German, French and British Army?????

T

Tango34

Guest
#1
So i see from tonights "New at Ten" that our amazing "Leader" has turned the armed forces over to a 3 way control of Germany, France and UK. Lets me get this right?

France - Didn't want to go to Gulf 2, and even spent time in the War spying on British Troops and passing the data to the Enemy.

Germany - As above!

So we now can completely trush the above countrys to lead this great nations force in all things military?

My only question has to be......

I belive that we have signed up as CROWN Forces and not Labour Forces, so for Blair to take us in did he have the Queens go ahead? If not is this treason? Can I / We refuse to follow an order from France / Germany as they arn't the head of GB? To refuse to soldier, on an unlawfull order is within our rights, so as we have sworn ourselves to the Crown, any orders given by the NEW European Armed Force, that hasn't come directly from the Crown would be an unlawfull order?
 
#2
Although you swore to serve the Queen, the bad news is that you also swor to serve the elected government. If the no-hopers in the labour party say you have to fight for the lower house of the inner mongolian bad breath party....... you're on your way east..... you signed on the dotted line :-(
 
#3
Plant-Pilot said:
Although you swore to serve the Queen, the bad news is that you also swor to serve the elected government. If the no-hopers in the labour party say you have to fight for the lower house of the inner mongolian bad breath party....... you're on your way east..... you signed on the dotted line :-(
Nobody swore to serve the elected Government. The Government serves Parliament, we serve Parliament and the will of Parliament, not the Government.
 
#4
you said you would obey the orders of those appointed by the queen to have command over you. Unfortunatley that includes elected representitives
 
#5
from oath certificate

''will observe and obey all orders of her majesty, her heirs and successors and of the generals and officers set over me''
 

Cutaway

LE
Kit Reviewer
#6
Chuzu said:
from oath certificate

''will observe and obey all orders of her majesty, her heirs and successors and of the generals and officers set over me''
Yep, seems fair to me. 'General' seems pretty obvious, and as a trog I can only understand 'officer' to mean some bloke holding a commission......

Therefore, Poke it Tone !
(goes for the frogs & boxheads too)
 
#7
No he hasn't. If you can't understand the concept of a task force involving units from different countries - why weren't you horrified by NATO? And why aren't the Yanks up in arms because 15MEU went in under the command of a British formation? Not just that, decisions on employing an EU task force will be made unanimously - just as in the Nato Council - so if one state says no, no dice.
 
T

Tango34

Guest
#8
So lets get this right,

If GB and or the USA decide to go to war together again and

France say no ( They "might" be involved with the country in question ).

We can't go?

But if France want to go to war and we say no they will just send in 2 REP??

That seams fair dosn't it?
 
#9
Apologies for my ignorance, but can someone clear this up for me?
Are we saying that the hun and the crapauds now have control over our forces? Or have I got the wrong end of the stick? Tad confused... :?
 
#10
You're confused - I have this strange feeling that I want to invade Poland and an even stranger feeling that I then want to invade France and surrender to myself.
 
#11
nurse said:
you said you would obey the orders of those appointed by the queen to have command over you. Unfortunatley that includes elected representitives
The Government has no power over anything and anything they propose, anything they suggest, or anything they say they will do, needs to be ratified by Parliament. Bliar is one man with one vote out of 650 in Parliament.

Why do you think he would've resigned if he would have lost the vote in Parliament to go into Iraq? It's because he had ONE vote for himself. Parliament made the decision, NOT the Government. The only elected body with any power over the army is Parliament, not the Government, and Parliament as a whole, of which the Government is only the executive, makes the decisions.

Bliar has no rank in the armed forces, unlike the Pres of USA who is CinC, and doesn't even have to be saluted by the lowest of the low, and technically the generals and chief of staff can gainsay him, the GOvernment, and Parliament with the Monarchys assent.

Why is our system so difficult to understand? This isn't the USA, Bliar and the Government have no military role.
 
#12
so if one state says no, no dice.
Part of the negotiations on the EU constitution sees the national veto being abolished and qualified majority voting coming into effect, meaning there will be no veto.

On present numbers we would not have gone into Iraq at all if qualified majority voting had made the decision.

Bliar can say he has red lines over defence and foreign policy, and taxes, but once we get rid of the veto, hard fought for by Thatcher, and later Major at Maastricht, and which he has already pretty much given away, his red lines won't mean fckall because we would have no choice but to abide by the vote of the majority.

