Grangemouth refinery temp closure

#1
Sorry if this been discussed but couldn't find on a search.

Grangemouth appears to be on a staged closure over the next few days ending in a 48 Hr strike by Unite union on the 27/28 Apr! It appears that this will have a pretty big impact and I'm slightly surprised it seems to have come in under the radar.

Presumably, there'll be an increase in fuel bowsers from central England!!

Linky: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/tayside_and_central/7356235.stm
 
#2
cromach said:
Sorry if this been discussed but couldn't find on a search.

Grangemouth appears to be on a staged closure over the next few days ending in a 48 Hr strike by Unite union on the 27/28 Apr! It appears that this will have a pretty big impact and I'm slightly surprised it seems to have come in under the radar.

Presumably, there'll be an increase in fuel bowsers from central England!!

Linky: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/tayside_and_central/7356235.stm
Expect Mad Max-style panic at filling stations. I remember the 2000 petrol blockade; mile-long traffic jams and police nicking punters for fighting on the forecourts. :roll:

Just as well Al Quida UK, with the exception of the 7/7 bombers, are a bunch of fcuking amuaters: if you want to bring this country to it's knees, you hit the oil supply.
 
#3
FrankCastle said:
Just as well Al Quida UK, with the exception of the 7/7 bombers, are a bunch of fcuking amuaters: if you want to bring this country to it's knees, you hit the oil supply.

And if you'd watched the news you'd have seen that the 6 upside down heads on trial for terrorist charges had Grangemouth as a possible target
 
#4
Spotted that and raised an eyebrow, though not sure what side i support

Mr Crotty described the union's claim that the refinery made £3m a day as "nonsense" and said Ineos needed to invest £750m into the site.

That site does indeed have an income of a few million per day. When i was last there oil was at around $80 per barrel and they are able to process up to 410,00 barrels per day, they are raking the money in and loving it.

However the site is formally a BP one and their philosophy is "squeeze every last penny out of equipment, use it till it breaks", that is used at every level to the extent that crash barriers and equipment sheds are left to rust as not a priority risk. Also a lot of major kit such as heat exchangers are the original ones from when it was built, plus the pipping layout leads to massive headaches due to impracticality. Ineos work at the complete opposite end of the spectrum, they keep all kit fully maintained and what to completely upgrade it all which is under way.

However im not glorifying Ineos, why the hell when they are raking in money do they need to scrap the pension plan after ripping out £40m is what gets me :x
 
#5
It doesn't need the brains of the proverbial to see where this could go. With fuel prices only going in one direction, it'll be interesting to see if it becomes a wider issue "down south"
 
#7
brettarider said:
FrankCastle said:
Just as well Al Quida UK, with the exception of the 7/7 bombers, are a bunch of fcuking amuaters: if you want to bring this country to it's knees, you hit the oil supply.

And if you'd watched the news you'd have seen that the 6 upside down heads on trial for terrorist charges had Grangemouth as a possible target
But they DID'NT. Ergo, they were fcuking amuaters. Which, of course, is a Good Thing. :roll:
 
#8
PJ, not sure about the site but, is it not responsible for most (all) of the oil from the north sea i.e. doesn't it go through the site before heading south?
 
#9
How ironic, looks like Scotland will be dependent on the English for the supply of oil. Surprised Mr Salmond doesn't have a master plan!

Joking aside, I will cheerfully accept Scottish banknotes in return for petrol at a rate of exchange to be determined by market forces :)
 
#10
pyrogenica said:
How ironic, looks like Scotland will be dependent on the English for the supply of oil. Surprised Mr Salmond doesn't have a master plan!

Joking aside, I will cheerfully accept Scottish banknotes in return for petrol at a rate of exchange to be determined by market forces :)
Laugh it up, mate; the North of England will be fcuked as well if Grangemouth closes down. :twisted:
 
#11
cromach said:
PJ, not sure about the site but, is it not responsible for most (all) of the oil from the north sea i.e. doesn't it go through the site before heading south?
Yup...supplies petrol etc to Scotland, Cumbria, Northumberland and most of North Yorkshire....but its been nice and quiet here....for a change
 
#12
Laugh it up, mate; the North of England will be fcuked as well if Grangemouth closes down
Time to consider rebuilding Hadrian's Wall as Mr Salmond wants to do, perhaps?

I don't recall a huge amount of empathy from anywhere else in the country when the Hemel Hemstead depot blew up the other year, and Londoners were queuing for hours and paying 20% more for their fuel for a few days until it all got sorted.

(stands by for incoming)
 
#13
pyrogenica said:
Laugh it up, mate; the North of England will be fcuked as well if Grangemouth closes down
Time to consider rebuilding Hadrian's Wall as Mr Salmond wants to do, perhaps?

