General Election 2017 - The Consequences

Unless they're gay, in which case he'll happily vote against them having the same rights as everyone else...
Im not so sure this will hurt him as much as Labour hope

The Trouble we now have in the West is that equality and Tolerance is now all to often equated with you agree with and or support, to express any other position is portrayed as bigotry.

Its a false equivalence and the trouble is poor legislation aimed at equality is effectively enforcing this.
Its all well and good giving group A the right to X but what about group Bs rights.

Whilst preaching tolerance and equality - we are creating a system which has absolutely no tolerance for any one who dares have an opinion not currently in vogue.

As to JRM
He opposes Gay marriage, abortion and the death penalty as a result of his religious beliefs - They are his opinions - he is entitled to them, and people are entitled to challenge them.

The usual suspects screaming Homophobe at him** - isn't doing that.
I dont agree with Mr Mogg - but I do believe that a tolerant society should allow people to have and express opinions that the moral majority dont agree with - I also believe that tolerance should be extended to peoples religious beliefs (and not just some religions).

Ergo no religious institution should be compelled to marry a gay couple, at the same time a deeply religious family run BnB shouldn't be compelled to accept unmarried straight or gay couples, an opinion I share with Mr Tatchell. At present they are entitled to refuse the former but not the latter, ( effectively Gays have more rights than straight people on this issue)- which is the problem with the whole equal rights legislation - trying to work out whose rights trumps whose. Do my rights to worship and my beliefs trump those of a Gay couple - which of course depends on religion*** - Im yet to see anyone challenging Muslim Imams, businesses, Mosques and politicians for expressing the same views as Christian ones. (For the record all religion can go hang itself in my opinion)

The intolerance and denigration of those who dont agree with something may well see far more support for Mr Mogg in the future - Not because they agree with him - but because this nasty insidious intolerant culture is affecting more and more people, because the demands are getting more extreme and the possibility of avoiding giving offence more and more difficult.

Peter Tatchell, Germaine greer , and other leading rights activists have all been labelled as bigots and stopped from speaking - because they havent endorsed the latest fashionable course or worse in Tatchells case not because he did or said anything offensive but because he spoke out against censorship.

**Whilst of course ignoring the large number of Labour MPs with similar religious beliefs

***I dont claim that's a fact of law - but it does reflect the approach and actions of the activists and perhaps how keen people are to apply the law.

Edit - For clarity - I quoted you and the point - Other than the bit in blue the response isn't to you - its more general
Just in case thanks to poor grammar or use of words - it appears I'm calling you an intolerant activist - Im not and wouldn't -
 
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Brussels eh, telling us who to vote for, when to vote for them, how often.
Your sarcasm may be misplaced, given the Irish experience of EU-related referenda - vote again until the "correct" answer is given!

I'm quite surprised Juncker hasn't told May to make us vote on membership again yet,
 
And when asked of this responded that it's his own personal view and wouldn't expect it to come up before the commons as there are already laws for this sort of tragic circumstance. It seems acceptable to press MP's who openly proclaim their Christian faith (Tim Fallon being one example) on their faiths interpretation but wouldn't dare do it to others for fear of being cast as xenophobic.
I don't think it's ok for Tim Fallon to be guided by delusions in matters of legislation either
 

skid2

LE
Book Reviewer
Your sarcasm may be misplaced, given the Irish experience of EU-related referenda - vote again until the "correct" answer is given!

I'm quite surprised Juncker hasn't told May to make us vote on membership again yet,
Ireland, that’s the southern, bit, the one which wasn’t involved in our referendum. Is a separate sovereign country. I don’t see Ireland suffering.

There’s nothing wrong with changing your mind if you’ve made a decision based on wrong or erroneous information. It’s the mark of a grown up country.

They’d threatened to bring in water charges in the south, people protested. They brought the water charges in. People still protested and continued to do so. The water charges were withdrawn after a successful campaign and anyone who has paid has received a refund.
Is there something wrong with that.

But to carry on with Brexit on information which is based on a tissue of lies and a farrago of bullshit. It’s the height of nonsense. What? We’re British and we don’t make mistakes.
 
Brexit in TM's tenure is going to upset the applecart in a big way. We have the emerging corbeeeen appealing to the voters who have never heard of a terror campaign or the cold war outside of their school history classes which thanks to Blair are watered down to acts of freedom fighters and dictatorship. New voting public wants the changes that this bastrad offers along with the likes of Diane Abbot. Save what you can people, my investments other than my house are going offshore.
 
