Inconclusive Speeding Photo - (not THAT Copper)

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by Baghdad-Brit, May 20, 2005.

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  1. A car driven by someone (there was more than one of us driving that day) was caught on camera and the fine arrived. It is a company car and we genuinely cannot remember who was driving at the time (honest!).

    The photo from the camera only shows the number plate - what is the legal perspective here?

    The rozzers we spoke to said the keeper of the vehicle carries the can but how can that be legal when they cannot prove who was driving and to the best of my knowledge you cannot be forced to "grass" if that person was not driving?

    Anyone throw any light on this (ie how do we get out of this)?
  2. LOL

    (But not a huge amount of help!!)
  3. Not an expert but surely an Englishman is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law and the onus of proof is on the CPS.
  4. BB
    Try this site. noduff.

    I'm pretty sure the registered owner will cop the fine and the points if anmesia prevails amongst the drivers.

    The traffic rules of speeding (which as we all know are about revenue not justice) are at odds with normal law.

    For example, if the car ran someone over and killed them I believe the prosecution would have to PROVE who was driving. Not so with speeding. If nobody owns up the registered keeper gets it..............

    All the normal caveats apply
  5. I think I remember a change in legislation, whereby the legal keeper of the car had to prove that it wasn't them driving at the time of the offence AND provide details of who was driving, after a loophole initially allowed them get off with it by just proving that it wasn't them driving, but not namimg the actual driver. Unfortunately I haven't any reference at the moment, but will see if I can dig one up.

    Try this site in the meantime
  6. Sounds like a bad law written and enforced by a bad Government. Bring back a strong House of Lords to keep the grubby little Commons in check, that's what i say. Herrumph
  7. Didn't the Hamiltons get away with this because they couldn't remember who was driving?
  8. maninblack

    maninblack LE Book Reviewer

    BB, check your messages for some useful info.


  9. Try

    Never been in that situation myself, but if you genuinely don't know then you should get off.

    However, I gain the impression that it depends on the mood of the magistrates on the day and also on being able to provide a whole heap of evidence that you've taken every reasonable step to identify who was. The website contains some useful stuff.

    Also, bear in mind that any coppers you speak to will want you to pay the fine and accept the points regardless of what actually happened so they can meet their targets. They want the money even if you're innocent. Then they'll whine that they're losing public support.

    The criminal justice system today penalises the honest man and protects the liar.
  10. OOTS you are full of sh1t.

    If you genuinely can't remember who's driving, request the court hearing.

    Very few coppers would want you to get stung for something like this, after all, cameras do real policemen out of jobs.

    They are dangerous and do not aid safety.
  11. We had a similar sit but in Germany - with front facing camera. No-one could would ID the pic of the driver, and the name on the TOR was a bloke who was in Bos at the time of the photo.

    It all just went very quiet.

    If the keeper is to blame then Queen Lizzie or better still Tony B should get the bill!
  12. BB

    Had very similar situ - but it was my car. Was on way home with 'Lucky Bloke' from a NYE do - unfortunately I was taken ill and he drove me home in my car. As you can imagine - details of LB was sketchy but provided what I knew - mentioning that I wouldn't sign cos I couldn't admit I was the driver at the time of offence (as the form required me to do). They wrote back with a 'conditional offer' of no points but £60 fine, I said fair enough, signed form stating that I was willing to accept offer as the car was mine but still unsure of who was driving.

    That was January 2004 - heard nothing since. That's my experience anyway. Perhaps I was just lucky. Twice :D
  13. Didn't Alex Ferguson get off a smilar charge because they couldn't prove who was driving his car - registered owner Man U?
  14. Our experiences must vary then. And those of people I know.