Gary Cooper
LE
And there were leeches in that fecking well.
Irish War of Independence centenary
- Thread starter bohs_man
- Start date
LE
PhotEx
LE
The unbiquitous implement of discipline in Irish schools from age 7 was the strap.
no, not a belt strap, it was made of 4 layers of fine hard hide, 16” long, 3″wide and 1/2″ thick, narrowed down to a handle at one end. It was common for pennies to be sown into one or more of the layers of leather to add more heft.
liberally applied in doses of 6 at a time to hands and the back of the legs for all and any infringement, the damage a good strapping did would at best leave you with very stiff bruised hands for a day, but could and often did lasting physical damage.
my cousin Mary is a phychiatrist in Ireland, shes a busy sort. Statistically Ireland has an astonishingly high level of PTSD amongst older people who lived during the endemic State condoned violence and sexual abuse during DeValera Regime. She says the nearest analogue she can find is the sort of behaviour noted in Concentration camp survivors at the end of WWII. While it was bad enough in the 60’s, and quickly ended from the 70’s, the levels of abuse and coercion the population lived under were worse in the late 30’s to 50’s when Irelabd was very much a closed country with the a Church busily crushing the people to theirs and DeValerie will.
In 1922, Ireland was a comfortable and wealthy country, noted for its excellence in the sciences and arts. Dublin was one of the finest cities of Empire with a world leading reputation as a seat of learning.
within a generation, the Oirish-American gobshite and the church had dragged Ireland back into a post medieval squalor, where ignorance was inculcated by the church, while the State furiously deindustrialised the country into DeValeras dream of an agrarian idyll. They even had home radios made that could only receive Irish state controlled stations - you May even be old enough @Gary Cooper to remember Devs little fireside homilies on RTE radio telling us how lucky we were to have Mother Church caring for our spiritual needs, and how free from worry having nothing made us.
Even a crude form of church supported eugenics was practiced. Us Irish from the old days are a strong and robust people, we had to be to survive. the Church only approved of breast feeding, bottle feeding was very much the devils work, mother couldn’t give enough milk? The child often simply starved to death.. Ditto sick babies, ‘it’s Gods will, we should let nature take its course’, so sick babies were simply not cared for - all done Under the watching eye of some nun. Under 5’s had a 20% attrition rate At one point...... on the death certificates, the cause of death was listed under the euphemism ‘failed to thrive’.
fallen women? Aka raped or abused young girls and women - Plenty of them, if you're family didn’t stick by you and get you out of the country to England ASAP, it was the Reform schools and Magdalene laundries for you. the babies, if they survived, they were either sold off to anyone with a Fiver outside the State, not a good looking baby they could sell? it ‘failed to thrive’.
no, not a belt strap, it was made of 4 layers of fine hard hide, 16” long, 3″wide and 1/2″ thick, narrowed down to a handle at one end. It was common for pennies to be sown into one or more of the layers of leather to add more heft.
liberally applied in doses of 6 at a time to hands and the back of the legs for all and any infringement, the damage a good strapping did would at best leave you with very stiff bruised hands for a day, but could and often did lasting physical damage.
my cousin Mary is a phychiatrist in Ireland, shes a busy sort. Statistically Ireland has an astonishingly high level of PTSD amongst older people who lived during the endemic State condoned violence and sexual abuse during DeValera Regime. She says the nearest analogue she can find is the sort of behaviour noted in Concentration camp survivors at the end of WWII. While it was bad enough in the 60’s, and quickly ended from the 70’s, the levels of abuse and coercion the population lived under were worse in the late 30’s to 50’s when Irelabd was very much a closed country with the a Church busily crushing the people to theirs and DeValerie will.
In 1922, Ireland was a comfortable and wealthy country, noted for its excellence in the sciences and arts. Dublin was one of the finest cities of Empire with a world leading reputation as a seat of learning.
within a generation, the Oirish-American gobshite and the church had dragged Ireland back into a post medieval squalor, where ignorance was inculcated by the church, while the State furiously deindustrialised the country into DeValeras dream of an agrarian idyll. They even had home radios made that could only receive Irish state controlled stations - you May even be old enough @Gary Cooper to remember Devs little fireside homilies on RTE radio telling us how lucky we were to have Mother Church caring for our spiritual needs, and how free from worry having nothing made us.
