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Help For Heros Shop

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#1
I will probable get shouted down for this but anyway here goes.. I think we all try to do our bit even if it is in a small way and to that end a month ago I phoned H4H and ordered 3 items having checked availability on line. Now we are not talking huge sums only 30 odd quid and that money came out of my account the following day. The delivery quoted was 7-10 days and as these are gifts to be sent out of the country for Christmas I thought I had left plenty of time. However phoning them a few days ago I was told the items were not in stock, but would be sent ASAP.
I think I should have been told this when ordering and I am not that happy that the money was taken before the goods were sent.
I dont think that organisation has done themselves any favours in this case as time is now running out and soon I will have to phone again and ask that they return my money.
Its such a shame, anyway you can shoot me down if you wish but, are there any similar experiences out there. :( :eek:
 
#2
Your consumer rights have nothing to do with the status of a shop. Business is a business whether or not the money goes to charity.

If you look at it from a consumers point of view then you are perfectly in your rights to be annoyed. If you feel you have a genuine grievance then take it up with H4H or even further if you feel that annoyed.

But lets face it this isn't really of interest to the entire ARRSE forum so please keep it to yourself and stop belittling overstretched resources that help you and yours
 
#3
Azrael2006 said:
Your consumer rights have nothing to do with the status of a shop. Business is a business whether or not the money goes to charity.

If you look at it from a consumers point of view then you are perfectly in your rights to be annoyed. If you feel you have a genuine grievance then take it up with H4H or even further if you feel that annoyed.

But lets face it this isn't really of interest to the entire ARRSE forum so please keep it to yourself and stop belittling overstretched resources that help you and yours
How do you know it's not of interest? I'm quite interested to know about this. I have already wondered about the cost of postage for items as it seems unreasonable on certain items and this just makes me even more wary of the online service from them. You state they are overstretched,where does the money for postage go, they seem to be charging enough to employ the necessary amount of people not to be overstretched.They are quick enough and loud enough at saying how much they have raised but don't broadcast at the same time that a £2 wristband costs £3.95 in postage. You also seem to think that we should be fawning all over them for help us and ours 'stop belittling overstretched resources that help you and yours' if theyre getting it wrong why shouldn't we comment?
 
#4
I admit to being horrified when I discovered that the £2 car sticker I wanted was to cost me the best part of £4 postage. Sod that I thought; I'll wait until I can get one in person. I wonder how many others notice the additional cost and cancel their online orders before submitting their card details? It would be a shame if its a lot.
 
#7
didnt know about the £3.95 postage. It is steep for an envelope and 52p for a large first class stamp...
But the original post wasnt talking about P&P, it was talking about a delay in order that he had payed for. Under his consumer rights he should have been informed of any unreasonable delay to his order and offered a refund if this wasn't acceptable especially if he had stated that their intention was for them to be Christmas presents.

What I do know is that most of the office volunteers are working 10-12 hour days at the moment with many of the main players working longer than that. They have also given millions to help the other service charities that share the same aim.

HaloMonkey, if you have a gripe with them, email them and make a complaint. Don't bitch at me about it. The charity is doing a damn good job and is making the most of riding on the crest of a media wave. I will ask why they have a flat postage rate for all items though.... £3.95 to post a car sticker thats worth £2 seems wrong
 
#8
Azrael firstly you seem to be carrying a very large chip on your shoulder and secondly you seem to be unaware of the function of forums. I am not 'bitching at you'. I am making a fair and honest comment on a forum.
The original poster was commenting on an issue he finds unacceptable, my post gave my opinions on the service provided by the the same organisation and my interest in knowing this latest development. That is what people do on Forums. If you cannot handle the comments being made, then maybe rather than getting all aggressive you should just not read the thread.
If the office workers are volunteers, it leads me again to ask 'where is the money from the extortionate postage charges going?' Also going back to your original post, I am a volunteer for 2 service charities and I would never make a comment as you did, implying that those helped by the charities should be so grateful, to those who give aid, that they should never complain when shafted.
 
#9
the point you keep missing is that if people feel wronged they should do something about it like follow the links Tremaine kindly put on.

If H4H stands by its P&P of £3.95 for a carsticker then people can get the Outrage Bus out and have a trip down to the shop. However there might be an innocent reason for it such as an error in coding on the website.

