a fledging member of the SS - I notice you assume that 'respect and tolerance' is applicable in all cases.

What if individuals just don't want to extend any kind of 'respect and tolerance' towards these 'demographic' groups, because they have no respect for our (ie British) way of life?

I am all in favour of a truly homogenous society, but we mustn't forget that we are a nation in our own right - with our own laws, customs and cultural mores.

If people from other nations and backgrounds wish to come to our country, they should live by our laws - and be prepared to contribute fully towards our way of life.

Respect and tolerance are fine - but without give and take from both ends of the spectrum, they are just hollow words.

I'm sick and tired of being labelled a racist/similiar because I express a non-PC opinion about the way our country is being run into the ground by pandering to imigrants and single interest minority groups.

This post is not a criticism of any views you or may not hold UQ!

Rant over - will now take incoming :D
 
#4
The trouble is not that Britain is "institutionally Islamophobic", rather the problem lies with institutions that are inherently anti-British. Whilst quangos and liberal think tanks fall over themselves to promote Black Britishness, Muslim Britishness etc etc, no one is prepared to champion British Britishness. It is the culture that dare not speak its name... and, as a result, it is not something that anyone aspires to join or inculturate themselves into.

It's all too easy for an ethnic minority to become victimised by government decree, ghettoised by the fact that they are told that they are victims rather than getting on with life and trying to become part of the majority;"It's not your fault you poor things, you could never do well by yourself because everyone who is old-stylee British hates you - here, have a bundle of cash to employ yet another cultural diversity coordinator." :evil:
 

Unknown_Quantity

War Hero
Moderator
#6
The_Sloping_Wire said:
UQ - without wanting to come over as a fledging member of the SS - I notice you assume that 'respect and tolerance' is applicable in all cases.

What if individuals just don't want to extend any kind of 'respect and tolerance' towards these 'demographic' groups, because they have no respect for our (ie British) way of life?
Thats a fair point, If I did the poll again I'd have a third option along the lines of mutual respect, although the immigrating group would need to earn the respect of the British people first I think.

f people from other nations and backgrounds wish to come to our country, they should live by our laws - and be prepared to contribute fully towards our way of life.
AGREED! Unfortunatly some people have gripped this idea very selectivly, focusing on the liberal blame/compensation culture.
 
#7
Well said, PF and TSW. I too am sick of being labelled as 'extreme right-wing' because I refuse to subscribe to New Labour's PC drivel.
 
#8
Unknown_Quantity said:
He pointed out that the unemployment rate across Muslim communities was currently 15% while for the population in general it was 1%.
Most imigrant communities seem to be in the inner cities. These are normally areas of unemployment. If you are in an area of 15% unemployment then it doesn't matter what your religion is, you are still in an area of 15% unemplyment even if the country as a whole is around 1%. I'd hate to think that statistics are being used to twist a non-story into a story.
 
#9
The_Sloping_Wire said:
Nice one PF - that's pretty much what I wanted to say, but I let my anger get the better of me!! :D
I think we are saying much the same thing, but I was fulminating over my reply when you posted yours, so mine went on without sight of your reply. Aplogies if I seemed to be stealing some of what you said...

So far, I am impressed with the responses so far - I expected to be called a swastika-totting member of the BNP by now!

Maybe this could be a policy of the ARRSE Political Party when we launch it to take down Bliar in his constituency? ;-) After all, if UKIP can do so well on one issue how much better could we do on several commonsense ones?
 
#10
how does one encourage intigration without seeming to be smothering people's right to traditional culture?
Case in point which has been bothering me lately: this 15 year old girl who is challenging the fact that her school won't let her wear full-on Muslim dress? If they let her, it's the start of a landslide, could children who's parents are in the KKK (there must be some somewhere) come in in their fetching albino santa claus outfits? If they don't let her, it'll be discrimination and prejudice.
I despair, time for a drink.
 
#11
Purple_Flash said:
So far, I am impressed with the responses so far - I expected to be called a swastika-totting member of the BNP by now!
No worries PF! :D

There are historical parallels to this situation.

