Hammer and tongs badge.

Discussion in 'REME' started by gundog, Dec 15, 2005.

Welcome to the Army Rumour Service, ARRSE

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial military website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Anybody able to shed some light about the wearing of the H&T badge as a non=cringeing spineless yesman tiffy? My own interpretation is that any REME trade upto the rank of full screw could wear it. Stripies were not as they could be mis-identified as a stiffy. Dittto for artisan staffy. Please shed some enlightenment as there are some doofus types who need shaming.
  2. Class 2 and 3 tradesmen wear the hammer and tong. class 1 remove them. They can then wear them again if become a tiffy. Thats why the comment about full screws. Most tradesmen full screw are class one.

    VMA Class 1
  3. Read JSP 336 Vol 12 part 3, it has the answers.

    Armourers, metalsmiths, VMs, Inst Tech and some others can wear the as class 2 or class 1 tradesmen, up to the rank of (but not including) Sergeant.
    SSgts, WO2 and WO1 wear the badge if they are artificers.

    Tech spankers used to wear either an 'E' , 'R' or 'T' with lightning flashes I think. Tech Tiffies wear Hammer and Pincers.

    I think shipwrecks wear it too, but they don't really count do they?

    Paralog, if you spent some time on the shop floor instead of in front of a mirror, you'd know that class 1 tradesmen wear the hammer and pincers until they reach Sgt.
  4. It used to be that only the craft trades of armourer and metalsmith blacksmith could wear them
    however stiffies being stiffies thought they looked good and adopted them for themselves. typical, :roll: :roll: :roll:

    live everyday as if it was your last because one day you'll be right
  6. A subject with so many grey areas that I contacted the Corps ASM a while back for the final word. This is what he said:

    A tradesman from Crafty to full screw ( black hand trades ) can wear the trade badge on C95 slide
    and number 2 dress. Class 3 to class 1. Nothing new there.

    However, from the lastest Corps dress committee meeting it was determined that Sgts on Artificer
    may wear the badge to distingush themselves at SEME, SEAE

    Hence why the C95 Sgt slides are for sale with the trade badge on in the PRI shop in Bordon and Arborfield.

    Further research has shown me that while serving with the Household divison (Guaards) REME take on Household rank.

    A Guards Lance Sgt and a full Sgt both wear 3 stripes so to distingush a full REME Sgt the trade badge is worn above the stripes,this practice seems to have died out as most Guaards units seem to have 1 or 2 LSgts/ Sgts and they don't bother,although I do believe it still happens at the 2 Household Cavalry units.

    Hope this covers it!

  7. The then Corps ASM should have read Mat Regs then, coz it ain't changed for many years. It even refers to defunct REME trades like blacksmith, which we haven't had since the 60s.

    As for tiffy students wearing it, what a load of dog toffee, a Sgt is a Sgt, under training or not. Next thing you know, tiffy students will think they are senior to other Sgts.....

    I'm fairly certain class 3 tradesmen can't wear it either - will check though..
  8. Nige your quite right, class 3 tradesmen are not entitled to wear the hammer & tongs.

    It used to be the case that even class 2 and 1 Crafties wore them at most units but cbt 95 killed that one. Don't think tiffy students should be allowed to wear them. It should be only sub Sgt at household Div units that wear them to show the difference between what is really a fullscrew and a Sgt.

    What ever next? Tiffy students wearing a Q mans badge cos they might be one one day.
  9. And some of them no doubt will be senior Nige.

    Not all students are lance jacks/full screws when joining a course :)
  10. Wearing parachute wings displays to all that you are a parachutist. Wearing Pilots wings demonstrates to all that you are a pilot. Wearing tools demonstrates that you are a tool???!!!
  11. I really can't be arsed to look through the relevant JSP to find out who was allowed to wear the hammer & tongs badge back in nineteen tickety tick; however, as the Corps now seems to be leaning toward the Boyscout region of sartorial badging, surely everyone should be wearing hammer & tongs from Cfn Fucknuts to DEME(A)? It could be justified as an additional "tactical" recognition badge, just in case someone misses the capbadge, the TRF, the toolbox and the CRARRV. Or am I being silly?

    I did notice an artisan Sgt at Pirbright wearing three stripes and H&T this week on my travels. I thought it looked rather strange, personally.
  12. I thought C95 was designed to do away with all the trade/qual malarkey. To be honest we are getting more like boy scouts than ever. PS yes i am entitled to wear them and no I don't!!!
  13. Just to chuck this in.......

    Look on the 'Official' badges of reank poster etc or in the cap-badge CD thing in the clerk's office and the H&T badge is described as Artificer. nothing else, just Artificer. The idea that it came from RASC and was about prior to our birth in '42 is correct as far as I can work out. It's also true that any black-hand trade of class 2 or above can wear 'em but takes 'em off at stripey then puts 'em back on again at tiffy.........

    As far as I know, though I am as reliable as a Foden TTF
  14. T.wat
  15. I remember a Q man in the mid 90s who would tell Crafties there pot 2 paper work was threw then jail them for being incorectly dressed without their hammer and tongs on!!