Is the Conservative Party in the process of destroying itself.

Indeed it was last time I looked, the problem is the magistrates courts filling up with cases for 75+ year olds and others refusing to pay the BBC. It would make headlines the BBC wouldn't like especially after it was going to be removed as a criminal conviction.
Hopefully it could work out well for pensioners struggling financially, they could get a better standard of living and more humane treatement in prison than if they ended up in a care home
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
Hopefully it could work out well for pensioners struggling financially, they could get a better standard of living and more humane treatement in prison than if they ended up in a care home
I used to joke that as my pension would be stolen before I retire I may as well just piss it up and when i'm skint rob a sub post office with a banana in a paper bag. Get caught and food and board till I die or get away with it and piss it up until the money runs out and do it again.
Someone on here or a real copper I know told me of the flaws in my plan, by the time I retire there wont be any post offices let alone subs and there wont be any coppers either!
Bastard fuzz raining on my parade!
 
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Agreed, but it's not just this country's faith in Democracy being erroded.
I have a colleague from Zimbabwe, who gave me a different perspective from the outside looking in. He tells me that our governments delay in Brexit is already gifting a counter argument to the rule of third world Dictators, as in his own country. "Democracy? Where does that get you, if the majority go against the ruling establishment? Where's the difference in the final outcome?"
Yet how many times have we heard the United Kingdom being trumpeted as a "Beacon of Democracy."
Righter than a right-handed Tory on Right-Handed Awareness Day.

Congratulations, that's the post of the year right there.
 
Yet how many times have we heard the United Kingdom being trumpeted as a "Beacon of Democracy."
I stated, a wee while back, that hoc could not be called the seat of democracy anymore, in one of the many Brexit threads.

The point some seem to be missing/ignoring, is that if at some time in the future a government doesn't like the outcome of what people vote for, they can ignore us. If Brexit is ignored a dangerous precedent will have been set.

Someone, far cleverer than me, (not hard) said you get the government you deserve, how true! Perhaps because of the shambles this useless shower are making of Brexit, it may jolt more people to using their vote. This in turn would, hopefully, shine the spotlight on prospective MPs, with the chance of weeding the chaff out, before they were elected .
 
Labour can sit on the fence and watch their votes leach away to the Brexit Party/Limp Dems/Greens. Or they can come down on one side of the fence and either offend Remain supporting or Leave supporting Labour voters. They're in as much trouble as the Tories.

I would think the strategists for both Labour and the Tories are viewing the future with considerable concern.

Wordsmith
The way I read things up here in the NE Labour will have serious problems if they decide to come down on the side of remain or a second referendum. A lot of constituencies voted leave which the PLP seem to be ignoring at their cost.
 
I stated, a wee while back, that hoc could not be called the seat of democracy anymore, in one of the many Brexit threads.

The point some seem to be missing/ignoring, is that if at some time in the future a government doesn't like the outcome of what people vote for, they can ignore us. If Brexit is ignored a dangerous precedent will have been set.

Someone, far cleverer than me, (not hard) said you get the government you deserve, how true! Perhaps because of the shambles this useless shower are making of Brexit, it may jolt more people to using their vote. This in turn would, hopefully, shine the spotlight on prospective MPs, with the chance of weeding the chaff out, before they were elected .
I hope it does jolt people into using their vote, but then again, when are they going to get to use it? Even the Labour party seem to have gone a bit quiet in insisting on a General Election, since it got a hammering off the Brexit Party oop North. I'm sure that the establishment will just kick the can down the road until the 31st of October...monitor the publics reaction, hope for Leaver Apathy and contrive a way of making it too difficult to leave. If not, kick the can down the road with the EU some more.
The turnout for the Peterborough by election was paltry...voter fatigue?
The Eu have disbanded their Brexit negotiation team and appoints "Elects" a new Commission in October, that won't take post IIRC until the 1st of November?
All of which makes me doubt just how genuine a lot of the Tory leadership candidates are, in talking tough about us leaving in the interim. Is it all bluff and bluster, just playing to the crowd...Only to act all surprised and hamstrung by the dates, then set up another round of pretend negotiations again in November?
Nothings going to change for the majority of the electorate who supported leave 3 years ago. Not between now and October. The Commons arithmetic won't change and they'll block any suggestion of a No Deal.
If they buy time and we get a Pro Remain Tory PM, all they need to do is get the MSM fired up again and wait for an opportune moment for a new referendum.
They may try and load the questions to split the Leave vote and et voila, they've manipulated the vote and legitimised it with a thin veneer of democracy... a fine coat of varnish, over rotten wood?
I hope I'm wrong, but at this moment in time I'm very interested in what the Brexit party has to say at its first policy conference at the Birmingham NEC on June the 30th. I think I might get a ticket as I won't trust the MSM 's reporting of it.
 
Another Tory MP really wanting to make themselves unpopular with their constituents, looks like he's really gone rogue

My pro-Brexit brother in law was interesting to listen to on this, just the other night.

Firstly, he'd not object if Brexit were called off until UK Plc has got its ducks in a row.

Which would include vigorously not backing away from No Deal, on the basis that No Deal = turning off overnight the flow of ££££ to the EU, which would be a kick in the nuts for Brussels.

Declared ahead of time, emphatically, that this option isn't on the table, and you're totally deprived of any leverage with the EU.

Made a lot of sense.

Which almost certainly explains why it ain't gonna happen.
 
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Wordsmith

LE
Book Reviewer
The way I read things up here in the NE Labour will have serious problems if they decide to come down on the side of remain or a second referendum. A lot of constituencies voted leave which the PLP seem to be ignoring at their cost.
If BoJo gets in and tries to force a hard Brexit, Labour will have to come off the fence. I suspect they'll oppose BoJo, in which case the Tory electoral position will improve somewhat and the Labour one will worsen.

Wordsmith
 
If BoJo gets in and tries to force a hard Brexit, Labour will have to come off the fence. I suspect they'll oppose BoJo, in which case the Tory electoral position will improve somewhat and the Labour one will worsen.

Wordsmith
Hope you’re right, but I don’t think it will be quite that simple!
 
If BoJo gets in and tries to force a hard Brexit, Labour will have to come off the fence. I suspect they'll oppose BoJo, in which case the Tory electoral position will improve somewhat and the Labour one will worsen.

Wordsmith
If you believe the polls...... they estimate Boris will get a 160 seat majority in a GE.

If the Remain backing MPs are deselected then we’d be out.

Then again. Pigs may fly.
 
If BoJo gets in and tries to force a hard Brexit, Labour will have to come off the fence. I suspect they'll oppose BoJo, in which case the Tory electoral position will improve somewhat and the Labour one will worsen.

Wordsmith
In effect, PLP has same issue as Tories: there's a Brexit/Bremain schism, and Jezza has been dick-dancing around it.

If he's to have any hope of leading an effective parliamentary opposition he'll have to confront the issue at some point, but he's been happy so far to sit on the fence whilst kicking the can down the road.

There's an image to conjure with.
 
Theresa May did and look what happened there.
Exactly. It’s already been cut to 140 since I looked at the press commentary this morning!




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