Harry Dunn killed by US diplomat's wife

Joshua Slocum

LE
Book Reviewer
There are already different stories:

First: Harry was going over brow of hill

Then: Harry was going round a bend

He was on a Kawa Sports bike and probably travelling fast. Did his helmet fail/fall off?
speaking as a motorcyclist of some experience, hitting a bloody great lump of pig iron such as the Volvo XC90 head on will leave you dead as a dead thing
2 tonnes of swedish metal that is designed to kill a moose will make light work of a crash helmet, if they were both doing 40mph, thats 80MPH closing speed
even if the helmet saved you the shock will break your spine as you hit the front and then spin off
 

rampant

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
To be fair to Trump, having watched that clip twice he didn't say "We've all done it". He can't string two coherent sentences together without interrupting himself but he didn't say that.
I'm having too many conversations across too many platforms
 

Zhopa

War Hero
Got any more details on that immunity agreement?

One wonders whether it is legislation, or a gentlemans agreement. Then one wonders how far the agreement actually extends to cover family.

It was a special deal signed in 1994, that covers personal and their families at that particular installation. Considering the clandestine nature of the work being conducted it was a security measure put in place by the American Government just in case.
A bilateral agreement specifically for Croughton as a one-off? It seems odd... is this from first-hand knowledge?

Understand it's either the SOF (Status of Forces) Agreement 1952 or similar, just trying to find the exact thing
If I understand correctly (and a quick re-read of SOFA suggests I do), then it doesn't grant "immunity", just provides for prosecution by either the sending state's military authorities or the receiving state's civil ones depending on the nature of the offence.

If that's correct, and she was indeed under SOFA, then doing a runner (or being whipped out of the country) is even less excusable than hiding behind diplomatic immunity.
 

Sixty

ADC
Moderator
Book Reviewer
To be fair to Trump, having watched that clip twice he didn't say "We've all done it". He can't string two coherent sentences together without interrupting himself but he didn't say that.
"I won't say it happened to me but it did" isn't quite 'we've all done it' but, equally, it's not wide of the mark contextually.
 
I'm having too many conversations across too many platforms
Not you, the Indy article that you linked to. Trump is more than capable of embarrassing himself without people making up quotes for him.

"I won't say it happened to me but it did" isn't quite 'we've all done it' but, equally, it's not wide of the mark contextually.
Agreed but if, as a 'reputable' news source, you go sticking something in quotation marks it should be an actual quote.
 

Cutaway

LE
Kit Reviewer
To be fair to Trump, having watched that clip twice he didn't say "We've all done it". He can't string two coherent sentences together without interrupting himself but he didn't say that.
That possibly indicates just how independent the Independent is.
 

Cutaway

LE
Kit Reviewer
Agreed but if, as a 'reputable' news source, you go sticking something in quotation marks it should be an actual quote.
Ag who cares ?
As long as it fits in with the "Trump = evil" narrative what does accuracy or truth matter ?
 
One for a member of our Ol'Bill.
Jonesy asked a question a while back. In our law, does a person have to be arrested, taken to a nick, to be questioned under caution?
I only ask, because I was questioned under caution once (nothing happened) at home. Or has the law changed?
It’s been updated as recently as this year. PACE Code C, 3.21 in the above link. You can attend a Police station for a voluntary interview without being arrested.

3.22 refers to interviews at home ie instead of you leaving the stn, they must leave.
 

LJONESY

On ROPS
On ROPs
A bilateral agreement specifically for Croughton as a one-off? It seems odd... is this from first-hand knowledge?



If I understand correctly (and a quick re-read of SOFA suggests I do), then it doesn't grant "immunity", just provides for prosecution by either the sending state's military authorities or the receiving state's civil ones depending on the nature of the offence.

If that's correct, and she was indeed under SOFA, then doing a runner (or being whipped out of the country) is even less excusable than hiding behind diplomatic immunity.
What is so odd about granting diplomatic immunity to a base full of spooks? If it was not granted it sure as hell would not be in operation in the UK.
 
What is so odd about granting diplomatic immunity to a base full of spooks? If it was not granted it sure as hell would not be in operation in the UK.
Too broad a statement again mate.

US personnel do work at whatever it is they do in the UK without the need for any special diplomatic status. Unless of course the state department just does blanket applications for every cook, bottle washer, storeman and spook who does not directly work at, or in the embassy, or consular offices*. I met and interacted with a fair few in Wiltshire, Yorkshire and Northants and never had one of them wave their diplomatic status under my nose, or even mention it - or did they drive CD plated cars. However, go to NY city and you will see diplomatic plated cars (even American ones) littering the streets particularly around the UN and consular area, much to the annoyance of the NYPD.

