Independance For Scotland

#1
Looks like Salmonds bid for independance will fall short:

An independent Scotland could not afford to pay its welfare bill without cutting services or raising taxes, the UK Work and Pensions Secretary has said.

Speaking before an address in Glasgow, Conservative minister Iain Duncan Smith said a break-up of the Union would leave Scotland unable to meet the cost of getting people into employment or adequately supporting those who cannot work.

Mr Duncan Smith is to deliver a speech on the UK Government's controversial welfare reform plans. He will discuss the impact of the proposed universal credit system and is expected to touch on the independence debate.

Welfare spending is 6% higher north of the border, he said, and warned that North Sea oil and gas revenues would not meet the costs.

"Due to the reliance on the old heavy industries in many parts of the country, it makes perfect sense that we need to spend more money per head of population on welfare support in Scotland. I have no problem with that," he said.

"Thankfully, due to the United Kingdom and the commitment of the Westminster Government, we are able to ensure that money brought in, whether it be from the City of London or from North Sea oil, can be pooled and directed to wherever it is needed most. If the unthinkable were to happen, a Scottish Government would face a very stark choice of raising taxes or cutting services. This is not scaremongering, it's reality."

Mr Duncan Smith will address the Welfare to Work Scotland conference organised by the Centre for Economic and Social Inclusion.

He said universal credit would make a "radical" difference to getting people back into the workplace in Scotland and the rest of the UK. Under the scheme there will be a single monthly benefit payment, rather than weekly or fortnightly as at present, for people looking for work or on a low income. Launched next year, it will replace income-based jobseeker's allowance, housing payments and other benefits.

A spokesman for Deputy First Minister Nicola Sturgeon accused the Work and Pensions Secretary of "scaremongering". The spokesman said: "This is the height of hypocrisy from a Tory Government which is set on dismantling welfare provision as we know it - and only independence will protect Scots from the savage benefits cuts the Conservatives are now engaged in.

"The reality, as opposed to this blatant Tory scaremongering, is that Scotland more than pays its way when it comes to welfare, and an independent Scotland will be well able to afford to protect the most vulnerable members of our society."
 
#2
The SNP are still yet to publish a break down of costs for running an independent country and how the money to pay for it will be raised to pay for it
 
#3
The SNP are still yet to publish a break down of costs for running an independent country and how the money to pay for it will be raised to pay for it
The Jocks think that their North Sea revenue will see them through, but the North Sea only has about 60 year s tops, Whiskey Exports won't even come near!
 
#4
I recently posed this very question to someone I'd consider to be an expert on all things Scottish. A man born on the outskirts of that cultural masterpiece that is Glasgow. A man that has loyally served Her Majesty under a crisp and perfectly formed tam-o-shanter for nearly 22 years. Unquestioning, loyal to cross of St Andrew and faithful to Rangers despite their lack of indigenous players and fiscal problems. A man who can recite the Bard even having consumed a bottle of Grouse. A man who has sacrificed his teeth in the name of perfecting the accent of his Caledonian forebears.

‘So what do you think of independence for Scotland, Sergeant Major?’

‘Fucking shite, Sor.’

Good enough for me.
 

Wordsmith

LE
Book Reviewer
#5
The SNP are still yet to publish a break down of costs for running an independent country and how the money to pay for it will be raised to pay for it
Since when did politicians ever worry about how to pay for their promises?

And Wee Eck seems more keen to spend money he doesn't have than most.

Wordsmith
 
#6
I should firstly declare my antecedents as being 50% jock.

If the majority of Scots wish to have their independence, then the best of luck to them. But the decision should made on the answer to an unequivocal question. Full union or no union whatsoever.

The first union in 1707 came about at Scotland's request through its bankruptcy as the result of the failed Darien venture. Admittedly, there was also a little greasing of Burghers palms involve in order to smooth the process along.

Enthusiasm for independence dwindled more recently as the result of the collapse of RBS. An independent Scotland would not have had the wherewithal to have supported the failed bank and l think many Scots appreciated that to be the case.
 
#8
Supposedly 60% of the Scottish working population are non productive civil servants , so the other 40% carry them , that can never last .
 
#9
Considering that North Sea Oil has been underwriting the British economy for the last 40 odd years, 60 years will do us very nicely.

