Great Article in the DM right on the button..

#1
Maybe for a change hereabouts the DM is spot on........

Marry. Buy a house. Work hard and save. It's the life generations took for granted. But, says a leading historian, a seismic change is under way... The death of the middle classes | Mail Online

[h=1]Marry. Buy a house. Work hard and save. It's the life generations took for granted. But, says a leading historian, a seismic change is under way... The death of the middle classes[/h]
For a chilling glimpse of Britain’s possible future, look at the city of Detroit. Once, it was the capital of the world’s car industry, with a happy and settled population and all the trappings of middle-class prosperity, including an opera house, several theatres and a symphony orchestra.
Today, with much of the American car industry in ruins, it is a bankrupt, deserted, drug-addled war zone.
Who wants to disagree with that?
 
#2
Yeah. For starters the UK isn't a single industry concern like Detroit was, and secondly it's in the mail so has a high likelihood of it being total bollocks.


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Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
#4
the most toxic financial product on the planet is the mortgage - until we sort that out we are doomed.

case in point 2008 and we are leading up to it all again.
 
#5
Yeah. For starters the UK isn't a single industry concern like Detroit was, and secondly it's in the mail so has a high likelihood of it being total bollocks.


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Still doesn't alter the fact that that was the thinking! I was taught to spend a bit save a bit, it sort of worked for me.a good article I thought.
 
#6
Still doesn't alter the fact that that was the thinking! I was taught to spend a bit save a bit, it sort of worked for me.a good article I thought.
Couldn't be arrsed to read it but I imagine the words "benefit claimants" and "immigrants" are somewhere within that article.


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#7
It is a dribbling **** article. Sort of a Super-Mail article, sweeping up all of their dull tirades into one pointless flaccid limp dick of a non-story. The Detroit bit is particularly stupid and the sort of thing that dumb oafs would post on an internet forum thinking it had a deep meaning.
It doesn't. Mono-anythings are bad. Single industry in a town that someone else can do cheaper? Dumb plan for the future. See 'coal', 'steel' and 'shipbuilding' as other examples.
PS - read more, post less. You'll do well.
 
#8
The reason the middle-class is suffering is the same reason that the working class suffered before - the money is all being sucked upwards. And the Mail, with its union-bashing, blame-the-foreigners, 'UK PLC' cheerleading, has done a great deal to help that process along, by ruthlessly attacking anyone who tried to halt it.
 
#9
You can also see from the article that he now realizes that his children will grow up poor, regardless of their 'middle-class background', with limited real assets, no house, no stable employment and will have to endure a constant decline in public services as the state tries to service an ever growing debt along with the pension catastrophe that is on its way in the next 5-10 years.

He surely realizes that the government will move its attention towards the NHS soon and then schools which have until now been ring fenced. What happens when his children fall ill in 5 years time but the nearest hospital is 40 miles away, severely under staffed and the nurses are on strike? Or when his grandchildren can't go to school because the teachers are on strike due to low pay?

I think many people in the UK hitting their late 40s are realizing that the children in their 20s who are currently living at home with them will be stuck in low pay jobs for the rest of their lives. No way out. And all they can think to do is vote UKIP at the next election and move their limited savings from one bank account to another chasing below inflation interest rates.
 
#10
And all they can think to do is vote UKIP at the next election and move their limited savings from one bank account to another chasing below inflation interest rates.
They must be a bit thick then. There are lots of things they could do, demand reform of the tax codes for example, and the introduction of a salary multiple rule (the highest-paid person in a company can be paid only a certain number of times the salary of the lowest-paid), a clampdown on tax havens. All that could be done without driving the financial services people away.

They could also demand an APR cap, so that Wonga etc will find it harder bankrupt the poor and the benefits system won't therefore have to pick up the tab.

But no, they keep babbling drivel about 'UK PLC' and looking for someone weaker than themselves that they can demand to be impoverished and the money handed to them.
 
#15
I blame the gay black Jews, the Daily Mail's true nightmare
The Daily Mail has no problem with black gay Jews, provided they stay in their own country and don't attempt to get on the property ladder.
 
#16
#17
Mrs Thatcher did it. She paid, via house purchase discounts, for a lot of low risk low effort parochials to move up the social scale. Here's a handout become a tory voting property owning electorate.

And the something for nothing new middle class was born.

John Prescott was even taken by surprise wasn't he. When he asked a girl on benefits if she considered herself working class. "I ain't working class I don't work".

