Discussion in 'Army Pay, Claims & JPA' started by recce-cpl, Apr 27, 2005.

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  1. Any help on this one would be great as this problem has gone too long .
    I was promoted to cpl feb 04 on low rate inc level 2 , i then completed my Formation Recce crew commanders course in nov of 04 , i allowed a few months for Glasgow and my pay office to sort its self out . I went to my pay office to ask about when i was getting crew commanders pay ( cpl higher rate ) , as per usual i was told it was in hand , then finally i noticed that i had the pay rise from low rate to high rate cpl on the day i was due my yearly inc increase Feb ( a year as cpl) i had'nt had any back pay to nov when i had been qualified as a crew commander and i had know inc pay rise in the feb on my inc date . Does that make sense ? This has gone on for almost 6 months now . MOST of my pay office are helpful , but i feel i am being told a story . Further to this i was a crew commander on an operation tour the day after i passed my course . Please Please can some body offer any advice on this , its driving me round the bend . :(
  3. 'Please Please can some body offer any advice on this'
    Can't help you if I don't know who you are.
  4. it's advice he needs, not for you to sort it out for him, and have you never heard of persec?
    why would he want to send his number to someone he does not know either?..
  5. Recce this is the situation.
    On 13 feb 04 you were paid as lcpl crew mech which was higher band with incr level of 7.
    On promotion 13 feb 04 you were paid as cpl crew mech which is lower band. P2k rules are that you must recieve at leasts 2% so you are on incr level of 2.
    On passing course on 5 nov 04 you move up to higher band , here is the catch as you cannot recieve a drop in pay you move to nearest rop (incr level 1) which happens to be the same as your previous rop.
    You have been identified as being in a group of soldiers where this anomoly exists. This was not in the original spec for P2k but has now been identified and is being addressed as p2k follow up work. I think the new rule is that you will move level to level ie you are due about a £3 a day pay rise back dated to 5 nov 2004.
    The work for this is currently being carried out but don't hold your breath it will take about a year I am told to take effect.
  6. Recce-cpl my next step in your position would be to write an official letter to the RAO copy to your OC/ CO something along the lines of:


    1. P2k was introduced for all ranks wef 01 Apr 01. As a result of passing a trade course, I was moved from Cpl lower band inc2 to Cpl Higher band inc 1 resulting in no increase in pay.

    2. SP Pol have acknowledged that this is an error and that there should be an increase in pay. DSPS have identified the affected soldiers and tasked AFPAA / EDS to amend the programs to correct this error. This may take some time.

    3. Please confirm that DSPS via DSPSI have instructed their staff to.

    a. Identify affected personnel.
    b. Write to all affected personnel explaining the situation and how they are going to address the underpayment.
    c. Instructed staff how to pay the affected personnel so that they are not financially embarrassed by the underpayment.

    4. If you do not have answers to the above could you staff it through the appropriate chain of command.

    Run it pass your troop officer to correct the SD etc.
    From here on in make sure everything is in writing.
    BTW the problem does not lie with Glasgow or EDS. They have only implemented what they have been tasked to do. At least SP pOl have acknowledged that there was an error and it is being addressed.
    Good Luck
  8. Truly rather amazing!!!
  9. cheers at ease

    I could be in the same situation myself during the next year

    How long b4 this anomoly is cleared?
  10. Not sure at present but could be at least a year. DSPS task AFPAA what the priorities for work are. This comes under the title 'P2k follow up'. See my earlier post, DSPS should have in place a system to identify those affected and ensure that a manual system can prevent them from being disadvantaged financially. This should be as a matter of course and stop a flood of letters being sent to Soldier Mag each month. I'm sure that they could implement a manual system whereby soldiers are credited with their monthly entitlement. Although these anomolies are regretable and sometimes inevitable a more proactive approach by the DSPS chain of command would stop anyone being financially disadvantaged by them.
  11. If you wanna see a disgruntled bunch of soldiers, go and look at the mpgs soldiers. All "new entrants" enter service with 4 years to their names. The pay office mess their pay up and they only receive 34.27 (or near that figure) which is over 7 squid less then what they should be getting. Glasgow really loves them!
  12. Recce - cpl
    Your situation was reported in
    Enclosure 1 to DSPSI 5200/31 dated 30 Nov 04
    and is in Serial 2
    Phase 2
     Movement between Pay Ranges.
    Soldiers who move between ranges as a result of an EQ change are not moving in accordance with the policy, as they have not moved in accordance with the level to level principle.

    The current planning date for Phase 2 is Summer 05.
  13. RECCE -CPL
    The information has been published in DSPSIs and is as follows


    A. Email to SPS FCoC dated 24 Mar 04.

    1. Introduction. As part of the process to resolve post P2K implementation problems, it has been agreed that a Local Suspense Account within AFPAA(G) will carry the burden of advances made in respect of P2K Follow on Work (FOW). This is intended to remove the risk of a unit being unable to reconcile their Control Account after each P2K FOW problem has been resolved and to give AFPAA(G) better visibility and control over the process.

    2. Re-enlistment and Re-engagement (R2) Control Account Advances. Payments in respect of R2 problems are being dealt with under a separate piece of work and are not to be included within the figure submitted for clearance (DSPSI 5200/13 dated 8 Dec 03 - Issue 15/03 refers). Units are to note that advances paid in respect of R2 problems are to be cleared on discharge in accordance with DSPSI 5200/14 dated 8 Dec 03 (D/DSPS(A)/5200/12/1/RPA) ‘Clearance of Advances on Discharge’.