I don't recall a huge amount of empathy from anywhere else in the country when the Hemel Hemstead depot blew up the other year, and Londoners were queuing for hours and paying 20% more for their fuel for a few days until it all got sorted.

(stands by for incoming)
Empathy? Is that part of the disease you humans call...sympathy? :twisted:

In all seriousness, IIRC, Hemstead was an oil DEPOT, not a REFINARY, which is, arguably, more important; there are only, what three major refinaries in the UK?
 
#14
Empathy? Is that part of the disease you humans call...sympathy?
Yeah, we tend to have humans down in the "beautiful south"! :)

You're right, my comments were in jest, but I remember them telling us that depots had weeks of stock in them, so how come a 48 stoppage is going to make such a difference?

Anyway, my offer still stands, all banknotes accepted for fuel at only 20% markup :twisted:
 
#15
Just had 3 phone calls @ home from fuel suppliers asking if they think i will require an EMERGENCY delivery of DERV this week as they cannot guarantee a delivery after 25th.....
 
#16
pyrogenica said:
Empathy? Is that part of the disease you humans call...sympathy?
Yeah, we tend to have humans down in the "beautiful south"! :)

You're right, my comments were in jest, but I remember them telling us that depots had weeks of stock in them, so how come a 48 stoppage is going to make such a difference?

Anyway, my offer still stands, all banknotes accepted for fuel at only 20% markup :twisted:
That's weeks of NORMAL supply, mate; the first thing that will happen is panic buying. Remember the response to the Hempsted explosion? Inspite of the public being told repeatedly there was no need to panic buy - that's exactly what they did. And Grangemouth is far more important than Hempsted.

It takes about a week to fully shut down the plant; they are starting the process now, so they can be ready for the strike. It will also take days after the strike to get everything running normally. And by that time the average punter will be wearing biker leathers, carrying a sawn-off shotgun and talking with an Aussie accent... 8O
 
#17
I feel your pain, out here were paying $ 3.27 for a gallon of regular unleaded..... then again who needs gas when you can just take the heel toe express. Or for you folks that have no moral standards, just go siphon gas from a neighbor you don't like at 3 in the morning. Not like they are going to be able to shoot you......
 
#18
Refinery profit margins in the UK are rumoured at the moment to be very poor indeed due to the increasing oil price (their feedstock). The bi weekly rule of thumb global refining data published by BP suggests they are well into single figures. Indeed all of the UK refineries could quite possibly be operating at a loss at the moment as they are high cost locations. A temporary closedown could be made to work to the advantage of all parties if it included a significant period of summer maintenance.
 
#19
Werewolf said:
pyrogenica said:
Laugh it up, mate; the North of England will be fcuked as well if Grangemouth closes down
Time to consider rebuilding Hadrian's Wall as Mr Salmond wants to do, perhaps?

I don't recall a huge amount of empathy from anywhere else in the country when the Hemel Hemstead depot blew up the other year, and Londoners were queuing for hours and paying 20% more for their fuel for a few days until it all got sorted.

(stands by for incoming)
Empathy? Is that part of the disease you humans call...sympathy? :twisted:

In all seriousness, IIRC, Hemstead was an oil DEPOT, not a REFINARY, which is, arguably, more important; there are only, what three major refinaries in the UK?
There are several smaller refinaries in the UK one of which, whilst not strictly speaking is refinary but a 'cracker' which takes one of the refinates to further reduce to gases, the residue is gasoline, Ol6 at Wilton wher I am this supplies part of the NEast market along with the depot at Jarrow which is supplied by ship from the Tyne IIRC, Grangemouth is only part of a huge market and supply system so a 48hr strike which will probably cause a week long outage will have a negligable effect, the problems come when joe public starts to panic buy on the back of the media feeding frenzy.
 
#20
Recruiting_Office_reject said:
Refinery profit margins in the UK are rumoured at the moment to be very poor indeed due to the increasing oil price (their feedstock). The bi weekly rule of thumb global refining data published by BP suggests they are well into single figures. Indeed all of the UK refineries could quite possibly be operating at a loss at the moment as they are high cost locations. A temporary closedown could be made to work to the advantage of all parties if it included a significant period of summer maintenance.
Not, strictly speaking, quite true as Inoes will have had to call force majeur on its products contracted to it's customers from units shut down because of the 'proposed' industrial action, shutting down for maintenance is a now a days generally a six yearly thing and takes up to two years to plan in any case ,most of the workers currently preparing for the shutdown at my own plant have come down from Grangemouth and the labour force is committed to lots of other places too. The 'strike' might not yet happen as shutting down these plants is long and complicated and IIRC has not happened in a long time, the cost of the losses due to shutting units down generally forces the company to re-think and continue talking until an equitable solution is found,no company saves money by shutting units down.
 
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