Going Soft?

#1
Many eons ago I was a REME Air Tech. In those days the Army Air Corp did its basic training at Middle Wallop. The ethos was very clear, if a soldier on the ground was hurting or in need of help, the techs, ground crew and the pilots and aircrew moved heaven and hell to get to them. In short although the rule book did not go out the window the soldier on the ground came first and everyone worked together to help.

Without Crab baiting we are all aware that for the RAF the safety of the aircraft comes first and foremost.

My question is this. With the formation of the Joint Helicopter Force and the fact that the Army Air Corp is now doing its basic training at RAF CRANWELL is some of the RAF ethos rubbing off on to the young AAC pilots to the point where the soldier on the ground no longer comes first?
 
#2
With respect, I'm not entirely sure that your point is fair - at least not given the multiple DFCs and at least one CGC (although that one is in the public domain, it was barely noticed when mentioned in the London Gazette) awarded to the RAF SH fleet in the last nine years, all of them for doing things which suggest that the safety of the airframe wasn't foremost in the minds of those flying the aircraft.
 
#3
I'd like to know what your motive is for asking this?

You may have heard of this recent mission;







MoD link

Hopefully the amount of gongs the chaps received for carrying out the mission may lay your fears to rest that the AAC has gone all soft and crab like.

You will find that only the very first part of the Army Pilots course is carried out at Cranwell (basic fixed wing) with the basic rotary phase carried out in the joint services environment of Shawbury. Army students then move back to Middle Wallop for the remainder and most important phse - advanced rotary and conversion to type. Trust me, any crabism inherited in the early parts of the course are soundly beaten out of them on their return to Wallop.


Edited to add;

As Archi suggests, the SH fleet of today aint exactly shy of daring-do and helping the guys on the ground out. Welcome to the post cold war world of the 21st century.
 
#4
Having returned from TELIC, JHF-I did not, in my opinion, cover it's self in glory with the old "there's a cloud in the sky or I can't see 100 mile or the helicopter needs a service" routine. You will have to try harder to convince me.
 
#5
Are we not taught to deal with the threat before dealing with a fallen comrade, otherwise we end up with a big pile of bodies of those who tried to helpthe first fallen.

Is this not what is happening with the helicopter assets. The last thing you want is your Casevac chinook being shot down when so many rely on the limited assets we have in theatre.

RP
 
#6
vampire_one said:
Having returned from TELIC, JHF-I did not, in my opinion, cover it's self in glory with the old "there's a cloud in the sky or I can't see 100 mile or the helicopter needs a service" routine. You will have to try harder to convince me.
I'll have to try harder to convince you????

Fuck off you BAT cunt.
 
#8
Vampire, you may wish to look at where BATs now do their training - away from the Corps they directly support and away from Wallop and ask yourself; 'Do Air techs have the ethos of supporting the chaps they work with now'?
 
#9
vampire_one said:
Lord Flash hart
Please excuse my poor wording of the question, the AH was never in dought. It is the SH that I worry about.
Dont worry your pretty little remfing arse, The SH boys and girls do a sterling job supporting the blokes on the ground. True, they may not have the background of being on the ground as some AAC pilots do but non the less, they provide a good service.
 
#11
vampire_one said:
My question is this. With the formation of the Joint Helicopter Force and the fact that the Army Air Corp is now doing its basic training at RAF CRANWELL is some of the RAF ethos rubbing off on to the young AAC pilots to the point where the soldier on the ground no longer comes first?

In fact, I'll correct you. You obviously do doubt the ethos of the AAC because your opening gambit specifically pointed out that it was your concern. Don't try to back peddle.
 
#12
I was in the process of listing medal citations for SH and AH crews.......

Its easier for me to call vampire a cnut though
 
#14
vampire_one said:
I know how it was in my day (Coward was a Lt) and I know what I saw on Telic 11. You figure it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And I know what I've seen you write on this thread.

You have gone from opening the thread suggesting AAC pilots are somehow losing sight of what their main role is - supporting the chaps on the ground due to spending a few weeks at Cranwell to then diverting your response to suggesting the crabs are a bunch of work shy back sliders.


If I were you, I'd quit whilst you aint ahead.
 
#16
vampire_one said:
We all know what the crabs are, but try to stay on thread and answer the question
Are you going to make your mind up what you are actually asking or should we just feed you your own arse now?

Q.1 is some of the RAF ethos rubbing off on to the young AAC pilots to the point where the soldier on the ground no longer comes first? - AAC directed

Q.2 Having returned from TELIC, JHF-I did not, in my opinion, cover it's self in glory - JOINT directed.

Q.3 Please excuse my poor wording of the question, the AH was never in dought. It is the SH that I worry about. - RAF directed.


Make your mind up. Who are you having a pop at?


We all know what the crabs are, but try to stay on thread and answer the question
I think I have. The answer being 'no'.
 
#17
vampire_one said:
Many eons ago I was a REME Air Tech. In those days the Army Air Corp did its basic training at Middle Wallop. The ethos was very clear, if a soldier on the ground was hurting or in need of help, the techs, ground crew and the pilots and aircrew moved heaven and hell to get to them. In short although the rule book did not go out the window the soldier on the ground came first and everyone worked together to help.

Without Crab baiting we are all aware that for the RAF the safety of the aircraft comes first and foremost.

My question is this. With the formation of the Joint Helicopter Force and the fact that the Army Air Corp is now doing its basic training at RAF CRANWELL is some of the RAF ethos rubbing off on to the young AAC pilots to the point where the soldier on the ground no longer comes first?
Now I love a bit of crab bashing at the best of times, however, this RAF ethos you mention, have you seen 'Above Enemy lines?' Have you seen (as previously mentioned) the recent flying gongs handed out?

I didn't see any pilots shirking away from danger there. I think you should do a little research and then come back.
 
#18
FinalRV said:
Now I love a bit of crab bashing at the best of times, however, this RAF ethos you mention, have you seen 'Above Enemy lines?' Have you seen (as previously mentioned) the recent flying gongs handed out?

I didn't see any pilots shirking away from danger there. I think you should do a little research and then come back.
Very true. I too am usually the first to crab bash but on this occasion and due to vampires cock of a question, I shall suggest he is a bit limited in the cranial department. His first question has been answered - young AAC pilots do not have this supposed RAF ethos of not giving a fcuk. He seems to think that our chaps get brain washed by crabisms due to spending such a huge amount of time with them in the training system.

As I've said, AAC chaps spend a very short period of time at Cranwell (does he know that there are AAC fixed wing instructors there too?). When they go to Shawbury, they are in a joint environment (not so much when they go on to 660 Sqn AAC as that is an Army squadron commanded by an AAC Maj. And I know for a fact that he is not the sort of chap who would allow any AAC chap to show certain crab traits.

I would be interested to know on what vampire bases his question on? Has he been fecked off for a cabby by an AAC chap in theatre?
 
#19
Q.1 is some of the RAF ethos rubbing off on to the young AAC pilots to the point where the soldier on the ground no longer comes first? - AAC directed

Q.2 Having returned from TELIC, JHF-I did not, in my opinion, cover it's self in glory - JOINT directed. (INCLUDES AAC? or are they excluded?)

Q.3 Please excuse my poor wording of the question, the AH was never in dought. It is the SH that I worry about. - RAF directed.(and AAC? or are they excluded!)

My
BOLD
Flashart u bend em I did mend em (I don't need a freeby flight)
 

Fugly

LE
DirtyBAT
#20
All I can say is thank fuck you're an EX-BAT. We've enough to be dealing with, without buffoons like you around.

Did you ever pass your UT test?
 

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