Even a crude form of church supported eugenics was practiced. Us Irish from the old days are a strong and robust people, we had to be to survive. the Church only approved of breast feeding, bottle feeding was very much the devils work, mother couldn’t give enough milk? The child often simply starved to death.. Ditto sick babies, ‘it’s Gods will, we should let nature take its course’, so sick babies were simply not cared for - all done Under the watching eye of some nun. Under 5’s had a 20% attrition rate At one point...... on the death certificates, the cause of death was listed under the euphemism ‘failed to thrive’.
fallen women? Aka raped or abused young girls and women - Plenty of them, if you're family didn’t stick by you and get you out of the country to England ASAP, it was the Reform schools and Magdalene laundries for you. the babies, if they survived, they were either sold off to anyone with a Fiver outside the State, not a good looking baby they could sell? it ‘failed to thrive’.
ordinaryforces
MIA
for every solution, the Irish can find a problem.
PhotEx
LE
we brought hooligans to the world.
so named after a particularly fractious and rowdy Irish bunch, the Hooligans.
but why are we so fractious?
common conception is the Irish are Celts from the somber Northern European celts. nah, we’re from the Iberian peninsula, with a dollop of Sardinians thrown in. rowdy and fiery Spanish and Mediterranean roots, still pissed off at finding we’ve gone from the hot and dry to freezing our arses off and being permanently wet. Even the Romans took one look at Ireland and said, ‘nah, soddus thattus’
as they say in Ireland, ‘this would the best place in the world if we could tow it a thousand miles south’
ordinaryforces
MIA
K
Asking for a friend.
I don't suppose there's any chance you could tow it a thousand miles WEST is there? and give us all a bit of peace.
Asking for a friend.
Onetap
LE
It's you that's leaving Europe. If you can conceive a way to shift yourselves a thousand miles west, south or north, we'll be glad to help. As will the French, Germans, Spanish, Italians, Greeks, Norwegians, Poles, Russians, etc.. It might be a shorter list if I just put down the nationalities that you haven't pissed off in the past 1,000 years, but none come to mind at the moment.
Gary Cooper
LE
Usually the English.
Gary Cooper
LE
26 November 1919
Lord French signed an order banning Sinn Féin, the Irish Volunteers, Cumann na mBan, and the Gaelic League across all of Ireland. Previous to this they had been proscribed in Dublin, Cork, Tipperary, and Clare.
The Court Martial of Fr. Thomas J. O'Connell began in Middlesex Guildhall, London. Fr. O'Connell, a native of Tasmania, and chaplain in the Australian army, was charged with disloyal words against the King in the International Hotel in Killarney earlier in the year.
Gary Cooper
LE
28 November 1919
In London Fr. Thomas O'Connell was acquitted on all charges at his Court Martial
Gary Cooper
LE
29 November 1919
Sergeant John Barton (second from the left) in Dublin Castle on 2 February 1917 after receiving the King’s Police Medal for his services during the Easter Rising. He would be awarded a bar to the KPM in 1918 making him the only member of the DMP to win the award twice.
Detective Sergeant John Barton G Division DMP was shot and fatally injured on College St, Dublin shortly after 6 pm. Barton was targeted by the Squad, with no less than three teams sent to track and shoot him on the night in question.
Barton was aged 39 and a 16 year veteran of the DMP. He had been born in Kerry in 1880 and joined the DMP in 1903, serving in B Division until a few weeks before his death. After being shot he was taken to Mercer’s Hospital where he died 15 minutes later. Barton is interred in Firies, Co. Kerry.
Sean Tracey of the South Tipperary Brigade, IRA took part in the operation. This was unusual as Collins and the IRA leadership in Dublin did not trust the Tipperary men who you will recall started the whole shenanigans at Solodheadbeg back in January. They were regarded as loose cannons and not to be trusted. The operation may possibly have been a trial run for a planned ambush on Lord French which we’ll see next month and in which Breen and Treacy took part.