Don't damn them or take this one issue out of proportion over everything else that has been achieved. Most things that you can find in the shop they have in limited quantities in the H4H Office as well, if your fortunate to be able to pop into Tidworth.

As regards to chips on shoulder; what irritates me is that people these days are so easy to publicly criticise (and this is a public forum) without having given those critiscised the chance to reply/defend themselves.

HaloMonkey - Have you emailed or spoken to the H4H shop about your concerns over the P&P?

FlyingHussar- As per my original post, while I could have worded it better. I still agree that as a consumer you have been given a bad deal and I would suggest following Tremaine's advice. I personally feel that the outcome of your dealings is probably better suited to this forum rather than just starting a possible outrage thread. ( Which I seem to have fired up myself!)
 
#10
Most internet retailers charge a standard postage fee. That means they charge one amount whether you buy one item which weighs little or several items weighing a lot. This is done by automated process, the computer doesn't have the logic to know what items are small.
When averaged out this means that the business doesn't lose out on posting bulky items. Postage also covers such stationery items as bubble wrap, cartons, jiffy bags etc as well as the time involved. Charities shops cannot run at a loss because then they are using charity money to subsidise the consumer.
Web stores are usually built from templates which have postage built in. All websites will give you the option to accept or decline the postage and, if you feel the postage is unnecessarily high for the item then you should decline. Some web store have a 'stock' capability which means that they know when an item has gone out of stock, others don't. The money transaction is carried out automatically as soon as you enter your card details as the site doesn't store data like that. The best thing you can do is speak to H4H and, if you're unhappy, ask them to place a refund on your card, I'm sure they'll be happy to do that for you.
I recently purchased Christmas Cards to give out to all my customers, £3.95 would not have covered the postage involved so, if you like I 'won'.
The charity will benefit from the postage money as well as the sale so it is up to you, do you want value for money or to support a worthy cause? In this instant, unfortunately you can't have both.
 
T

Tremaine

Guest
#12
H4H are in any case doing great things, sure we all wish them the best and every success.
 
#13
Markintime said:
Most internet retailers charge a standard postage fee. That means they charge one amount whether you buy one item which weighs little or several items weighing a lot. This is done by automated process, the computer doesn't have the logic to know what items are small.
When averaged out this means that the business doesn't lose out on posting bulky items. Postage also covers such stationery items as bubble wrap, cartons, jiffy bags etc as well as the time involved. Charities shops cannot run at a loss because then they are using charity money to subsidise the consumer.
Web stores are usually built from templates which have postage built in. All websites will give you the option to accept or decline the postage and, if you feel the postage is unnecessarily high for the item then you should decline. Some web store have a 'stock' capability which means that they know when an item has gone out of stock, others don't. The money transaction is carried out automatically as soon as you enter your card details as the site doesn't store data like that. The best thing you can do is speak to H4H and, if you're unhappy, ask them to place a refund on your card, I'm sure they'll be happy to do that for you.
I recently purchased Christmas Cards to give out to all my customers, £3.95 would not have covered the postage involved so, if you like I 'won'.
The charity will benefit from the postage money as well as the sale so it is up to you, do you want value for money or to support a worthy cause? In this instant, unfortunately you can't have both.
You can have both. As I stated above I went to Halfords and bought my wristbands there. Maybe I've missed something somewhere and as so would be happy to be pointed to where it says postage costs go to the fund?
Azreal I see nothing wrong in discussing what is seen as a problem, For example, had I not mentioned the postage MIT would not have made the comment ref the postage costs also going to the fund and I would not now be sitting thinking 'oh I didn't know that, if I had I would've paid the postage for the items.'
Tremaine you are correct they are doing good things and I certainly wish them success.
 
