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Honours and Awards

#1
Honestly it's not sour grapes, but I reckon the medal factory must've been taken over by yanks.

To be honest I particularly hate the MBE getting handed out as a matter of course for many personnel and especially the OBE for field ranks.  It is extremely rare now for a CO not to have an MBE.  Excuse me but I thought the million pounds per day and army of yes-men was enough reward for rising to top man.

And virtually every higher formation officer now gets a gucci medal just for breathing; usually OBE or CBE.  The odd Staffy or Cpl with an MBE is like those awards for lollipop ladies - cutesy and feelgood but still totally biased towards the higher ranks rather than on the basis of deserving and the dedication to duty.  A commander only needs to be mediocre to get his gong while an NCO really needs to work his or her arse off.

Perhaps many disagree, but - hey - I bet quite a few of you are nodding like Muhammed Ali on his 4th G'n'T!

Whaddyer fink? :-/
 
#2
Absolutely right - why should a Brigadier on about a zillion pounds a day get a medal just for doing his job (sometimes really badly)!!!
 
#3
Come on -smell the coffee.  Officers write the recommendation and as most of them have absolutely fu*k all knowledge about their toms, trying to justify why they should get MBE is impossible.

Simple, the officer club is a club and the occasional gong  to Cpl "er, thingaby bob, nice chap, ever so polite" keeps the ranks happy (so they think).

I was considering a charity hopping on one leg from Caterick to Aldershot to get mine  -  what do you think??
 
#6
Masha,

Course they do - did you think that a LCpl would be able to recommend his boss!!??

I just did a rough count of the gongs, it was about 68% to ruperts, and when you consider the Soldier to Rupert ratio for manning is about 20%  it has't to make you laugh!!  Officers - bless em... or maybe we (NCOs) just crap?
 
F

flash_to_bang

Guest
#7
It is all John Major's fault for doing away with the BEM.  A nice gong for the lads that CO's could put people forward and not feel out done because they hadn't got one
 
L

LE_OC

Guest
#8
Wrote my CSM up for one last March for an outstanding job done and he got it at New Year. Chuffed to NAAFI breaks.

TA are worse off. The QVRM (Queen's Volunteer Reserves Medal) was introduced by the Major regime to replace the MBE/BEM. This was partly to prevent the regualr army burgling part of the TA's quota of MBE/BEMs for themselves.

Net result is about 8 QVRMs per annum compared with 30-40 MBE/BEMs per annum previously

Another sad consequence is that this really has become the "colonel's medal" with very few serving colonels in the TA without one.
 

OldSnowy

LE
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#9
Story goes that the main reason for VRSM in and TD out was jealousy, as TA Offrs could get a 'real' post-nominal decoration, and Regs could not.

This had to stop :D

As to BEMs, yep, bring them back!  God knows, the people who used to get them weren't ususally well financially rewarded.
 
L

LE_OC

Guest
#10
Snowy,

Personally, I had no objection to the VRSM (Volunteer Reserve Forces Medal) replacing the TD (Territorial Decoration) . It also replaced the TEM (Territorial Efficiency Medal). The criteria for TD and TEM were identical - 12 years efficient service - except that Officers got the Decoration (and the very nice post denominals) but the blokes only got a medal. I, for one, was happy this discrimination ceased.

Not happy about the drop in qualification time to 10 years, though, but that's what the crabs did for their TD/TEM equivalents which were also replaced by the VRSM
 
F

flash_to_bang

Guest
#11
I recently saw an entry in London Gazette whereby a major (presumably an LE) in one of the Corps was listed under the heading "Forfieture of Ls & GC"-must have been a bad lad  
 
E

error_unknown

Guest
#12
One of my mates--only a Major(listed as a Capt )got his QVRM in the New Year honours so why is it a sure thing for Lt Cols ?.If you have done 25/30 years sorting the shit out as a Reg inf and TA other -given time and energy to the system etc why not a GONG with a trip to meet Prince Big Ears and a tea party to beat all the guys in the pub.
 
L

LE_OC

Guest
#13
Why? Because we already have a medal for that - the VRSM. Very long service is recognised by an additional clasp for each additional 5 years served. At the moment there are serving TA Officers at between 22 and 30 years service who are now wearing both the TD and the VRSM.

Why have another Long service, good job done award?

The MBE/BEM was there to recognise an outstanding task done irrespective of the rank of the recipient, his length of service or the duration of the task that was worthy of recognition. The QVRM has failed to do this with over half the recipients so far being field officers or above!!!!  

The firm has no need to reward TA officers for making it to Colonel -  surely the second pip is recognition enough.  
 
#14
The thing to recognise is that honours are "quota'd" in that each award will have so many earmarked for a particular "contribution" to the resepctive service. Each citation is scrutinised for qualifying criteria and then catagorised so that (in theory) the most deserving are given gongs. In essence it is a bit of a numbers game. The award criteria for an MBE is so wide and varied that the reaon field officers take the lion's share is because for each "catagory" of qualifying achievement you are most likely to find that it has been a field officer who has done the required to be nominated.

If there was more variety of award at the lower levels of the gong spectrum to replace the MBE then it would seem more evenly distributed. The thinking behind doing away with the BEM was to remove the officers/ORs distinction, whereas in reality almost the exact oposite has happened.
 
#15
If there was more variety of award at the lower levels of the gong spectrum to replace the MBE then it would seem more evenly distributed. The thinking behind doing away with the BEM was to remove the officers/ORs distinction, whereas in reality almost the exact oposite has happened.
This is a tricky one because the aim here is to ensure that one award ie the MBE is suitable for the majority. Awards are inherently divisive but they are here to stay whether we like it or not. From personal experience, if you are in command and if in doubt whether someone merits an award or not, then put their name forward. In writing a person up it must be shown that someone is doing considerably more than is expected of him or her ie. something that sets him/her apart and above his/her peers.
 
#16
This is a tricky one because the aim here is to ensure that one award ie the MBE is suitable for the majority
Ergo my comment. I cannot give any conclusive indication as to whether the total amount of MBEs being handed out to field officers who would have been awarded it under the old system plus a quantity of MBEs matching the number of BEMs that were awarded to ORs is the same as the number of MBE and BEM awards in the past ("old MBE"+BEM="New MBE")? I can say that without the division of awards the perception is that the bulk are going to field officers and that the ORs are not getting the same slice of the awards "cake" that they used to get when they were awarded BEMs. (If this makes sense, it does to me, but I have had a few beers and right now aliens landing in my back garden would make sense! I digress.)

My point is that perhaps doing away with the BEM leads to the perception of a dis-service whether or not that is true.
 
E

error_unknown

Guest
#17
TA are worse off. ...Net result is about 8 QVRMs per annum compared with 30-40 MBE/BEMs per annum previously...this really has become the "colonel's medal"
Our recruiting CSgt was written up for an MBE, for being a complete star, over an extended period of time. It was nearly two years that the QVRM turned up. Given the pressure from the top downwards to nominate deserving people, it was hardly a shining example of the system working well.

Mind you, it was noticeable that it was the only NCO QVRM in that list......
 
#18
Well you know the score as long as your muckers are happy thats all that counts its only cork with a bit of tin on top.So who cares sounds to me you lot should join the yanks and get loads then you can go down the legion and and tell stories .Be happy with what youve got and remember the gong is for the ruperts so let them fight over it at the end of the day the vc ect is the ones that count and I think that is not dished out for no reason so big hug all round waaaaaaaaaaaa show me your mess tins
 

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