Chin Chin
 
#10
Remember its only profitable when oil is at 60 dollars a barrel or more , there have been many years when its made a loss.
 
#11
Remember its only profitable when oil is at 60 dollars a barrel or more , there have been many years when its made a loss.
Its fine, even when oil costs pennies we'll just punt the price of petrol through the roof and scrape more in that way. Seems to work the now.
 
#12
Its fine, even when oil costs pennies we'll just punt the price of petrol through the roof and scrape more in that way. Seems to work the now.
err it dont work like that, its not the only oil reserve in the world and if Porridgewogland starts charging £5.00 litre all the skirted devils will drive down too gods country to get their fuel ,even when weve nailed the little pog wogs for their English entry visas fuel will be cheaper.
 
#13
Considering that North Sea Oil has been underwriting the British economy for the last 40 odd years, 60 years will do us very nicely.

Chin Chin

Hardly,but never mind we know which way you'll vote,eh? ;-)


Personally,whichever way is fine with me but,if Independence isn't voted for,then they should get full,and I mean full devolution,raise their own taxes,no Scottish MP's in the House of Commons,all Civil Service jobs moved South of the Border,all Military units,equipment,and manpower moved out.


Let Wee Eck,start with a clean slate,Oil revenue isn't the great panacea,he thinks it is,sadly the Scottish people will learn by his mistakes,Enjoy! :)
 
#14
Forgive my ignorance but I have been labouring under the impression that international waters were 12 nautical miles from the low water mark of any countries coastline as defined in the United Nations Law of the Sea. Does all the North Sea oil that our porridgewog friends talk about as theirs lie within the 12 nautical miles? If not it aint theirs and they will just have to live on whisky exports and the RBS profits.

Oh wait, RBS belongs to the UK tax payer not just them. Their financial independance plan should make a good read.
 
#15
I can't see independence for Scotland happening ever, they'd never vote for it on the grounds that they might have to pay import duty on Buckfast tonic wine.
 
#16
WTF are they asking the few folks who live up there in the largely deserted north of the island?

Most 'Scots' I know live in their very own VERY large island, ye which climate is fully in keeping with their habitat requirements, situated off the coast of Canada.

It's just as miserable, cold, windswept and full of incomprehensible natives [now] but has the added benefit of NOT having the Wee Eck anywhere near.

tac, in far-off Ontario
 
#17
It's a shame they won't become independant, I was going to tender to rebuild Hadrain's Wall, without the gaps this time...
 

TheIronDuke

On ROPS
On ROPs
Book Reviewer
#18
It's a shame they won't become independant, I was going to tender to rebuild Hadrain's Wall, without the gaps this time...
The Scotch are about 50 miles north of the wall. South of the wall you have Makems then Smoggies then fucking pansies.

You might worry about the bit between the wall and the Scotch. Or you might not. We couldn't give a fuck. We are good at waiting.
 
#19
Forgive my ignorance but I have been labouring under the impression that international waters were 12 nautical miles from the low water mark of any countries coastline as defined in the United Nations Law of the Sea. Does all the North Sea oil that our porridgewog friends talk about as theirs lie within the 12 nautical miles? If not it aint theirs and they will just have to live on whisky exports and the RBS profits.

Oh wait, RBS belongs to the UK tax payer not just them. Their financial independance plan should make a good read.
I wondered about that too. Apparently the North Sea is divided up by international treaty for the purposes of oil reserves so it's not a free for all in international waters.

There is some uncertainty about how the border between Scottish and English waters would be drawn but it's irrelevant. IIRC, last year, the UK government raised £8bn from the North Sea. That wouldn't even cover a third of the £30bn that Scotland gets to pay for devolved institutions like schools and health.

There is then the monumental welfare bill. Last time I looked, one in five Scots was on incapacity benefit. More are on Jobseekers and huge numbers of single mums are on income support. This is paid directly from London and would increase catastrophically in an independent Scotland as civil servants lost their jobs and as Eck closed the naval bases and power stations.

Wee Eck is fond of saying "It's Scotland's Oil". You don't hear him saying "It's Scotland's welfare Bill".
 
#20
Let them have the oil, they'll only try to drink it away.
 

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