Without a working class there is nothing to stop the middle class responding to the gravity of the situation.

Was it 1819 we ended compulsory apprenticeships. Then we introduced state policing. Then state education. And with the growth of state so the industrial revolution and UK being workshop of the world ended. By WW1 we were behind world engineering standards.

We struggled through WW2. Then made the education system even more irrelevant by giving more rein to the academic mafia. Their middle class attitude became a nail in UK coffin. Academic subjects and, for the lower classes, "Vocational subjects". Cue the pseudo middle class professions. Social Work. Sociology.

Sociologists of course were set to work. The class system will decline in direct proportion to the decline of industry. Invent some new social labels.

Hence "Black community", "Gay community", "Asian Community" and the occasional special case designated by a "Close knit" supplementary label. EG "The close knit Kurdish community" etc

Imagine sociologists in an enclave. A shabby fluttering Union Flag above an old portakabin. The close knit remnants of the middle class community. "She was just a grocer's daughter. She ruined everything. If there is no such thing as society then there could be no such thing as a middle class within a society !"

Meanwhile the close knit mining community culturally strong male voice choirs are singing "Told you so told you so ha ha ha"
 
#18
I hate to say it but Kent Police were behind the collapse of the Middle Class all along - alternatively it's the Daily Heil, what do you expect? 'Hurrah for the Blackshirts!'
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
#19
The class system. like everything else, has adapted and mutated. The Middle Class isn't dying at all, what's changed is that much of it is now centre left, creating New Labour, where it dominates the Public Sector with some very toxic ideas, embodying the traditional competitivenes of the Middle Class but without the same recognition of standards and values, coupled with the need for self-restraint, which made such competitiveness socially useful. Cherie Blair minesweeping freebies is a case in point of how this new Middle Class carries a sense of entitlement without an accompanying sense of duty or responsibility.

We've emerged from a period of social flux in the Sixties and Seventies and the social system and mainstream values which inform it are now solidifying again, though a long way to the liberal left of where they once were. There is a new Establishment, every bit as intolerant and inflexible as the old one but with values and standards far removed from what we were brought up to expect - which is why so many on Arrse find themselves at odds with the current UK. Old taboos are now dead as mutton and there are a whole new set of taboos for society to get uptight about - like it or not, Mumsnet represents the new norm and is closer to the mainstream than we are - it's a brave new world and 'N!gger' is the new 'F@ck'.
 
#20
The class system. like everything else, has adapted and mutated. The Middle Class isn't dying at all, what's changed is that much of it is now centre left, creating New Labour, where it dominates the Public Sector with some very toxic ideas, embodying the traditional competitivenes of the Middle Class but without the same recognition of standards and values, coupled with the need for self-restraint, which made such competitiveness socially useful. Cherie Blair minesweeping freebies is a case in point of how this new Middle Class carries a sense of entitlement without an accompanying sense of duty or responsibility.

We've emerged from a period of social flux in the Sixties and Seventies and the social system and mainstream values which inform it are now solidifying again, though a long way to the liberal left of where they once were. There is a new Establishment, every bit as intolerant and inflexible as the old one but with values and standards far removed from what we were brought up to expect - which is why so many on Arrse find themselves at odds with the current UK. Old taboos are now dead as mutton and there are a whole new set of taboos for society to get uptight about - like it or not, Mumsnet represents the new norm and is closer to the mainstream than we are - it's a brave new world and 'N!gger' is the new 'F@ck'.
Very insightful and quite accurate in my opinion. I happen to be one of the much-maligned sociologists, although my area of research is not the social class system, and I concur with your statement that the new middle class embodies an entitlement attitude combined with a materialistic, "me-first" mindset. However, values are never constant and I am very certain that this too will change again. One of my professors said that social values change every 25 to 30 years, bascially with every generational shift. and a period of extreme liberalism will be followed by a return to more traditional or conservative values. Of course, these terms are only relevant in context, and the accepted definition of liberal, traditional, conservative, etc. will also change.

My father and grandfather are, or were, in the latter's case, firm and outspoken supporters of National Service as an excellent way to instill a sense of duty and responsibility, and whilst we had many spirited debates where I argued against them as a teenager, I am beginning to see their point. A society must clearly differentiate between rights and privileges, and this requires a fundamental understanding that there is a connection between duty and privileges, and responsibility and rights.
 

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