#14
halomonkey said:
Markintime said:
Most internet retailers charge a standard postage fee. That means they charge one amount whether you buy one item which weighs little or several items weighing a lot. This is done by automated process, the computer doesn't have the logic to know what items are small.
When averaged out this means that the business doesn't lose out on posting bulky items. Postage also covers such stationery items as bubble wrap, cartons, jiffy bags etc as well as the time involved. Charities shops cannot run at a loss because then they are using charity money to subsidise the consumer.
Web stores are usually built from templates which have postage built in. All websites will give you the option to accept or decline the postage and, if you feel the postage is unnecessarily high for the item then you should decline. Some web store have a 'stock' capability which means that they know when an item has gone out of stock, others don't. The money transaction is carried out automatically as soon as you enter your card details as the site doesn't store data like that. The best thing you can do is speak to H4H and, if you're unhappy, ask them to place a refund on your card, I'm sure they'll be happy to do that for you.
I recently purchased Christmas Cards to give out to all my customers, £3.95 would not have covered the postage involved so, if you like I 'won'.
The charity will benefit from the postage money as well as the sale so it is up to you, do you want value for money or to support a worthy cause? In this instant, unfortunately you can't have both.
You can have both. As I stated above I went to Halfords and bought my wristbands there. Maybe I've missed something somewhere and as so would be happy to be pointed to where it says postage costs go to the fund?
Azreal I see nothing wrong in discussing what is seen as a problem, For example, had I not mentioned the postage MIT would not have made the comment ref the postage costs also going to the fund and I would not now be sitting thinking 'oh I didn't know that, if I had I would've paid the postage for the items.'
Tremaine you are correct they are doing good things and I certainly wish them success.
All monies paid to charities less costs are given over to achieving the charity's aims so any 'profit' from postage will go to the fund.
 
#15
Markintime said:
Most internet retailers charge a standard postage fee. That means they charge one amount whether you buy one item which weighs little or several items weighing a lot.
Err, no they don't. I run an online store as part of my business and it is very, very easy to calculate postage by item.

Markintime said:
This is done by automated process, the computer doesn't have the logic to know what items are small.
Yes it does because as the site webmaster is entering the items, he tells the PC how big or heavy the items are. Takes about 5 seconds per item. The PC then calculates the overall postage as well as any discounts that you have thrown in for large orders, repeat orders, discount coupons etc. Very easy to set up with zero IT skills.

Markintime said:
When averaged out this means that the business doesn't lose out on posting bulky items. Postage also covers such stationery items as bubble wrap, cartons, jiffy bags etc as well as the time involved. Charities shops cannot run at a loss because then they are using charity money to subsidise the consumer.
Wrong. Unprofessional sites work like this, professional sites don't as it drives away customers. Whilst mil and ex mil may just think "well, OK, it's for my oppos so I'll pay anyway", civvies may not and may feel ripped off and therefore click "cancel" before they place the order.

And I can't be arrsed to quote and correct the rest.

Long and short of it, H4H relies more heavily on civilian donations than it does on Military ones, that's a simple numbers game. By charging extortionate postage fees on small items they will be driving potential donators away.

I am a very firm believer in H4H and have purchased many of their items, usually in bulk in order to even out the postage. Their postage set up is a mistake that they simply need to rectify.

Has anyone thought of emailing them and pointing this out? If not, I'll happily do it. It's not nasty or insulting, it's just pointing out an obvious flaw that they probably aren't even aware of.
 
#16
Aunty Stella said:
Markintime said:
Most internet retailers charge a standard postage fee. That means they charge one amount whether you buy one item which weighs little or several items weighing a lot.
Err, no they don't. I run an online store as part of my business and it is very, very easy to calculate postage by item.

Yes they do, you may not but most do. I too have an online store and I charge £4.95 UK Mainland whether I am sending one item or a pallet load. It is true however that I sell higher priced items.

Markintime said:
This is done by automated process, the computer doesn't have the logic to know what items are small.
Yes it does because as the site webmaster is entering the items, he tells the PC how big or heavy the items are. Takes about 5 seconds per item. The PC then calculates the overall postage as well as any discounts that you have thrown in for large orders, repeat orders, discount coupons etc. Very easy to set up with zero IT skills.

Some online store templates will allow you to enter dimensions and weights but this is not always an accurate way of working out postage because it does not take into account factors such as packaging etc, a delicate item (glass say) would take far more protection and wrapping that a sticker. The weight of the packaging itself adds to the final cost of postage as well.

Markintime said:
When averaged out this means that the business doesn't lose out on posting bulky items. Postage also covers such stationery items as bubble wrap, cartons, jiffy bags etc as well as the time involved. Charities shops cannot run at a loss because then they are using charity money to subsidise the consumer.
Wrong. Unprofessional sites work like this, professional sites don't as it drives away customers. Whilst mil and ex mil may just think "well, OK, it's for my oppos so I'll pay anyway", civvies may not and may feel ripped off and therefore click "cancel" before they place the order.