Imagine if a politician appeared on the scene, saying that he could restore our essential Britishness - and all it will take is blind loyalty to the state. There will be no unemployment; massively reduced crime levels; and a vastly strengthened Armed Forces and Police. Medical support structures will be re-organised under a wide ranging social reform policy. Oh, and immigration controls would be ruthlessly implemented.

Who would subscribe to such a party? Answer - loads of people, certainly a majority (but perhaps not the moral majority)

I have no problems with the BNP - and what a clever move to play the 'colour card' this time around.

The British people have suffered long enough - taxes being wasted on 'blue sky' social cohesion projects that aren't required - the mindless blitherings of a compulsive nanny state.
 
#12
Very long but I feel better for writing it!

I’m facing a tough choice at the moment.
My eldest son was primary educated in Scotland, then went to secondary school in London.
His education has been second to none. I should know I’ve paid for it.

Here’s the problem.
The little guy will soon be facing school. (Gulps back tears)
But have been told by teachers and headteachers in local schools to hold him in nursery for a year more, as the majority of reception school children don't speak English as a first language.
So in fact the reception class is a basic English for children who's families didn't send them to nursery school, even though they would be given priority over me and receive a free place while I, and many of the other black parents, pay a minimum of £105 per week.

The BNP played a blinder. To have British ethnic minority groups endorse them! Classic move!
They have basically said we are not a racist party unless being Pro British is racist, which it is not, it's Nationalist... Fantastic move a lot of people who couldn't bring themselves to place that cross can do so now in full conscience. One of the best PR exercises I have seen in a long time.

So what do I do?

I can see negative change being made in many levels and in many place since 1999, so if I can see negative, why can't they see positive?

Do I see any 'white unity' groups being open in my area?
Do I see the kids with cornrows or Afros being told to get them cut as they break the school code?
Do I see interpreters sitting in the surgery to translate for me, as I can't understand my GP?
Do I see English only afternoons at the DSS?
Do I see white woman support groups?
Do I see first language classes funded by the government?
Do I see white mummy and me mornings?

Do I see ethnic minority as my platform? Not yet but how long? I feel threatened... i feel my values, my way of life, my rights, my social structure all are under threat... i have friends black, white, asian all voting BNP this time, they are under threat to and they know it...

The present government has made improvements in

Health-shorter waiting times, increase in executive procedures and more nurses.
Education-increased spending, more teachers and improved facilities.
Illegal immigration-down by what was it forgets %.

All facts not disputable... however.

Do the math.

By allowing more LEGAL immigrants, we shall put an increase demand on all of the above services and the budget equations don't add up.

Here’s an exercise....

Write to your MP and ask them to get you figures on projected costs in the above services per user over the next 5 years, then ask them do those figures include the real numbers of immigrants. Looks better in graph form, overlaid looks very interesting. In an OMG kind of way...
Then ask them to get those figures, if they exist.
In fact save, your self-the stamp.

And now I’m back to looking at schools and wishing away the next 4 years of my son's life until he can board or I leave London and go and live... where exactly will I be in the majority in 10 years time? Any ideas?
 
#13
TSW et al,

I am as distressed as you about the way this country is descending even further into the pit of "All are equal as long as it isn't the British".

I have some concerns about the BNP and their policies. Have a look at this and tell me what you think:

www.englishdemocrats.org.uk/index.html

PS Anyone fancy setting up the MOWOs (Music of White Origin) or possibly visiting the RAO and asking if they could form the Armed Forces Heterosexual Association?

