How " normal " will back to normal be ?

windswept398

War Hero
Unpleasant selfish troll . (Of a similar mindset to the two t0ssers the mountain rescue lifted of Kirk stone pass last week) god forbid your lifestyle gets cramped a moment longer than you think you can get away with it.
Please explain how, as a person who obeys all the covid rules, I am an 'unpleasant selfish troll'?
Cannot wait to hear your reasoning
 

Countryboy

Clanker
I find the absence of shaking hands a real issue, makes me feel rude and disconnected, so that is the only one I'd like to see back (one day). I think masks are here to stay, just keep them for a couple of years at least.
 

windswept398

War Hero
Have you ever served? Because I am trying to reconcile your attitude of indifference to the suffering of others with the mindset of a member of the military who may be called upon (however unlikely) to give his all for, if not his nation then at least his friends and colleague?
Still serving.
Have you? Because I am struggling to understand how a former soldier can be so afraid of a virus that kills less than 2% of the people that it infects. For instance, 400 people a year drown in Britain. Are you afraid of the sea? Do you demand beaches to be closed until the vaccinate us all to breathe underwater?
Or do you take sensible precautions whilst maintaining a normal life? Like a reasonable adult?

Scotland had more deaths to influenza in the winter of 2018/19 than it has to this 'deadly' pandemic. Yet I do not recall any lockdown for influenza. Do you?

'Its easier to fool a person than to get them to accept they have been fooled'- I don't know who said that first but it rings true with a lot of people on here.
 

Countryboy

Clanker
Nothing has been said yet but I'm assuming our MD will want everyone back on site as soon as possible.
May I ask why you think they will? Is it just that they are paying for it, or a genuine feeling that it is a better working environment?
All that hard commuting seems barmy now...
 
Still serving.
Have you? Because I am struggling to understand how a former soldier can be so afraid of a virus that kills less than 2% of the people that it infects. For instance, 400 people a year drown in Britain. Are you afraid of the sea? Do you demand beaches to be closed until the vaccinate us all to breathe underwater?
Or do you take sensible precautions whilst maintaining a normal life? Like a reasonable adult?

Scotland had more deaths to influenza in the winter of 2018/19 than it has to this 'deadly' pandemic. Yet I do not recall any lockdown for influenza. Do you?

'Its easier to fool a person than to get them to accept they have been fooled'- I don't know who said that first but it rings true with a lot of people on here.
You made that up.
 
Still serving.
Have you? Because I am struggling to understand how a former soldier can be so afraid of a virus that kills less than 2% of the people that it infects. For instance, 400 people a year drown in Britain. Are you afraid of the sea? Do you demand beaches to be closed until the vaccinate us all to breathe underwater?
Or do you take sensible precautions whilst maintaining a normal life? Like a reasonable adult?

Scotland had more deaths to influenza in the winter of 2018/19 than it has to this 'deadly' pandemic. Yet I do not recall any lockdown for influenza. Do you?

'Its easier to fool a person than to get them to accept they have been fooled'- I don't know who said that first but it rings true with a lot of people on here.
Ooh ffs. It's not just about deaths, it is about burdening the NHS and preventing them from providing all the other services that everyone needs from time to time - even the under 40s who have no underlying conditions before they fall off a ladder.

Your attitude is 100per cent snowflake.

Selfish, ignorant, arrogant and parasitic.

Ends
 
Scotland had more deaths to influenza in the winter of 2018/19 than it has to this 'deadly' pandemic.

You really aren't very good with facts, are you? It took me about thirty seconds to prove you wrong.

Scottish deaths 2018/19 (link): "Between December 2018 and March 2019, the seasonal increase in deaths was 2,060" - note that this isn't just influenza

Scottish COVID deaths to date (link): "9,347 deaths have been registered in Scotland where COVID-19 was mentioned on the death certificate up to 21 February"

Back in the 90s, I was on an exercise with a Regular officer who insisted that he was at no risk of HIV, because he wasn't an IV drug user or gay. My STAB oppo (who sat on one of the NHS HIV committees of the time) was going ballistic trying to reason with this bloke, who just wouldn't listen.

Because I am struggling to understand how a former soldier can be so afraid of a virus that kills less than 2% of the people that it infects.

You've not heard about "long COVID", then? The research medics I know, certainly aren't blase about the risks of permanent (or semi-permanent) damage from the disease.

'Its easier to fool a person than to get them to accept they have been fooled'- I don't know who said that first but it rings true with a lot of people on here.

Look in the mirror. I don't know who you've been listening to; some loony and their "two minute polemic on Facebook", was it?

If you can't even do basic fact checks on your headline assertions, I'd suggest you're the gullible one; either that, or you lack integrity.
 
