Is the 22 year career obsolete?

Discussion in 'The Intelligence Cell' started by Alsacien, Jan 31, 2007.

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  1. Alsacien

    Alsacien LE Moderator

    If you are not downgraded, are fit and motivated, developing further technically is it time to consider the RAF style engagements in the Army?
  2. Comes in on 1 Jan 2008, and is called the versatile engagement.

  3. If you do more than 22, should you be entitled to "Time-and-a-half." After all, it's overtime, isn't it?
  4. Are the elder gentlemen staying in post or will they be moved to Q type roles to free up spaces in the troops etc?
  5. If the 22 yr career is made obsolete, why should the older soldier be denied a 'career' and be made to accept a 'job' just because someone younger than him thinks that he's entitled to more?

    If they ever do kick it in to touch, you'll eventually see a complete slow down of promotions in the trades affected, so best you get used to being held in the same rank for a little while longer. No doubt, you'll threaten to leave as you're not, in your eyes, getting what you think you deserve, but in truth, you'll not be denied your promotions, you'll just have to wait a bit longer for them. The RAF approach may be adopted, in as much as, if your are getting the 'tickets' and reaching the thresholds within the given time, you'll be allowed to sign on for some more.

    What is it about some people in the Army and this 'promotions' thing? Sweatimg on promotions boards and letting rank rule your lives. F*cking madness. You'll give yourself a stress problem.

    I reckon that most of you, if offered, would accept a slower promotion table for longer and more secure employment.

    If the 22 yr contract is kicked into touch, best some of you get rid of your '22' yr career attitudes. You'll have 35 yrs to reach WO1. Stop worrying about what you think that you are entitled too and enjoy the journey.
  6. GunnersQuadrant

    GunnersQuadrant LE Moderator

    Good post biscuits.
  7. There are RAF style engagements in the army :confused:
  8. Alsacien

    Alsacien LE Moderator

    Phrased like a mong due to my alchoholic intake last night.

    What I meant was, should the versatile engagement not be automatic and applicable to all who are fit and willing?
    As I understand it the engagement is selective and not for all?

  9. You will find they will eventually be taking a lot of the posts that are currently taken by NRPS and LSL, current NRPS (new NRPS are now only taken on NRPS 05 - a five year contract) and LSL will "waste out."
  10. On the basis that most of the NRPS on the new contract will have only just left the Regular Army, will they have an option to rejoin?

    Especially if they find that their job disappears after five years, to be replaced by a Regular soldier on a Versatile Engagement.
  11. What do you base your assumptions on? Have you considered every trade in the Army or only your own? Nothing is firm yet mate. If they change your contracts, there may be a lot more towards the end of their current '22' than you think and that figure far outways the amount of NRPS and LSL posts currently available.

    There were many lessons learned after Options for Change and I don't think that the Army is going to allow the same amount of experience to go, as what they did back then, if they have the chance to retain it and it wants to stay. Many of today's problems are as a result of what replaced those who left. There are still several senior Officers serving, who are only too aware of what Options did to the Services.

    If they go down the same line as the RAF, you'll all only be offered extensions of contract if you are making the grade. That'll include you. You'll have to compete for every place and promotion a little bit harder than you are now, because there will be even more candidates than posts. I would imagine in the current 'promotion is everything' Army, that there will be fierce contest for the places available.

    Who knows, you may end up leaving at 40 as the competition was stiffer than you thought. Like I said in the previous post, if they change the 22 yr contract, you lads will have to get rid of your 22yr career attitudes (they won't be applicable anymore)and go with the flow. If it happens, there won't be any LSL or NRPS posts, so you will have to compete with those around you for the next rank, irrespective of how long you or they have done beforehand.

    You might find that none of this comes into effect or that when it does, you'll be at the end of your 22 when you are offered it.

    Personally, for me 22 was enough, but nevertheless, good luck to those who want to do more and if by doing so, somebody else percieves that as being held up in the promotions game, then that's life. I'm sure however, like everything else in the Army, there will be a 3 month whining period then the dust will settle and people will just get on with it.
  12. I think 22 is good how it is. Because at 40 odd, your still young enough to do another career, with the pension on top helping. ive met many people in civie street, who are set up for life because of their pension and lump sum. Otherwise, people would have to do alot more time, before they get anything.
    Can someone enlighten me to how the new contract works, how long it is you can serve.
    Maybe its the mOD way of getting people to stay in the army longer, so it pro-longs them getting anything financially.??
  13. Coo! LS&GC and BAR!
  14. There are pros and cons to the RAF style career, and I'd guess it's more likely to start the way the RAF were 20-something years ago, with quotas in some trades and not in others, the cause of much whingeing, as the guidelines of ACR numbers having to add up to a total before getting in the zone for the next promotion board were similar for all, which meant it was near impossible in some trades, no matter how good, to reach WO, unless a whole bunch had just left at the right time, causing a ripple effect down the roster. It really was 'dead men's shoes'.

    These days the whole thing is based on a career to 55, and the downside to that is that unless you are a superstar, with 'Spec Recs' all along the line, if you join much later than 18 you just haven't got the time - though they have made a few changes in the quite recent past, but they affect a very small minority.

    The other thing which would mean it can't ever be quite the same is the concept of supervisory trades with selection and long courses in the various Corps. Signals YoS and FoS, REME Tiffies, etc etc. Generally speaking in the RAF a guy shoots (or crawls, rather) straight up a single ladder, the name of the trade may change at a given rank, and there may well be extra courses,but not long 'uns and it's still basically the job you know and love, rather than having to switch horses to go either with the supervisory or to RD.

    The thing that often surprised me - I worked for the crabs after my time in green - was the number of really good guys who reached the 22 point and thus the immediate pension, then having signed to age 47, the next checkpoint, found they were in a comfort zone on a particular station - own house etc - and decided to bin it rather than face another posting, at about 23 or 24 years in. That usually meant a short sharp roulement posting to the FI or somewhere, just to reinforce their decision, and out they went.

    On the other hand again, one WO I worked with was kept on to 63, strangely enough he was the senior WO in the RAF!
  15. spike7451

    spike7451 RIP

    When I joined the RAF in 84 (signed up when I left school in 82 but because of anti-terrorism stuff it took longer) to me it was a 'job for life' but when the Berlin Wall fell,all changed.(Yes,I firmly believe that the fall of the Berlin wall marked the end of the military career)
    If I was still in the RAF,I'd be retiring next year with 22 done & ,hopefully, on a Chief Tech's pension!
    Am I bitter?Yes! I think I have the right to be as do all the rest of us!!!