What an absurd statement. I don't know of any professional sites that set out to make a loss. All sites charge sufficient postage to cover their costs except those that offer free postage because they have factored in postage into their profit margin. A site which is selling lightweight, low value goods as well as heavier goods may use a two-tier system whereby low value/weight are charged at a lower rate if they take standard packaging; some sites may offer free postage if the order value is over a certain amount. Small cottage businesses may well be able to offer a bespoke service but any large web store does not have one man reading the order, packing the item and then getting it posted so tend to standardise their operation.

And I can't be arrsed to quote and correct the rest.

Your rather pompous inference is that the entire contents of my post is wrong, that is incorrect and I stand by what I have said. I did not say it was the only way that sites operate I just explained how most sites operate. I set out to explain how and why postage can be a standard on some sites and that if ordering many items or larger items then the postage is very fair. I also disagree with your assumption that civvies are too mean to pay postage. Some will, some wont much the same as servicemen and women I should expect. I agree that H4H need to be advised that some potential purchasers might be put off. Any business or charity will welcome feedback of this nature.

Long and short of it, H4H relies more heavily on civilian donations than it does on Military ones, that's a simple numbers game. By charging extortionate postage fees on small items they will be driving potential donators away.

I am a very firm believer in H4H and have purchased many of their items, usually in bulk in order to even out the postage. Their postage set up is a mistake that they simply need to rectify.

Has anyone thought of emailing them and pointing this out? If not, I'll happily do it. It's not nasty or insulting, it's just pointing out an obvious flaw that they probably aren't even aware of.
 
#17
Markintime said:
Aunty Stella said:
Markintime said:
Most internet retailers charge a standard postage fee. That means they charge one amount whether you buy one item which weighs little or several items weighing a lot.
Err, no they don't. I run an online store as part of my business and it is very, very easy to calculate postage by item.

Yes they do, you may not but most do. I too have an online store and I charge £4.95 UK Mainland whether I am sending one item or a pallet load. It is true however that I sell higher priced items.
OK, that was enough for me to stop reading. Send me your shops email addy. I'll order £100,000 worth of kit and then make a killing on the postage alone selling them on!

I sell bits of kit ranging from things that weigh ounces right up to kit that weighs just under a metric tonne. Same postage for both?????

So me paying DHL for a 2 cm x 2 cm x 2 gm access tag "averages out" me sending a 990 KG gate motor?. If I charged the same for all I'd be ripping both my clients and myself off. ALL the major websites charge by item, charging a standard fee is suicide unless you are selling a standard item (DVD's are a good case for standard charging).

Sorry, but don't believe you unless you are either a) selling many items with roughly the same weight and size or b) ripping people off or c) charging that much of a mark up on each item that you CAN afford to ship a single item or a pallet at the same price, which personally I would see as a rip off on smaller items as you are obviously charging that much that profit margins on your smaller items are that high that you can afford to even costs out across the board.
 
#18
Aunty Stella said:
Markintime said:
Aunty Stella said:
Markintime said:
Most internet retailers charge a standard postage fee. That means they charge one amount whether you buy one item which weighs little or several items weighing a lot.
Err, no they don't. I run an online store as part of my business and it is very, very easy to calculate postage by item.

Yes they do, you may not but most do. I too have an online store and I charge £4.95 UK Mainland whether I am sending one item or a pallet load. It is true however that I sell higher priced items.
OK, that was enough for me to stop reading. Send me your shops email addy. I'll order £100,000 worth of kit and then make a killing on the postage alone selling them on!

I sell bits of kit ranging from things that weigh ounces right up to kit that weighs just under a metric tonne. Same postage for both?????

So me paying DHL for a 2 cm x 2 cm x 2 gm access tag "averages out" me sending a 990 KG gate motor?. If I charged the same for all I'd be ripping both my clients and myself off. ALL the major websites charge by item, charging a standard fee is suicide unless you are selling a standard item (DVD's are a good case for standard charging).

