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Improving national resilience

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
As others say, make it impossible to operate in society without the jab.
This.

Let's put it out there: what is wrong with saying "Get it done or include yourself out"?

Nothing, as far as I can see.

I rather trust the scientific knowledge of those with lots of years studying chemistry and medicine over that of those who change nappies and empty bedpans.

Sorry if that seems a little elitist.
 
This.

Let's put it out there: what is wrong with saying "Get it done or include yourself out"?

Nothing, as far as I can see.

I rather trust the scientific knowledge of those with lots of years studying chemistry and medicine over that of those who change nappies and empty bedpans.

Sorry if that seems a little elitist.

Thinking about ostracizing due to lack of vaccination, It'll be interesting the first time someone gets bounced due to lack of vaccination and tries claiming discrimination. It can't be a protected characteristic. As you are opting not to have it when it is offered free.

Now if you say religion (as I believe there are some mad types like that) then it becomes a lot more curious.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
Thinking about ostracizing due to lack of vaccination, It'll be interesting the first time someone gets bounced due to lack of vaccination and tries claiming discrimination. It can't be a protected characteristic. As you are opting not to have it when it is offered free.

Now if you say religion (as I believe there are some mad types like that) then it becomes a lot more curious.
Science trumps religion.

Show me in your book of words where it says, "Don't do this."

...where don't means, specifically, "Lo, and [insert deity of choice] said unto his/her disciples: 'Be not accepting of the people in white coats and masks and do not let them stick needles into thine arms, lest they fill you with animal byproducts or the chip that is tracking'."
 
Science trumps religion.

Show me in your book of words where it says, "Don't do this."

...where don't means, specifically, "Lo, and [insert deity of choice] said unto his/her disciples: 'Be not accepting of the people in white coats and masks and do not let them stick needles into thine arms, lest they fill you with animal byproducts or the chip that is tracking'."

Dutch Reformed Church apparently does? There are a few weird sects that ban vaccines and medication.

Which is as I said, where it'll get interesting legally speaking.
 
Its 35 minutes but a well informed interview from Unherd, a channel with some great content. Adam Wagner ( a human rights legal expert) discusses lockdown

 

A.N.Other

War Hero
The only realistic solution for individuals is to have a holding of consumables at home and to be constantly using and topping up the holding to keep stuff within date.
Exactly.

I was a contractor and could have been out of work with no notice. Just to be safe I kept a couple of months worth of basics on shelves in the utility room.

A year ago, aware of COVID, I got a Booker warehouse card, more shelves and a 200L chest freezer. Now I have food, cleaning materials, bin bags, toilet paper and all sorts to last 6 months or more. I also bought FFP2 masks, Clinel wipes and other infection control materials.

I don't want to rely on JIT and having to scrabble for food if there's panic buying. It's my responsibility to look after myself, my household and, if they have not planned for themselves, my immediate family.

This is my new normal.
 
Exactly.

I was a contractor and could have been out of work with no notice. Just to be safe I kept a couple of months worth of basics on shelves in the utility room.

A year ago, aware of COVID, I got a Booker warehouse card, more shelves and a 200L chest freezer. Now I have food, cleaning materials, bin bags, toilet paper and all sorts to last 6 months or more. I also bought FFP2 masks, Clinel wipes and other infection control materials.

I don't want to rely on JIT and having to scrabble for food if there's panic buying. It's my responsibility to look after myself, my household and, if they have not planned for themselves, my immediate family.

This is my new normal.

Likewise. I was voluntold to help out with the county emergency planning people back in the days of civil defence. Attending lectures, doing disaster exercises, and visiting "places" in the county it suddenly became very apparent how piss poorly prepared we are in terms of what will filter down to the general population if things go seriously sideways.

I have always had enough for at least 6 weeks and made sure I knew where the nearest supermarket warehouse was located - if you live near DIRFT that would be your friend if tinfoil hat theories ever become reality.

Living in the US (hurricanes, tornados, and earthquakes) we are advised by the Feds to have grab bags with a few days worth of nosh and consumables. I always have around 2 months worth as standard, at the outbreak of this fiasco I upped that to nearer 6 months worth - I have two of those big american side by side fridge freezers anyway. Year old chicken is perfectly fine if stored below freezing.
 

DarkBrig

War Hero
Are we going to issue vaccination certificates for covid jabs, I remember we used to for things like yellow fever and cholera. I see a slightly illegal business opportunity for some.
Just make it like the BCG vaccine, everyone I know my age carries that scar, proof positive we didn't die of Smallpox when we were younger
 
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Just make it like the BCG vaccine, everyone I know my age carries that scar, proof positive we didn't die of Smallpox when you were younger
I think BCG was for TB and being alive is proof of not dying of smallpox but anyhow - the anti-vaxxers are a bunch of tin-foil hatted idiots who deserve to become social outcasts if they continue their misguided wibbledom. It would be legitimate (IMHO) for businesses to debar people without a CV vaccination (hotels, holiday firms, concert venues etc.,)

I do think they need to produce Covid vaccination certificates but they need to be non-copyable. Apparently there are already fake CV certs. available on the internet.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
I think BCG was for TB and being alive is proof of not dying of smallpox but anyhow - the anti-vaxxers are a bunch of tin-foil hatted idiots who deserve to become social outcasts if they continue their misguided wibbledom. It would be legitimate (IMHO) for businesses to debar people without a CV vaccination (hotels, holiday firms, concert venues etc.,)

I do think they need to produce Covid vaccination certificates but they need to be non-copyable. Apparently there are already fake CV certs. available on the internet.
No panic. Step aside, I'm a doctor.

I've got this certificate.
 
Or, in the case of someone I used to work with, if your son has to have a life-saving operation and there's a chance of haemorrhaging...

I once talked to a doctor friend about that. He said in an emergency medics would do whatever they thought best, and there would be no come-back for doing that. That's a different situation to seeking consent in advance, which sometimes goes to court for a decision.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
I once talked to a doctor friend about that. He said in an emergency medics would do whatever they thought best, and there would be no come-back for doing that. That's a different situation to seeking consent in advance, which sometimes goes to court for a decision.
This was elective but with some risk attached.
 
I once talked to a doctor friend about that. He said in an emergency medics would do whatever they thought best, and there would be no come-back for doing that. That's a different situation to seeking consent in advance, which sometimes goes to court for a decision.

Just out of interest, would the patient/legal guardians be told? I suspect morally they'd need to be.
 

Fang_Farrier

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
Just out of interest, would the patient/legal guardians be told? I suspect morally they'd need to be.

Yes, they would be
 

Yokel

LE
I am sure that I have heard of the principle of assumed consent in the event of an emergency first aid situation. An unconscious casualty cannot consent to be put in the recovery position, but it would be unreasonable to prosecute a first aider for assault for doing so.

Not sure how that works with the semi conscious patient guarding injuries.
 

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