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How do I tell if this is genuine?

No.9 said:
In some parts of the world you can still have a night at the pictures, a bite to eat, a few jars of grog, ten fags and get change from half a sheet. No.9

Having been alongside in India, I can attest to this. It is a veritable paradise, although their titty bars are a bit shite and a goat brain curry is poor substitute for a chicken kebab.

Street vendors out there do sell a whole world of copycat shite though - genuine fake antique prismatic compass/sextant no problem boss! All strangely pristine for their age :wink:

Mind you, a lot of the sellers other items seem fairly gen.
 
I expressed some concern on eBay ...

The Seller replied:
hi, let me give you some history here, i have several sources for my military items, house clearance chap,an old collector and a fellow who goes to munich, germany every 3 months and buys a large amount from a big fair there.
this piece came from a house clearance, the home had several confirmed ww1 items,the previous owner had died and it was subject to probate, the brass is certainly a shell, very old, the badge i have to confess i did not research much however i can vouch for the shell, every item i sell is subject to returns for any reason, i appreciate your help and advice on this, thank you, frank.

Still unpersuaded [not by the seller necessarily, just the item].
 
No.9 said:
"Even in India I doubt if they'd go to that much trouble for just a few quid."

What??? Parts of southern India have families, including kiddies, happily chippin' stones into shape for road hardcore. Yes they could use machine processing, but, then these folk would have absolutely nothing to do to earn a few coins. In some parts of the world you can still have a night at the pictures, a bite to eat, a few jars of grog, ten fags and get change from half a sheet. Indian made hackles you get charged £7 or £8 notes for, are sold for around 25-50p, and the women who actually make them probably get 10p a hundred. And, they say there's better money in India than their neighbours. Alternately, go to Tokyo and shell out an arm and a leg for a hamburger - it's all about exchange rate - ask the Polacs. :wink:

No.9

True, true, true....but to knock up that shell you'd need a foundry and a good knowledge of WW1, something I doubt the average armless Indian has in his hovel. And...like I said, why bother with WW1? Make a teaspoon, put a swastika on it and get £100.

Having said that, if the bottom of the shell has had a bit cast onto it for the 1917 bit, that does look dodgy. Incidentally, that raised lettering could just be camera angle, much in the same way that moon craters look like bulges until you turn the picture upside down.
 
Awol said:
No.9 said:
"Even in India I doubt if they'd go to that much trouble for just a few quid."

What??? Parts of southern India have families, including kiddies, happily chippin' stones into shape for road hardcore. Yes they could use machine processing, but, then these folk would have absolutely nothing to do to earn a few coins. In some parts of the world you can still have a night at the pictures, a bite to eat, a few jars of grog, ten fags and get change from half a sheet. Indian made hackles you get charged £7 or £8 notes for, are sold for around 25-50p, and the women who actually make them probably get 10p a hundred. And, they say there's better money in India than their neighbours. Alternately, go to Tokyo and shell out an arm and a leg for a hamburger - it's all about exchange rate - ask the Polacs. :wink:

No.9

True, true, true....but to knock up that shell you'd need a foundry and a good knowledge of WW1, something I doubt the average armless Indian has in his hovel. And...like I said, why bother with WW1? Make a teaspoon, put a swastika on it and get £100.

Having said that, if the bottom of the shell has had a bit cast onto it for the 1917 bit, that does look dodgy. Incidentally, that raised lettering could just be camera angle, much in the same way that moon craters look like bulges until you turn the picture upside down.

I've seen spill holders that were so heavily reworked you wouldn't immediately recognise them as shells. All the base was removed and reworked.
 
”but to knock up that shell you'd need a foundry and a good knowledge of WW1”

Not really the point. If it’s a 1917 small shell, why remove the base in the first place? If it’s concern about contamination from the spent primer etc, drift it out and pug it with a drop of solder evidently copiously used elsewhere. Or, drop in some disc and solder it in place. Whatever a lot less effort than replacing the base? Re the alleged RFC badge, personally I think it’s a bit too rare for me to take seriously.

Anyway, bottom line is would you give over 30 sobs for it? bluey and I wouldn’t which doesn’t mean to say either would not buy it for a couple of notes, but not 30.

Just go to eBay and type Trench Art in the search box and a bevy of items will present themselves, including shell jugs from £1.99 like http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/TRENCH-ART-SH...goryZ585QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
And http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/World-War-I-W...ryZ64823QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Then, how do you define ‘Trench Art’? In my book pukka Trench Art is something made-up by troops in the line from odds around them. Commercial ‘Trench Art’ is anything not made by the above, in the above fashion, knocked out to earn a few shekels. Some of the bits may be old – see eBay to buy genuine old shells from 99p – but turned-out as recent as last week somewhere in the world. If you regard that as Trench Art then you’ve a considerably bigger market to fish?

If you accept anything said on eBay as gospel, well good luck to you. Got a few grand to spare – look at all the items listed as Commando, SAS, SBS. For example, you’ll probably find a ‘genuine’ WWII Cdo officer beret badge for No.2. Cdo Regiment complete with the text ‘Commando’ arched across the top. It says so on eBay so it must be genuine. Apart from the fact NO Army Cdos were ever regimented in WWII, ask a real No.2 Veteran about these badges – like the secretary of their dwindling fraternity – and they’ll say it's utter total bollox. No such animal, never made or issued in WWII. Disagree? Fine, here’s my £500, slap down your £500 and we’ll go ask them. Or, how about a ‘genuine’ No.1 Cdo Salamander hand sewn badge? Guaranteed genuinely hand sewn by Mrs Patel last month. And, why not shell out for all those ‘Genuine Cdo F&S WWII’ fighting knives – especially the ones with crowsfoot marks and ‘B2’ stamped on which either look nothing like MoD stamps or were never applied at the time in the first place?

”But if it's not true tell eBay?” Yeah, ever tried to get sh1t from a rocking-horse? A few years ago someone was selling the beret of a deceased Veteran I knew. I phoned his daughter and asked if she still had her dad’s beret, as she brought to a commemoration the year before. She went up to wardrobe to check, and yes it was still there. Some septic paid over 400 notes for ‘some’ beret.
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Your money, spend it on what you fancy. :D

No.9
 
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