Gary Cooper
LE
I once referred to my Company Commander as Commandant Hooligan, for he was of that tribe, not realising he was present of course. I was an unhappy Corporal for many months afterwards.
Mike Barton
War Hero
Excuse me for the delay in replying but I had to dry out my keyboard from the mug of tea that I snorted all over it when I read that.
The northern protestants were not going to let that happen to them? No, because they were too busy doing it to themselves.
Whence comes this notion that the South was a priest-ridden, child-molesting hellhole while the North was virtuous and free? The both states were a mirror image of each other.
The Unionist community was riven with paedos and buggers, from top to bottom. Unionist MPs made up a charmed circle of pooftahs who were only too happy to help themselves to the boys of their local schools, scout groups and rugby clubs, if they could get past the teachers first. The Kincora Boys Home is notorious, but it was only the tip of the iceberg. Belfast was totty central for upper class politicians, civil servants, army officers and businessmen (a few royals too I believe) looking for a bit of rough trade.
The loyalist gangs were led by notorious paedos, even the chief child psychologist in Belfast's famous Royal Victoria Hospital was in the game, never mind the scout masters, sports club leaders and randy prelates. These things are easily googled if you want the full gory details.
And as for corruption, that's a laugh. Try going around to your local RUC station to report a crime against a leading Orangeman or Freemason, see how far that got you, and if you still had a job the next week.
No one is doubting the abuse that took place in the South but for Unionists in the North to point the finger is absurd beyond laughable.
Mike Barton
War Hero
Let's see, what on earth could it have been?
During the peaceful, progressive rule of late 19th century Victorian Britain, large sections of Ireland were regularly under a form of martial law, whole swathes of rural areas were wracked by "outrages". The rule of law barely ran and magistrates conducted their quarterly sessions with armed policemen at their side and frequently with a loaded revolver under their bench.
There were more British troops garrisoned in Ireland than in India, yes you read that correctly. The coast of Ireland was ringed with coast guard stations filled with armed troops and sailors. The Royal Navy had to patrol the coastline of Ireland to prevent criminality. On top of this there was a gendarmerie-style police force, quite unlike any mainland British force, stationed in barracks and armed with revolvers and carbines and drilled as a light infantry force.
All to keep the peace in "lawless" Ireland, where the incorrigible nature of the Irish with their incessant squabbling made proper civilised rule a near impossibility.
Right?
So fast forward to today, how is Ireland with its "incessant squabbling and fighting"? My goodness, it is one of the most peaceful, quiet and law-abiding nations on planet earth. It has a small unarmed civic guard police force, which most people wouldn't see from one end of the week to the next. A tiny army, whose only job is overseas peacekeeping, a tiny navy and air force. Ireland has one of the lowest crime rates in the world and is a stable, peaceful democracy.
Now what changed in Ireland in that period, hmm? What was it about Ireland back then, that it was so lawless and ungovernable but which isn't there now that makes Ireland so peaceful?
Work that out and you'll find out why the Irish were once so prone to "incessant fighting".
History_Man
LE
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Mike Barton
War Hero
No, just pointing out the fatuousness of your ignorant comment that the Irish are "incessantly squabbling and fighting". They used to be, but there was an external reason for that (I will leave you to work out what that was), and once the Irish eliminated that reason the Irish and Ireland settled down to decades of extraordinary peace, law and order and stable democracy (except for the part of Ireland where the problem persisted and persists to this day).
History_Man
LE
Would you like me to send you 50p to phone a friend and tell them all about it?
Gary Cooper
LE
29 November 1919
Lady Nancy Astor was elected as an MP for Plymouth. She sat in the Commons until 1945. Astor was the second female MP to be elected to the Commons and the first to take her seat. The by-election which she won was caused by the elevation of her husband to the Peerage.
If her Wikipedia page is to be believed she was nuttier than squirrel poo.
Nancy Astor, Viscountess Astor - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