It's a fcking con and why he is so shyte scared of giving the people a referendum on the EU constitution, but once its passed, all power pretty much goes to Europe.
 
#13
Macks said:
Apologies for my ignorance, but can someone clear this up for me?
Are we saying that the hun and the crapauds now have control over our forces? Or have I got the wrong end of the stick? Tad confused... :?
Once Bliar signs up to the new EU constitution, and the EUgoes over completely to qualified majority voting, yes, pretty much.
 
#14
Macks said:
Apologies for my ignorance, but can someone clear this up for me?
Are we saying that the hun and the crapauds now have control over our forces? Or have I got the wrong end of the stick? Tad confused...
give it a couple of years and the europeans will have control of all of our Rapid Response Company( formly known as HMF). because that's all we will need alledgedly, technology will do the rest.
 
#15
WHAT?
Who on earth is letting this happen? Surely Blair must realise that no-one wants to sign up to this new EU Constitution, and by forcing it upon the country, he is effectively signing his death warrant as PM?
 
#16
Macks said:
WHAT?
Who on earth is letting this happen? Surely Blair must realise that no-one wants to sign up to this new EU Constitution, and by forcing it upon the country, he is effectively signing his death warrant as PM?
After Telic he is the Spam baby and has years of dinner appearances booked in advance at 200K a pop, he even has an agent already courtesy of Clinton, and he will be a leading light in the New European Superstate, commissions or whatever, at a massive salary and perks to match tax free, so do you really think he gives a fck about the UK or the PM's job now that he isn't the apple of everybody's eye?

HE's sold everything and everybody in this country down the pan to ensure his own future, no state pension for that cnut.
 
#17
just remember our current prime minister is the labour candidate who swung a 33% labour majority into 16%defeat in beconsfield in 1982!! as I was on my way south... i think I'm right on figures but as usual i will probably be wrong
 
T

Tango34

Guest
#18
What can we all do to stop this......

You must talk to everone you can, get the people talking about this issue, and who knows......

At last the "Sun" newspaper is starting to wake up and shout about it, but unless the General Public start to wake up to the facts of what is happening, then we don't have a chance.

If you would like information about what is happening, The Sun has produced a free booklet on Europe in plain English, or contact me and ill email you some info...

By not having a referendum on Europe Blair is bringing massive problems on his own position of power.

We must act now to save OUR COUNTRY.

Regards

Tango34
 
#19
I hope Tony and The Goon are reading this.

The day that pair of back stabbing turncoats turn us ofer to Chirac and Schreoder is the day we lose everything sacred to us.

I will never give in to a frog eating snail quaffing garlic smelling TW*T like that so they can ram it. If it happens I am out.

The only thing good coming out of France is the Furkin tunnel. And that needs a 5 meter thick metal door that can be closed and controlled from our side only. Then when we send a nuke through to Paris we can shut the door.
 
#20
Right - the EU defence deal does not, in any circumstances, give anybody else a veto over unilateral British action. It does not in any circumstances require action against the wishes of the UK government. What it does do is make it possible for an EU multi-national force to be used in the event that a NATO joint task force cannot (for example - if one of the non-European NATO states doesn't want to know). This force consists of units provided by EU members.

Decisions on the use of this force are subject to unanimous decision (i.e veto) and are taken by the general affairs council (the EU foreign ministers' meeting) or the European Council (the heads of government) and NOT by the European Commission (the executive in Brussels) or by any individual member state - this would not have changed had the intergovernmental conference agreed on the Constitution, as it was one of the few things they did agree. The Constitution did not require the elimination of all national vetoes anyway. (Unfortunately, though, because they failed to agree on the final text, we'll have to go through this all over again under the Irish presidency.)

With regard to the proposed planning cell, this will now happen. In the event that NATO does not get involved and the EU members agree to act, the first option is to nominate a member as the lead and assign the planning to their national headquarters - in our case obviously PJHQ. This is limited to a choice between UK/Spain/Germany/France/Italy/Greece for obvious reasons. Only if this is not possible will the EU planning cell be activated on an ad hoc basis. An EU representation at SHAPE will be created. The defence arrangements have been signed-off independently of the Constitution, so at least something may get done.
 

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