    3. Units with Control Account Advances. Units are to complete the return attached at Enclosure 1 to this Instruction, for each individual who has been paid an advance against the unit’s control account for P2K FOW problems. Notes on completion are included within the return.

    4. Subsequent Monthly Advances and Clearance. Imprest Holders are to continue monthly to make up any difference for individuals who are being financially disadvantaged as a result of specific P2K FOW problems. Units are required to submit monthly returns to clear subsequent payments made. These returns are to be submitted at the end of each month on the closure of the Imprest Account. Units will be informed when problems are set live and when advances for specific problems should be stopped.

    5. Postings of Individuals with Advances. If an individual is posted from a unit with an outstanding control account advance for a P2K FOW problem, the paying unit should clear this advance at the end of the month after close down by submitting the attached return in the normal manner. This advance should not be transferred to the new unit. The new unit will then be responsible for paying control account advances to ensure that the individual receives their correct entitlement. Losing units are to notify gaining units of the necessary details that require advances to be paid.

    6. Units with No Control Account Advances. Unit that have made no payments are required to submit a nil return. Notes for completion in this instance are included within the return. Units are not required to submit monthly nil returns. If a unit inherits an individual on posting who requires an advance for a P2K FOW problem, or a soldier is discovered to have a P2K FOW problem, then the unit must submit another return requesting clearance of the figure advanced. Subsequent monthly action for clearance will then be necessary.

    7. Discharges. This new process should reduce the need to request clearance action under DSPSI 5200/14 dated 8 Dec 03 (D/DSPS(A)/5200/12/1/RPA) ‘Clearance of Advances on Discharge’. Individuals with P2K FOW problems should have their advances cleared by submitting the attached return at the end of the month on close down.

    8. Deadline. Initial returns are to be submitted by 1 May 04.

    9. POC. The POC in DSPS(A) is Maj EA James-Park (Tel: 94271 2608 or Fax: 94271 2568).

    19 Apr 04 Issue 5/04 D/DSPS(A)/401/RPA
    the form is
    uation Clearance Submission/Nil Return

    Section 1:

    1. Annotate the heading box above as appropriate.
    2. All units are required to complete Section 1.

    Cr/Dr Control Account Number :
    Cash & Bank Control Account Number :
    FSA Contact Details: Name:
    Contact No:

    Section 2: Individual’s Details and Reason(s) for Advances:

    1. Units, who have paid no advances, should move to Section 4.
    2. Units are to complete one return per individual.
    3. If the soldier is due discharge, then the discharge date is to be inserted.
    4. Units should tick the box against the appropriate P2K FOW problem(s) for which advances have been made.

    Individual’s Details:

    No: Rank:
    Name: Regt/Corps
    EQ: Discharge Date:

     Movement Between Pay Ranges.
     Reduction Or Reversion In Rank.

     Under PW Art 462.
     PW Arts 454E.a Reduction in Rank
    Management Action.
     Under PW Art 462A.
     PW Arts 454E.b Reduction in Rank
    for Discipline etc.
     Under PW Art 462B.
     UOTC OCdt MTQ2 Pay.
     SDRP On JSJET Uprange.
     Setting Of IBDs For Prior Held Rank.

     Temporary Crew Commander AFV On Transition.  Loss Of Driving Licence Over Transition.
     Exceptional Authority For AIP – PS10(A) Authority has to be in issue.

    Section 3: Details of Payments Made:

    List of payments made :

    Date of Payment Amount Cumulative Total

    Total outstanding Control Account Advance: £_____________

    Section 4: Declaration

    1. Units who have paid no advances should cross out all bullets bar the last and sign and date.
    2. Units who have paid advances should delete the last bullet and sign and date.

     I declare that this advance (the amount stated above) has been made in respect of a Post P2K Implementation Problem.
     I understand that I will be required to continue to make monthly payments to this individual until such time as the problem has been resolved.
     After each payment I will submit a monthly return for the clearance of the a/m control account. I will hold copies of all returns submitted with my control account documentation and on the individual’s pay file.
     The figure declared for clearance does not include any advances made for other reason(s) such as resettlement advances etc, as these and any such routine items will be recovered in accordance with normal regulations.
     The figure declared does not include any advances made in respect of re-enlistment or re-engagement (R2) problems. This issue is being dealt with under a separate piece of work and instructions have been issued .

     I have made no payments to any individual in respect of a P2K FOW problem as detailed above at Section 2.

    Signed: ______________________________ Dated: __________________

    Rank, Name and Appointment: ____________________________________

    Contact Telephone No: __________________________________________

    All returns are to include a unit stamp.

    Completed returns are to be submitted to:

    Maj EA James-Park
    SO2 RPA
    Gould House
    Worthy Down
    SO21 2RG

    Fax copies may be sent to: 94271 2568

    Copies are to be sent to appropriate SPS Branches for info.
  14. At ease

    Stunning work!

    But in future, I wouldn't ask for an Army number off the bat , it makes us suspicious lol :) Err unless you meant the MIL phone number that is? :oops:

    I'm sure no one would mind ' I'll PM you my number on the MIL exchange'

    Did you type that lot out yourself? Respect if you did.


  15. AT-EASE .
    In responce to your very helpful posts and p.m. i have got a good ish answer from Glasgow . I hope it will all get sorted by the time the pay 2000 summer down load thingy is done . At least Glasgow has acknowledged my drama . Thanks again . [flash width=250 height=250]http://[/flash]