Interesting court martial on the horizon, General in the dock.

[Kroneit44]

Probably someone who wanted to justify sexual assault.

Sound reason, definitely not a justification.

 

[RangdoOfArg]

Probably someone who wanted to justify sexual assault.

I have disagreed with @stacker1 over the last weeks, but they are generally right. If that sounds like weaselling, it is.
Stacker1 is right. Sexual assault is wrong. As is making people feel awkward, harassment. I ******* hate it.

 

[Moderator]

Hes certainly a predator

If you say so. The AJAG/panel clearly didn’t consult you before sentencing him to sixty hours of community service and hand your kit in on the way out.

 

[RangdoOfArg]

Not sure what point you are arguing. The Lt Col was dismissed and given sixty hours community service.

For what he did, a civilian court would probably have given him the sixty hours of community service but would have no power to dismiss him.

Therefore, I am positing that the dismissal element of the sentence was in respect of the service test failure and the community service was in respect of the criminality.

The AJAG clearly didn’t think a groped buttock merited a prison sentence (which, as you say would have resulted in dismissal).

The AJAG’s sentencing remarks would be useful.

Well, I don’t know. If they are no longer serving, dismissal seems inconsequential, but has a consequence.
A civilian court could not do this.
Dismissal/ with or without disgrace can be recorded on the PNC.

 

[Moderator]

Well, I don’t know. If they are no longer serving, dismissal seems inconsequential, but has a consequence.
A civilian court could not do this.

I’m really struggling to follow you. He was serving at the time of the offence and as far as I can tell, right up until the court ordered his dismissal.

 

[RangdoOfArg]

I’m really struggling to follow you. He was serving at the time of the offence and as far as I can tell, right up until the court ordered his dismissal.

OK. There seems to be some site issues. Things that can happen must be charged under when they happened. Hoping it improves

 

[stacker1]

If you say so. The AJAG/panel clearly didn’t consult you before sentencing him to sixty hours of community service and hand your kit in on the way out.

You think he isnt? This wasn't a drunken youngster in a bar who misread the signs from a female, this was a sober bloke, in a position of trust who targeted someone when they were vulnerable.

 

[Moderator]

You think he isnt? This wasn't a drunken youngster in a bar who misread the signs from a female, this was a sober bloke, in a position of trust who targeted someone when they were vulnerable.

What I think is entirely irrelevant. I wasn’t there. What the court martial trying the case thought is relevant.

Sixty hours community service and no register (tbc) suggests the court did not think he represented an ongoing predatory danger to women.

As I say, the court clearly forgot to seek your opinion prior to sentencing.


Out of curiosity, where did I actually offer a personal opinion?

I don’t imagine for a moment that the AJAG and the panel see this ageing, end of career Lt Col with a hitherto clean sheet as a dangerous sexual predator.

If you say so. The AJAG/panel clearly didn’t consult you before sentencing him to sixty hours of community service and hand your kit in on the way out.

 

[stacker1]

What I think is entirely irrelevant. I wasn’t there. What the court martial trying the case thought is relevant.

Sixty hours community service and no register* suggests the court did not think he represented an ongoing predatory danger to women.

As I say, the court clearly forgot to seek your opinion prior to sentencing.

Why would they need to consult anyone? I said he was a predator, he appears to be one.

 

[Kroneit44]

Why would they need to consult anyone? I said he was a predator, he appears to be one.

Predator implies a plural of his actions, do you know more than the rest of us?

 

[stacker1]

Predator implies a plural of his actions, do you know more than the rest of us?

Predator implies he saw an opportunity and used his status and her vulnerability to try his luck.

If a teacher tried touching up a 5 year old kid would you defend him as well as not being a predator?

 

[Kroneit44]

Predator implies he saw an opportunity and used his status and her vulnerability to try his luck.

If a teacher tried touching up a 5 year old kid would you defend him as well as not being a predator?

Your definition and the dictionary's is different.

 

[par avion]

It was reported to the police before RMP. Presumably as both parties were subject to service law, civplod felt it more appropriate to hand it off to RMP to deal with in accordance with military law.

Which they clearly did.

The first rule of any police force is to hand the matter to somebody else if they possibly can. Especially if there is no chance of a 'clear up'.

 

[Moderator]

Predator implies he saw an opportunity and used his status and her vulnerability to try his luck.

Sounds more like opportunism than predation to me.

If a teacher tried touching up a 5 year old kid would you defend him as well as not being a predator?

Whatiffery. Nobody is defending anybody (unless you can point to specific examples - no doubt you can)

I’d have to admit that it seems really odd that the court martial, armed as it was with all the facts and a fairly senior judge, didn’t appear to agree with your assessment of the Lt. Col.

 

[stacker1]

Your definition and the dictionary's is different.

So you would defend a teacher touching up a five year old if anyone called him a predator.

 

[Kroneit44]

So you would defend a teacher touching up a five year old if anyone called him a predator.

I'm questioning your assertion that the Lt Col is a predator when you don't have evidence that he has a history of this kind of activity. It's a bit NAAFI Bar.

 

[stacker1]

Sounds more like opportunism than predation to me.


Whatiffery. Nobody is defending anybody (unless you can point to specific examples - no doubt you can)

I’d have to admit that it seems really odd that the court martial, armed as it was with all the facts and a fairly senior judge, didn’t appear to agree with your assessment of the Lt. Col.

Opportunity is meeting a bird on the rebound in a bar and you try your luck.

Using your position of trust to sexually assault a vulnerable woman sounds like being a predator to me.

It not whatiffery Kroneit seems to think that someone with rank touching someone else up who is worried about their son doesnt make them a predator because his dictionary says otherwise.

Once again the judge wouldnt make a judgement on calling him a predator, he wouldnt call a rapist a nonce either but I would.

 

[Moderator]

I'm questioning your assertion that the Lt Col is a predator when you don't have evidence that he has a history of this kind of activity. It's a bit NAAFI Bar.

It’s Stacker. If you said he was a predator, Stacker would argue that he was criminalised for accidentally making contact as he joined the queue of people..

 

[stacker1]

I'm questioning your assertion that the Lt Col is a predator when you don't have evidence that he has a history of this kind of activity. It's a bit NAAFI Bar.

If anyone else who commits sexual assault/rape etc and doesnt have a known history of that kind of activity, that in your book means they arent a predator?

Only you could defend a nonce.

 

[stacker1]

It’s Stacker. If you said he was a predator, Stacker would argue that he was criminalised for accidentally making contact as he joined the queue of people..

He is a predator, but you can justify sexual assault if you like.