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Britreb

Swinger
windswept398 is entltled to his opinion and we should except it. Just because it does not match your opinion, does not mean its wrong. For your info, I am holding back from taking the vaccine until it's run its course for a while and is absolutely safe and tested. If everyone else wants to take it, fill your boots.
 
windswept398 is entltled to his opinion and we should except it. Just because it does not match your opinion, does not mean its wrong. For your info, I am holding back from taking the vaccine until it's run its course for a while and is absolutely safe and tested. If everyone else wants to take it, fill your boots.

I very much except it.
 
windswept398 is entltled to his opinion and we should except it. Just because it does not match your opinion, does not mean its wrong. For your info, I am holding back from taking the vaccine until it's run its course for a while and is absolutely safe and tested. If everyone else wants to take it, fill your boots.

More pish.

If he said "the earth is flat", should we accept that? What if he denied the Holocaust? Spouted racist propaganda, announced that Stormfront was the only source of truth? He made factual claims that are easily disproved. That's not "opinion", that's a matter of record.

PS The vaccine is tested - millions of doses given so far. Insisting that it's somehow "untested" is the mark of a troll or an idiot.
 
windswept398 is entltled to his opinion and we should except it. Just because it does not match your opinion, does not mean its wrong. For your info, I am holding back from taking the vaccine until it's run its course for a while and is absolutely safe and tested. If everyone else wants to take it, fill your boots.

No, he is wrong. This is the triumph of opinion over fact which seems to a very modern, malignant, malaise.
 
Did I say Covid will never be an issue to me? I'll get the vaccine once I'm vulnerable to covid. Anyone vulnerable to covid should get the vaccine. That's common sense.
But you are not demonstrating selfless service now are you? You are being selfish and you are a service member, who will present a potential readiness issue which impacts more than just yourself. You are setting yourself up as just another potential plague spreader which is not immune to the new strains that are worse than the original Covid bug. Not only could you be down and out but you can also impact several others as well. You are not just a useless Civilian who can do what you want with minimal repercussions to a larger organization, because even civilians in some professions are required to get the vaccine to play their part in society as a whole.
 

windswept398

War Hero
But you are not demonstrating selfless service now are you? You are being selfish and you are a service member, who will present a potential readiness issue which impacts more than just yourself. You are setting yourself up as just another potential plague spreader which is not immune to the new strains that are worse than the original Covid bug. Not only could you be down and out but you can also impact several others as well. You are not just a useless Civilian who can do what you want with minimal repercussions to a larger organization, because even civilians in some professions are required to get the vaccine to play their part in society as a whole.
Ah, cherry picking Values and Standards to push your point? How very political of you.

When have I went against any rule?
Vaccination is voluntary, is it not?
 
Ah, cherry picking Values and Standards to push your point? How very political of you.

When have I went against any rule?
Vaccination is voluntary, is it not?
It all depends on where one works and what one does, in some places vaccination is mandatory. Regardless of your personal feelings. You by your own admission said you are part of a larger force that does serve a higher purpose, which means you don't always get the freedoms the rest of society enjoys.

But if you think of the vaccine as just another issued PPE item, why would you refuse it? You don't get to disregard your brain bucket or PC if you don't feel like wearing them.

Do you wear seat belts in vehicles? Do you wear a helmet when you ride a bike? How about reflective belts in low visibility conditions? The vaccine is only meant to be another tool to prevent unfortunate things from happening to you. If you didn't have the potential to impact others by all means don't get the shot, if you croak life will go on and nobody will care if emulate the dying cockroach.
 
Still serving.
Have you? Because I am struggling to understand how a former soldier can be so afraid of a virus that kills less than 2% of the people that it infects. For instance, 400 people a year drown in Britain. Are you afraid of the sea? Do you demand beaches to be closed until the vaccinate us all to breathe underwater?
Or do you take sensible precautions whilst maintaining a normal life? Like a reasonable adult?

Scotland had more deaths to influenza in the winter of 2018/19 than it has to this 'deadly' pandemic. Yet I do not recall any lockdown for influenza. Do you?

'Its easier to fool a person than to get them to accept they have been fooled'- I don't know who said that first but it rings true with a lot of people on here.

Would you skip NSPs because of the relative lack of deaths from negligent discharges?

While I don't think it warrants a lock down perhaps your example comparing influenza deaths to COVID deaths might point to deficient public health measures with respect to influenza?
 
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Still serving.
Have you? Because I am struggling to understand how a former soldier can be so afraid of a virus that kills less than 2% of the people that it infects. For instance, 400 people a year drown in Britain. Are you afraid of the sea? Do you demand beaches to be closed until the vaccinate us all to breathe underwater?
Or do you take sensible precautions whilst maintaining a normal life? Like a reasonable adult?

Scotland had more deaths to influenza in the winter of 2018/19 than it has to this 'deadly' pandemic. Yet I do not recall any lockdown for influenza. Do you?

