Help/Advice reqd for a Camouflage Stand

Discussion in 'ACF' started by Fat_Cav, Mar 23, 2010.

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  1. Some help/advice required please. Not ACF but still Yoof orientated.

    Doing the local Cub Summer camp again this year (for the 3rd time and with my son) and as usual will be doing the 'Camouflage stand'. The kids love it but I've only managed to it half-heartedly. This year I want to do something special so that they can really enjoy it.

    Usually the (ex) Group Scout leaders Dad (with zero mil experience) waffles about camouflage for 10-15 mins then I take them into the woodline and hide them in turns using some DPM stuff I had lying about the loft, some scraps from a Cam-Net and some hessian strips I've placed all over a sniper type jacket 8O

    So, is there anything I can do or any ideas I can nick to make it memorable. I get about 30 mins per group and each group is usually 6 kids. Bearing in mind I don't want to spend £gazillions and last year it hoofed it down, the camp is also surrounded by half decent woodland.

    Please, serious ideas and not the usual suspects with their usual tripe. :roll:

  2. Mate try a "why things are seen demo Inc too little , too much , just right on the cam.
    Breaking up the body shape etc."
    Then do a just right and get the kids to look for the demo individuals ( be as inventive as you like )
    then get the kids to cam up in two groups and get them to look from a fixed point for the other group.Should make it fun for the younger ones
    Well done on working with the cubs by the way .
  3. I did consider the three stages but I had a time restrint, and with only 30 mins, it wouldn't leave much time to get all six done up and then still get outside into the woods. Also I doubt it would be fair to have three permanent examples for all the groups? (For 8-10 yr olds they get very jealous)
    This year I'm gonna get the old dad speech bit dropped allowing for more time for practical. I currently get two to cam up and I hide them off the path about 5m in the wood, then get then others to try and spot them, taking it in turns so that they all get a go (Time dependant).

    As for working with the cubs, I've got one son leaving this year to go to the Scouts/ACF/ATC and another moving up from Beavers into Cubs and my daughter starting beavers in June. I'm really keen to get my eldest to do the ACF as I'm really keen to become an AI or just help out, but having my son there is a double bonus. The whole Bonding thing, y'know!.
  4. Go beyond the idea of hiding people. Explain that some things just aren't "natural". We're led to believe that straight lines rarely occur in nature, so a straight line often is evidence of human activity. Set up a taught white cord as an obvious indication of this phenomenon. Line up the cubs in teams of two or three as a competition to find the most "unnatural" features.

    You will have prepared the area with things like:

    A tree growing in the middle of a pair of wheel tracks (an artificial Xmas tree (green!) will probably do at a distance).
    A wheel.
    Walk against the lie of long grass to leave an obvious track.
    A big pan of boiling water on a gas stove, set below the line of sight, but with steam rising.
    Have someone lying in dead ground relect sunlight onto shaded tree trunks using a mirror.
    A cut out picture of a bird on a fence - see if anybody notices that it hasn't moved.

    If you give them 15 minutes to spot, after 5 minutes, get somebody (not obviously part of your group) dressed in dayglo orange to casually walk across the area. The cubs will see him, but will they discount him?
  5. Kids like activity, who gives a bollox if they actually learn anything about cam as long as they learn a bit of determination, attention to detail etc.

    A quick practical demo of shape, shine shadow etc - could be "spot the ball" format with objects & a critique of why they spotted what the did. If you wanna be edjucashunal you could rob their cuddly toys for a natural history angle.

    Get them to cam up buddy buddy fashion (good for interpersonal skills), all at the same time so you can assist 'n give pointers, as well have maximum activity.

    Save the bulk of the time for two rounds of hide 'n seek.
  6. Not sure who your two papragrpahs are aimed at? My intentions aren't about learning, they're about; Cam-cream smeared young faces legging-it around the woods doing a bastardised fun-filled hide-and-seek.

    I know all about the intrices of camoflague and concealment and all the aspect's of teaching them the 'right' way, but it's not what I want to do, I was just hoping if there's any old crusty AI's out there who do something a bit more fun and interesting than the normal stuff we all did in phase 1 training?
  7. I normally do when the kids have gone to bed (finally) and I've downed several Stella's around the campfire after a busy hectic day. :)
  8. I wouldn't count on getting into the same detachment as your son, just a point to note.

    a) because ACF counties will put you where they need you, not necessarily where you want to go, and
    b) because many ACF counties have policies that don't allow parents and children to share detachments, because it gets in the way of promotions and course places; (your son gets promoted with you being an SI, and as far as everyone else is concerned, he only got promoted because you're an SI / he gets a 1-in-the-county place to go to Canada because he's very good, but everyone else assumes that you had some input etc) and general nightly running of the unit (can you really treat your son as you would another cadet?)

    I just thought I'd point it out so you don't get dissappointed.
  9. And a Fair point, it's obvioulsy crossed my mind, but I also put 'or just help out' as I know of several parents who do and get involved while their kids are attending and that's ACF & ATC. I'm also conscious of any conflicts on interest that may arise due to a parent being an AI, but no more than it does in any team/group, that attracts adults and their kids.

    If the 'him or you' question was asked regarding joining then obvioulsy it would be him, but if not, and he's dithering what to do when he finishes Cubs later this year, then I'll join.

    As for 'can you really treat your son as you would another cadet?' I don't see any issues, I shout and scream at him all day to buck up his ideas and to get his admin sorted anyway :D

    Cheers for the info
  10. Rubbish, you just wanted to p1ss on his chips! Wrecker!
  11. A camouflage stand?


    Wait 'til someone comes up to you and asks you where it is.

    Point to a random bit of treeline in the distance and say 'it's over there'

    'But I can't see anything' they will likely reply.

    'I know. Good innit?'

    Job done...
  12. And that's a policy I've never seen effectively implemented, or indeed even heard of in any parts of the ACF and ATC I've served in.

    The logistics alone negate the chances of it. How will the SI get to the Det? By car? How do most cadets get to the det? Via a parents car (some have to, but some are just lazy sods and their parents indulge them in free taxis.)

    One parent, one car families? The cadet and AI will end up in the same det.

    Ideally, this should not happen, or be condoned.

    However, in the real world it happens and is condoned all the time.
  13. I wasn't having a pop at anyone.

    Except maybe the CFAV's who think the Army bit is the purpose and not the Youth bit. It's ok for the kids to roleplay being a squaddie for their emotional development, as much as it is for them to pretend they're playing in the FA Cup when having a kick about on the local rec. Kinda gets in the way a bit if the instructors haven't got a firm grip on reality when engaged in the very real business of nurturing young minds and keeping them safe.

    Yes that is a bit ott when it's blacking faces 'n hiding in bushes you're about. It does sound like you'll approach it from the right angle. There's lots of opportunity for learning through experience and problem solving by rationalising. I get the impression you won't stifle that with mnemonics etc.

    If you do get involved with your kid, you will end up at the same det and he will get fast tracked. Don't worry about it, it's an inevitable consequence of him being obliged to attend as regularly as you are and it won't be resented as his peer group will be small enough and close enough to see the reality - they may even benefit too.
  14. Speaking purely from a sea cadet perspective having been involved on and off for nearly 35 years, there is a good proportion of AIs in the SCC who started because their kids became cadets.

    The process used to be a quick enquiry about what their trade was the first time they brought their prodigy down, then a casual "could you do a little job in the unit"? Next thing they are in uniform and usually serve for a longer period of time than their kids.

    The majority of staff in the unit with their own children in are more strict with their own kids than other cadets in the unit as they don't want to be seen as having favourites.

    Not ideal granted, but a fact of cadet life