Note: AFAIK diplomats working out of consular offices and not embassies have a lesser level of diplomatic immunity than embassy staff.
 

LJONESY

On ROPS
On ROPs
Too broad a statement again mate.

US personnel do work at whatever it is they do in the UK without the need for any special diplomatic status. Unless of course the state department just does blanket applications for every cook, bottle washer, storeman and spook who does not directly work at, or in the embassy, or consular offices*. I met and interacted with a fair few in Wiltshire, Yorkshire and Northants and never had one of them wave their diplomatic status under my nose, or even mention it - or did they drive CD plated cars. However, go to NY city and you will see diplomatic plated cars (even American ones) littering the streets particularly around the UN and consular area, much to the annoyance of the NYPD.

Note: AFAIK diplomats working out of consular offices and not embassies have a lesser level of diplomatic immunity than embassy staff.
You are correct, but the senior level folks do have it.

Let's leave the UN out of this thread though.
 

Zhopa

War Hero
US personnel do work at whatever it is they do in the UK without the need for any special diplomatic status.
This is true.

But in addition -

a base full of spooks
I am (honestly) reasonably confident that this is not what Croughton is, and that it is in fact a comms management and relay place just like it says on the tin. It's not Menwith Hill. If ever they moved the JAC there from Molesworth (as has been planned for almost a decade) it might be fair to mention spookery; but that hasn't happened.

I suspect this will be one busy lady right now though - School Liason Officer

Which doesn't unfortunately get us any closer to understanding the status of the lady in question or her spouse.
 

LJONESY

On ROPS
On ROPs
This is true.

But in addition -



I am (honestly) reasonably confident that this is not what Croughton is, and that it is in fact a comms management and relay place just like it says on the tin. It's not Menwith Hill. If ever they moved the JAC there from Molesworth (as has been planned for almost a decade) it might be fair to mention spookery; but that hasn't happened.

I suspect this will be one busy lady right now though - School Liason Officer

Which doesn't unfortunately get us any closer to understanding the status of the lady in question or her spouse.
I would hope the locals would not vent their frustrations on other folks stationed at that installation. It has the potential to turn ugly, rather like an incident in South Korea in 2002.
 
I would hope the locals would not vent their frustrations on other folks stationed at that installation. It has the potential to turn ugly, rather like an incident in South Korea in 2002.
Jonesy, regardless of the propaganda put out in America things have changed somewhat since Boudica rode about topless in her chariot topping Romans. People no longer live in hovels, nor do they wear animal skins and people even eat cooked meat too.

The average Brit would never say or do anything out of order so have no worries members of the USAF stationed in the U.K. are not going to get lynched from random lampposts.
 
Can any of the wallopers on the thread advise whether the woman would have been alcohol/drug tested before being released? Likewise, would her mobile have been examined to see if it was being used at the time of the murder accident?
 

Tyk

LE
Can any of the wallopers on the thread advise whether the woman would have been alcohol/drug tested before being released? Likewise, would her mobile have been examined to see if it was being used at the time of the murder accident?
If she'd waved her Diplomatic Immunity at the plod then I'm pretty certain that would be at least a qualified no. I can't see them looking at her phone and breath testing is only a maybe depending on how rapidly the CD card was played.

A lot of the NATO staffers I've worked with in Brussels/Mons have CD plates on their cars.
 
To be fair to Trump, having watched that clip twice he didn't say "We've all done it". He can't string two coherent sentences together without interrupting himself but he didn't say that.
No - In fact I couldn't disagree with what he said - its a terrible accident - its easy to make the mistake and revert to habit we have all done it.

That particular tweet headline is just an unpleasant stitch up by misrepresenting facts -
 
To be fair to Trump, having watched that clip twice he didn't say "We've all done it". He can't string two coherent sentences together without interrupting himself but he didn't say that.
The MSM's desperation to find any stick at all to beat Trump is faintly amusing. They're all becoming something of a one trick pony and therefore boring and repetitive.
 
If I were you, I wouldn't be getting into a debate with the Brits about this specific topic.
There's no debate, Americans dont care about this sport. It's never been popular with us Like Hockey, Basketball, Baseball, US Football, hell even Lacrosse or Tennis
 

Latest Threads

Top