Regards

ss[/url]
 
E

error_unknown

Guest
#14
Truth is Britain has always welcomed people from other nations. Britain has historically been very accomodating and all this bending over backwards has led to us apologising for our history and our Britishness and even led us to agree that we will sacrifice thousands of years of our cultural heritage on the pyre of the dreaded 'multi-culturalism'.
I dislike the term and the ideology behind multi culturalism. It basically accepts the death of our Britishness.
This is Britain :D
If you want to take refuge here and add to our country then welcome (you will not find a more tolerant, understanding and welcoming country) but please do not come here and set up a 'asian community' or a 'chinese community' or a 'moslem community'.
Also (as I am no way racist) do not set up a 'gay community' or a Christian community' or a right wing disabled lesbian artists community'.
If you live here you are BRITISH FIRST and you must live amongst us and with us.
If life isn't going your way don't seek funding for poxy action committees...get off your arrses like the rest of us and get a life. :D
 
#15
The_Sloping_Wire said:
Imagine if a politician appeared on the scene, saying that he could restore our essential Britishness - and all it will take is blind loyalty to the state. There will be no unemployment; massively reduced crime levels; and a vastly strengthened Armed Forces and Police. Medical support structures will be re-organised under a wide ranging social reform policy. Oh, and immigration controls would be ruthlessly implemented.
it worked for hitler and incidently i was reading an interesting book "Inside Hitlers Germany" by mathew hughes and chris mann ISBN 1-84044-145-3
its absolutely spot on, how the germans were quite willing to follow Hitler in spite of the various faults until it was too late , also Germany's "economic recovery" was unsustainable and would have collapsed if war hadnt come along,
BEWARE of what you wish for you might just get it!
having said that we do need somebody strong willed in Government or Opposition to stand up and say "This island is not big enough why aren't the French taking any of them in?" france has plenty of room and much fewer people than UK
 
#16
OG why did you feel the need to emphasise that you are not racist?

I'll be voting BNP this time around, but that doesn't make me a Nazi.
I don't believe in evrything they stand for, but then I don't believe in everything the LAbour Party stood for....and I've voted for them. AND IT'S THEM WHO HAVE GOT US INTO THIS MESS. Just look at immigration for instance.

Why is it that every time we speak of people other than White Europeans we have to point out that 'I'm not racist but....'

Frankly I am concerned about muslims. Yes they say that they are a peace loving religion, but their track record isn't great now is it. I know that Cristianity has a violent history as do most if not all religions, but right now here in the UK is where the problem is.
 
E

error_unknown

Guest
#18
Baddass said:
OG why did you feel the need to emphasise that you are not racist?
Why is it that every time we speak of people other than White Europeans we have to point out that 'I'm not racist but....
Excellent observations Baddass
 
#19
What disturbs me most about politics today is the way that the refusal of mainstream parties - especially Labour - to address what many normal decent people see as problems pushes them towards extremist groups. There are very real problems around the country today with racism - and increasingly whites are the victims. However, anyone who points this out is instantly labelled as racist by the media and most politicians. Most of the time they aren't and their problems go unacknowledged and unsolved.

I don't believe for one minute that most people who vote for the BNP actually support their policies at national level. However, the BNP appear to address local issues that mainstream parties ignore - hence as things get worse locally they become increasingly attractive. If Tony Blair wants to know why the BNP is gathering support alll he needs to do is look in the mirror.
 
#20
I think that we are getting off the mark a little and missing the point about ISLAMOPHOBIA.
I for one am an islamophobic. I fear what fundamental Islam is doing not only at home and abroad. Because I fear it it makes me phobic. I believe it is up to Muslims to encourage me to loose my fear of their once highly respected religeon. In the past the Muslims have been tolerant and have accepted our right to exist (Jews and Christians that is ) as we were people of the book. We are now getting large numbers of evil and ill educated so called clerics stirring up the Muslims within our community.

I was appalled to hear one young man on Radio 4 explaining that a threat to Muslims anywhere in the world was a threat to him despite the fact that he was English born and Bred.

We need inclusion not ghettoisation. We need to force generations to learn the national language so that we can all communicate. No teaching should be done in other langauges as immersion is very much the best way of teaching kids to learn a language. If they need to learn Arabic in order for them to read the Koran then let that be at home or at the Mosque.

I also believe that Muslim schools should not be subsidised as this leads to Ghettoisation.

One point on the 15% unemployment a large number of those unemployed are women who are activly discouraged from working.

As others have said if people are tought to think of themselves as British first and by faith second we would be better off.

Is this possible?

RANT OVER
 

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