If just one thing summed up what's wrong with the UK

Cash in hand is acceptable

  • As part of normal business

    Votes: 41 55.4%
  • As a legitimate political response to high taxation

    Votes: 22 29.7%
  • Never

    Votes: 8 10.8%
  • No view

    Votes: 3 4.1%

  • Total voters
    74

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
#1
#2
Paying cash in hand is a legal and intended use of notes and coins.

Whether the recipient declares the income for tax purposes or not is the legal/ethical question.

I think it shows whats wrong with UK when the most senior taxman can't express himself accurately in the English language.... no wonder the whole tax system is an ambiguous mess.
 
#3
No - Whats wrong is executives from his organisation get wined and dined by Big Business, and the next thing we know, said Big Business gets a bit of a Tax Holiday.

HMRC tax deal with Vodafone 'may have been illegal' | Money | The Guardian

Compared to the Billions owed in back taxes by these businesses, I don't think a fella grafting the odd flim here and there is going to "diddle" the country of too much. When he gets his own house in order then he can presume to lecture us.
 
#4
Perhaps if HMRC didn't have such a hugely complex set of tax laws that even it can't understand it all thanks to the self proclaimed greatest financial genius of all time it might help?


1797-1997: 4555 pages

2006: 9050 pages

2010: 11,000 pages



Nice one Gordon :thumright:
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
#5
I agree with Mr. Boots and it's not just tax. The lobbyists sit down with civil servants, usually over a nice lunch and with little or no record-taking and the next thing you know we have procurement black holes at the MOD and IT systems which have never worked and which never will.
 
#7
No - Whats wrong is executives from his organisation get wined and dined by Big Business, and the next thing we know, said Big Business gets a bit of a Tax Holiday.

HMRC tax deal with Vodafone 'may have been illegal' | Money | The Guardian

Compared to the Billions owed in back taxes by these businesses, I don't think a fella grafting the odd flim here and there is going to "diddle" the country of too much. When he gets his own house in order then he can presume to lecture us.
So it is ok for "a fella" to not pay tax but not ok when a business does it.

Your law abidance/morality is based on price then?
 
#8
So it is ok for "a fella" to not pay tax but not ok when a business does it.

Your law abidance/morality is based on price then?
I think his point was that compared to what this odious man lets corporations off with, people doing cash business is pretty small beer.

I don't agree myself, we ought to all pay our taxes. But having said that, I understand why the little guy cheats when he sees the taxman conniving with the big boys to help them get away with it (and then no doubt getting directorships with them after he 'retires').
 
#10
I think his point was that compared to what this odious man lets corporations off with, people doing cash business is pretty small beer.

I don't agree myself, we ought to all pay our taxes. But having said that, I understand why the little guy cheats when he sees the taxman conniving with the big boys to help them get away with it (and then no doubt getting directorships with them after he 'retires').
But if the little guy also cheats then he has no moral right to say that the big boys shouldn't.

Using the "well everyone does it" or "they are worse than me" excuses just leads to an ever increasing downward spiral that ends with people knowing that if they don't get caught then they haven't done anything wrong.
 
#12
I may be naive but I believe it is a moral obligation and duty to pay the correct amount of tax to your country. One of the many reasons I despise TB.
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
#13
But if the little guy also cheats then he has no moral right to say that the big boys shouldn't.

Using the "well everyone does it" or "they are worse than me" excuses just leads to an ever increasing downward spiral that ends with people knowing that if they don't get caught then they haven't done anything wrong.
You're right but, as with the Army, leadership and example come from the top. No-one has any right to lecture the rank and file unless poor behaviour and bad practice is also being stamped out at the highest levels and the punishments are proportionally more severe - that's not been the case here.

If you want people to respect a system, they have to believe that it is generally fair and equally applied. Those best-placed to influence and shape the system have an absolute moral duty to do so fairly, honestly and transparently. If they fail in that duty, they have, in my view, no authority whatsoever to call on those further down the chain to adhere to higher standards than they themselves observe.
 
B

bokkatankie

Guest
#14
I may be naive but I believe it is a moral obligation and duty to pay the correct amount of tax to your country. One of the many reasons I despise TB.
I agree, it is; so why does the taxman allow some to get away with it and some not too. It is also the moral obligation of all Employees of HMRC (and any other Government Department) to apply law fairly and impartially.

Are some just to big to prosecute?
 
#15
"People who pay cash in hand to tradesmen are “diddling” the economy and diverting money from hospitals and schools, the country’s most senior taxman, Dave Hartnett, has warned". Today's telegraph headline .

Personally , I do not see that the problem here in the UK is that severe. After all , the recipients are going to buy goods and services which are themselves taxed , so the government gets its cut in the end . Secondly , if they were taxed on this income they might not bother to work at all and claim benefits instead .

Comments ?
 
#16
Are some just to big to prosecute?
No, the system is corrupt. I don't mean they hand over brown envelopes, like Italy: the British sell themselves much cheaper. These snivelling functionaries are taken out and given food, and the Board nestles up to them and flatters them, and tells them how great they are, and how fair and how someone of their super-duper intelligence can understand how important it is that they be not over-burdened with tax, and would you care for a little more Burgundy, and let Miss Blonde Nipples my PA show you the figures and... ho, you agree then, that's nice. Have some Armagnac.
 
#17
Dunno about here in Pomland, but when VAT was being implemented in Seffrica, the rumours were that it was being introduced to trap the black market people (no pun intended...) and get at least some taxes back. It was estimated that about 40% of the work being completed was untaxed, as it was cash in hand.
 
#18
When one considers the effort put into pursuing the 'little' people compared to the huge discounts given to large companies after a few convivial lunches, is it any wonder that the small trader is prone to pay cash and no VAT syndrome?

Pay £100 cash, or £100+£20 VAT, and you can see the rip off before your very eyes. £20 won't cover the cost of a dolite's acrylic nail extensions, let alone the admin on an MP's expenses claim.
 
#20
If I wasn't being screwed by local and national government in every devious way possible I might be amenable to paying my way in all matters.
I am finding that quality tradesmen ae now hinting at cash.
 

Similar threads

New Posts

Top