Sorry, but don't believe you unless you are either a) selling many items with roughly the same weight and size or b) ripping people off or c) charging that much of a mark up on each item that you CAN afford to ship a single item or a pallet at the same price, which personally I would see as a rip off on smaller items as you are obviously charging that much that profit margins on your smaller items are that high that you can afford to even costs out across the board.
I don't know how you operate your business but don't accuse me of ripping my customers off. You are, by your own admission drunk, perhaps you ought to sober up and think a little bit before you start sounding off. I charge postage per order, not per item. If you are charging per item then very often a customer who orders two items will be charged more postage than they should have been so perhaps it is not me who is ripping customers off. Only a fool would run a business with insufficient profit margins or perhaps just someone who doesn't operate in a fully efficient purchasing manner so his/her overheads are way higher than they should be. Mind you, you have shown how little you know of business by your absolutely stupid remark about buying £100,000 worth of equipment.
 
#19
Markintime said:
You are, by your own admission drunk, perhaps you ought to sober up and think a little bit before you start sounding off. I charge postage per order, not per item. If you are charging per item then very often a customer who orders two items will be charged more postage than they should have been so perhaps it is not me who is ripping customers off.
For fcuks sake, get real!.

If a client orders two items from me, the software works out the weight and size, the DHL courier charge and then charges them accordingly.

Not "per item" which is a rip off, not "per order" which is a rip off.

All of the carriers will charge less for, as an example, 2 x 100 KG packages that are going to the same address.

They will definitley charge less for a 2 Gm package going to an address than they would for a 200 KG package going to the same address. Even drunk I can work out that if you are charging the same for a 10cm x 10cm x 100G package at the same rate that you charge a 1 mtr x 1 mtr x 100KG going to the same place that you are ripping people off. You will NOT be paying the same for both parcels to the couriers so why rip your clients off by charging the same?

You can word it however you want to, all that people on here have to do is go onto DHL's, or any other couriers website, and see that they charge by size and weight. Therefore by charging a set fee you are benefiting clients that place large orders at the expense of those that place small orders, it's easy to see and it is wrong.
 
#20
Aunty Stella said:
Markintime said:
You are, by your own admission drunk, perhaps you ought to sober up and think a little bit before you start sounding off. I charge postage per order, not per item. If you are charging per item then very often a customer who orders two items will be charged more postage than they should have been so perhaps it is not me who is ripping customers off.
For fcuks sake, get real!.

If a client orders two items from me, the software works out the weight and size, the DHL courier charge and then charges them accordingly.

Not "per item" which is a rip off, not "per order" which is a rip off.

All of the carriers will charge less for, as an example, 2 x 100 KG packages that are going to the same address.

They will definitley charge less for a 2 Gm package going to an address than they would for a 200 KG package going to the same address. Even drunk I can work out that if you are charging the same for a 10cm x 10cm x 100G package at the same rate that you charge a 1 mtr x 1 mtr x 100KG going to the same place that you are ripping people off. You will NOT be paying the same for both parcels to the couriers so why rip your clients off by charging the same?

You can word it however you want to, all that people on here have to do is go onto DHL's, or any other couriers website, and see that they charge by size and weight. Therefore by charging a set fee you are benefiting clients that place large orders at the expense of those that place small orders, it's easy to see and it is wrong.
Again you accuse me of ripping customers off you tedious man. I charge one contribution of £4.95 per order. If someone orders a walk-in freezer off me they get charged £4.95 which is my processing fee. If you think that is ripping customers off you are an even bigger fool than I thought.
You clearly don't have a clue about business. If you think that rewarding customers who place large or multiple orders is somehow wrong then you really are more stupid than I had thought. Of course DHL will charge more or less according to size and dimension, they will also charge far less to a regular customer who gives them a lot of business (oh dear, how wrong of them according to you). My customers know that whatever they buy and in whatever quantity they will pay £4.95 per order not a whole series of postage amounts that when added together come to a ridiculous amount because in practice those different items will be placed in the same carton which will not necessarily be charged at a multiple of the individual items.
If someone buys a very large item off you which has a high value you are making enough profit because profit is a percentage, the higher the value then the higher the profit, if you are then charging full postage amount then that is up to you. I have never had a single complaint about how I charge my postage obviously my customers don't feel ripped off. For local customers I don't charge any postage or delivery fees, I deliver for free, do you? So once again, do not accuse me of dishonesty as nothing I do is dishonest, I hope you can say the same.
 
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