'Its easier to fool a person than to get them to accept they have been fooled'- I don't know who said that first but it rings true with a lot of people on here.
I'll quote @bob_the_bomb on this one.

I’m sorry but I’ll put the opinions of epidemiologists that I work with, and the heath care professionals I know over your cherry-picking rant.

‘The science’ as you put it is very simple.

This is a virus that is spread by aerosol. Largely by us breathing out. The droplets in our breath travel about a metre or so.

Our normal, unconstrained, human behaviour gives it an R value of 3-4 or even higher. That’s an exponential growth rate. It kills around 3% of cases.

You can model that yourself.

Take a chess board and put a single grain of rice on the bottom left hand square. On the square next to it put two grains. Next to that put four. That’s an exponential growth rate equivalent to an R value of 2.

By the time you get to the 64th square you’ve put the entire global annual rice harvest on your board.

With an R value of 3-4 that’s everyone infected in a matter of weeks. Especially with global travel. With a 3% death rate that’s 210 million dead. Not to mention the complete collapse of the health services dealing with those who might not die.

Remember those early scenes from Wuhan. Bodies dropping in the street? Remember those bodies stacked up in Italian morgues? That’s what it looked like BEFORE we knew what was going on.

In the absence of a vaccine - and without any pre-existing immunity - the only alternative was to use public health measures to reduce the R rate to something we could control.

Ideally that would have meant MORE isolation. If you could keep everyone at home for 3 weeks it would have killed off the virus. At the cost of a few hundred of thousand deaths globally and a few tins of red paint to mark the doors of the infected. Or weld them shut as the Chinese did.

But governments realised this couldn’t be done, and what we’ve lived with is a compromise, that keeps the lid on it until a vaccine can be rolled out.

The problem is that we have a largely uneducated society who believe what they read on ******* Facebook. And who spout the same unmitigated shite that you just have.

My grandad spent four years in the trenches and was mustard gassed. My dad was a PoW. All we’ve been asked to do is to sit in a sofa for a few weeks and watch TV.

FFS.
 
This may be of interest to some. All of the points in tonight's episode are very relevant to getting the economy going and various choices that have to be made. Paying off debt by taxation will hold the economy back. Ideally we would stop generating debt but a sudden stop could be more expensive in the long term. Is the phased plan to "normality" overcautious or about right? Is education fit for purpose? Should there be more flexibility built in to the system?

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I think we are getting too hung up on what we "must" do, ie what the government will tell us to do, I think what will be the real clincher is what we, ie a large majority of the population, will simply decide to do.

My opinion is the new normal won't be very normal at all. Offices as we knew them, they're gone, sure there will still be a need for some people to go into work but the idea that tens of millions of us will return to getting out of bed at 7am every weekday morning to travel to work in a heated/air-conditioned office just to tap keys on a computer that we can do just as well at home is absurd. I am not saying whether this is a good thing or not, I am just stating it will be the reality.

I would be sweating if I was a bank or investment fund sitting on a huge amount of inner-city office space these days. Ditto hotels, sure we'll still need them now and again, but along with cruise ships and cheap mass tourism they have gone. Cinemas, finished.

Shopping malls, they were already on the way out, COVID will finish them off. As will at least half the pubs and restaurants, we aren't all going to be flooding back to them any time soon, no matter what people say about their desperate need for a pint. We survived drinking and eating from home for the past year, eating and drinking out, and the expense and inconvenience involved will wipe out most marginal venues.

Our entire work and leisure lives have been turned upside down, it won't be a simple matter of just flicking a switch on June 21. A lot of us will have decided the old normal was actually pretty shite and will not be in any hurry to return to it. Like I say, I make no judgement whether it will be a good thing, I simply call it as I see it.
The human species are pack animals, human face to face interaction makes us what we are., gregarious, chatty and needing hugs and kisses, its part of what we are. The pubs will slowly fill up, old mates who for over a year have been confined to the phone and skype, will relish a laugh, a piss take, and the general banter and chatter that a good pub atmosphere invokes.

Restaurants will again cater for family groups , with mother father kids and granny, enjoying the food, wine and family gossip. We will all slowly resume our lives as it was pre Covid, and in the fullness of time, like foot and mouth, the corned beef scare( ask your parents) horse meat in pies and pastries, and the blitz, (ask your grand parents) all will eventually return back to what was perceived as normal.

As i have never worked in an office, or shop, or any concrete and glass box, i cannot say how that scenario will pan out. Normal service will resume as soon as possible.

EDIT:- What will change i think, is that some form of ID showing vaccinations, will be needed, not mandatory, but without one, you will have a hell of a hard time shopping, cinemas, pubs, restaurant, etc, This could be incorporated on to your driving licence, along with your blood group, and any other relevant information deemed necessary by big brother.
 
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