How should Cadet Segeant Majors be addressed

Discussion in 'ACF' started by essexbob, Jun 8, 2010.

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  1. First raised in the Seniors forum,kept well out of it there as one of our number was making a great impression of a tit.

    Personally I address as Cdt Sgt Maj, Cdt RSM

    I also address our SMI's as SMI, CSM as CSMI and RSM as RSMI, none of them have warrants therefore should not be called Sgt Maj, CSM or RSM I will sometimes use Sir/Ma'am

    Once had a Cdt CSM who thought I should call him Sir, I was the cadre commander he wished he had,nt opened his mouth. Mind you I did call him Sir the last time we met as he had just finished at the factory, only seemed reasonable to do so.
  2. Who cares? Is it bob-a-job yet? My garden needs raking
  3. BREW BITCH.....milk with 2 sugars, and be fecking quick about it!
  4. These threads just keep on giving.

    Is there a moderator who could perhaps advise posters just not to bother setting themselves up for ultra grief/scorn/"hilarious" abuse
  5. Does it really matter, its post like this that give us in the ACF the walt label.

    Most Cadets and CFAV with the rank of SM, CSM and RSM know they dont have a warrant .

    I call my CFAV RSM "RSM" or "Sir" the Cadet RSM "RSM" he knows he is a cadet so do i, so why bother with the prefix or suffix even.

    Its a hobby.
  6. on the whole, it doesn't really matter how you address cadets, there's not much they can do about it is there? if they throw a tantrum just tell them where to stick it.

    Just RSM for me. You don't need to tell them they're a cadet, they know that. You don't need to remind everyone else in earshot they're a cadet. They know that too.

    All ranks are relative. Everyone with a rank holds their rank, just in their own organisation. ACF ranks mean nothing in the Regs, Regular ranks mean nothing in the ACF. If you can't call ACF officers sir as they haven't done Sandhurst, and you can't call ACF SMIs sir, who do you call Sir? Like I said, it's all a relative.

    RSMI is not a rank. SMI is the rank, RSM is the position. Because they don't have warrants, that holds them from the title of 'Warrant Officer', not 'Sergeant Major' - the rank 'Sergeant Major' holds to suggestion of having a warrant.

    Once again, all ranks are relative, and ranks don't intertwine whether ACF or Regular. So just bear the grudge and call them Sir if you have to, because that's how the ACF does it.

    If you are in the ACF, play the ACF game. And in the ACF game, Officers and SMIs are refferred to as 'Sir', and all other ranks referred to as their rank. If you're in the Regs, on the occasional times you're with the ACF just suck it in and call them Sir, most of the CTT's do and they work with them all the time.

    Ranks are only ranks within their organisation. Doesn't matter if you're a regular RSM, if you're on an ACF activity and an ACF Sgt tells you to do something, you gotta do it. And there's a nice little JSP that says so. But should never be times when these situations arise - of all the times I've seen regular soldiers on ACF activities, there has been a good collaboration between the regular and ACF personnel who respect each others' areas of responsbility, and there has never been a requirement for rank pulling or whatever.

    I mean, it's only the same as managers being managers in their own companies. As a factory manager, you've got 'rank' over your employees. But you go into another factory, that just uses the same management structure and wears the same colour uniform, and you're to do whatever that company's employees ask.

    Personally, I think in 99% of cases this 'what value are ACF ranks' argument is just people's insecurity and looking for something to moan about. It doesn't really matter, does it? Does it really hurt to say 'Sir' to an ACF SMI? Does it really hurt to say 'RSM' to a cadet RSM? Yes, they're not Regular Sgt Maj's, but it doesn't mean they're any less real. An ACF Sgt Maj is as real in the ACF, as a Regular Sgt Maj is in the regular. Just get used to it. Because, except for the few ******** walter mitty cases, nobody's trying to be anything they're not.

    If people could only get ranks by regular service, the whole ACF would have to walk around being called 'CFAV' or Cadet. There'd be no leadership model and it would all be very un-military. Which is kinda the point of the ACF. Did it ever occur to you that ACF personnel aren't promoted because of their military abilities and similarities to regular personnel? They're promoted because they're better youth leaders. End of. They hold the same purpose in the ACF as Regular Sgt Maj's hold in the Regulars, so they call them the same thing. That's the end of the similarities. If you want to play the game, play all of it. And if it means you have to suck up your pride every time you talk to an SMI, then so be it. You chose to be in the ACF.
  7. Can I ask though, if an American Warrant Officer was to wander past, should I say, salute him? ;)
  8. Yes with two fingers if he demands a salute.
  9. woopert

    woopert LE Moderator

    Oh for the love of all things holy.......

    Essexbob. There's a pub in Aldershot called "The Pegasus". For years it's been known as a hang out for wise sages who are willing to answer any question on matters military. All you have to do is wander in there, announce your presence by ordering a drink when someone screams "oi yer hat cnut!" and ask. The gentlemen who frequent that location are some of the politest, and most helpful gentlemen who have ever served under the Colours. I'm sure they'll help.

    Until then, thread locked.
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