How do I tell if this is genuine?

Discussion in 'Military History and Militaria' started by msr, Apr 21, 2008.

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  1. msr

    msr LE

  2. No particular reason to think it's not. I would suggest that it was a locally made souvenir (it even says so!) that had the RFC badge applied by the purchaser.
    It's not a Chinese knock off!
  3. Seeing as its trench art I'd imagine it's be a one off hence unique and very hard too prove.

    You could probably tell the date from the casing but that could'nt tell you when it was made, diffcult.
  4. Nice looking piece.

    I don't know anything about the air gunner badge for the UK but the Rhodesian Air gunner badge was similar and as the Rhodesians copied most from the UK it looks good.

    The piece itself "looks" heavy and rough enough.

    For 30 quid you get what you pay for at the end.

    And I cannot see any "made in INDIA " stamps on it.

    Take a chance :D
  5. msr

    msr LE

    Apart from the fact that it isn't an RFC badge?


  6. I thought it was an RFC air gunner badge?

  7. msr

    msr LE

    One of these: [​IMG]
  8. blue-sophist

    blue-sophist LE Good Egg (charities)

    Former GF's dad was an Air Gunner pre-WW2 [North-West Frontier, Westland Wapiti, 5 Sqn]. His trade badge, and it doesn't make this a WW1 item.

    Classic assembly kit from an Indian village workshop, IMO, and worth at least £5, possibly £7.
  9. My 2d worth. Assuming this was a shell case, they say @ 40mm hence I would have expected a rim at the base (this is not any ‘expert’ view, just opinion). However, there appears to be an attached base, but then missing usual shell markings, and, the ‘infill’ (why) with plenty of solder has a copper (?) plate with ‘1917’ – but why are the numerals raised??? The style of ‘Souvenir’ I’ve seen several times before, as with Asian repros sold in Euro markets – recalls copper and brass bugle with poor sandcast badge of Argylls. Some traders put them out shiny, some ‘fishponded’ them. 8O

    ‘Engraving’ is not. Typical hammer and nail indenting, like Mustafa does? Nice tea/rose leaves though? Belled end (not bel’end) looks tapped out on an anvil/last and the whole thing wheel polished. Badge doesn’t convince me – but that’s just an impression. Agree with bluey, about a fiver – expect to see another identical ‘unique’ one next week.

    May be of interest

  10. Ask the seller for a photo or details of the headstamp on the round then google it and it will give you the date of manufacture etc. It looks rimless to me which suggests it's not British.
  11. I'd say it was genuine simply because there is no reserve on it. Even in India I doubt if they'd go to that much trouble for just a few quid. Also, it's a lot easier to carve a swastika on just about anything and watch the money roll in.
  12. In fairness, it would not be hard for the seller to have misidentified what later became the air gunner's badge for what was just an artistic flourish.

    As I recall (from CG Jefford's 'Observers and Navigators' book) Air Gunners in the 1914-1918 period were (eventually) given the winged 'O' worn by those who'd passed the observers' course. There were plans to issue a special air gunner's badge, and one design did bear a similarity to that on the e-bay item - AIUI, the badge wasn't adopted, though and the Observer wing was issued instead.
  13. "Even in India I doubt if they'd go to that much trouble for just a few quid."

    What??? Parts of southern India have families, including kiddies, happily chippin' stones into shape for road hardcore. Yes they could use machine processing, but, then these folk would have absolutely nothing to do to earn a few coins. In some parts of the world you can still have a night at the pictures, a bite to eat, a few jars of grog, ten fags and get change from half a sheet. Indian made hackles you get charged £7 or £8 notes for, are sold for around 25-50p, and the women who actually make them probably get 10p a hundred. And, they say there's better money in India than their neighbours. Alternately, go to Tokyo and shell out an arm and a leg for a hamburger - it's all about exchange rate - ask the Polacs. :wink:

  14. Looks about as kosher as a bloke called Mustafa to me.

    Why fabricate that bottom if a shell case has a perfectly good flat end?

    Generally when it looks like a rat, smells like a rat, has a rat tail and eats cheese it is a rat.