Ireland, that’s the southern, bit, the one which wasn’t involved in our referendum. Is a separate sovereign country. I don’t see Ireland suffering.

There’s nothing wrong with changing your mind if you’ve made a decision based on wrong or erroneous information. It’s the mark of a grown up country.

They’d threatened to bring in water charges in the south, people protested. They brought the water charges in. People still protested and continued to do so. The water charges were withdrawn after a successful campaign and anyone who has paid has received a refund.
Is there something wrong with that.

But to carry on with Brexit on information which is based on a tissue of lies and a farrago of bullshit. It’s the height of nonsense. What? We’re British and we don’t make mistakes.
Tsk. Some people take far too seriously things that are necessarily meant to be taken seriously.
 
But to carry on with Brexit on information which is based on a tissue of lies and a farrago of bullshit. It’s the height of nonsense. What? We’re British and we don’t make mistakes.
Selective quote so I can address the point.

Whether you believe people voted to Remain or Leave based on a so-called "tissue of lies" is completely and utterly irrelevant, the majority voted to Leave and as there was no caveat inserted into the question then we leave, simple as and no amount of moaning/crowing alters that.

Every local and GE is held under the same circumstances, manifesto's are written later to be largely discarded and promises are made which are quietly forgotten about.
 
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Unless they're gay, in which case he'll happily vote against them having the same rights as everyone else...
You seem to have this obsession with gays. Are you sure you are not one yourself? It's ok to "Come out" (think that is the phrase) on here. Given that there was a services pink club get together outside the UJC last year then it is indeed seen as the "norm". I'm not sure the founder Ethel McCaul would agree but there we are.
 

skid2

LE
Book Reviewer
Selective quote so I can address the point.

Whether you believe people voted to Remain or Leave based on a so-called "tissue of lies" is completely and utterly irrelevant, the majority voted to Leave and as there was no caveat inserted into the question then we leave, simple as and no amount of moaning/crowing alters that.

Every local and GE is held under the same circumstances, manifesto's are written later to be largely discarded and promises are made which are quitely forgotten about.
The original question was to the Irish referendum. It was decided to have a rerun based on more information. It had a different result.

Had the Irish thought they were being coerced or railroaded you can be fairly sure few of them would have bothered their backsides going out to vote.
 
Selective quote so I can address the point.

Whether you believe people voted to Remain or Leave based on a so-called "tissue of lies" is completely and utterly irrelevant, the majority voted to Leave and as there was no caveat inserted into the question then we leave, simple as and no amount of moaning/crowing alters that.

Every local and GE is held under the same circumstances, manifesto's are written later to be largely discarded and promises are made which are quitely forgotten about.
You'd think the superior intellects and giant brains of the Remainers would have easily dismissed the "information which is based on a tissue of lies and a farrago of bullshit" and convinced all the stupid, thick, homophobic, ignorant, racist old xenophobic Little Englanders to do as they're told.

Strange that they never managed it the first time; even stranger that they think they can do it now.

Most curious.
 

skid2

LE
Book Reviewer
You'd think the superior intellects and giant brains of the Remainers would have easily dismissed the "information which is based on a tissue of lies and a farrago of bullshit" and convinced all the stupid, thick, homophobic, ignorant, racist old xenophobic Little Englanders to do as they're told.

Strange that they never managed it the first time; even stranger that they think they can do it now.

Most curious.
You’re the only one mentioning stupid, thick, homophobic, ignonorant, racist old xenophobic little englanders.
Many of whom believed what they read on the side of a bus.
Curious isn’t even close
 
You seem to have this obsession with gays. Are you sure you are not one yourself? It's ok to "Come out" (think that is the phrase) on here. Given that there was a services pink club get together outside the UJC last year then it is indeed seen as the "norm". I'm not sure the founder Ethel McCaul would agree but there we are.
I wasn't aware I had an obsession with them. Can you point out the posts that made you think that?
 
Im not so sure this will hurt him as much as Labour hope

The Trouble we now have in the West is that equality and Tolerance is now all to often equated with you agree with and or support, to express any other position is portrayed as bigotry.

Its a false equivalence and the trouble is poor legislation aimed at equality is effectively enforcing this.
Its all well and good giving group A the right to X but what about group Bs rights.

Whilst preaching tolerance and equality - we are creating a system which has absolutely no tolerance for any one who dares have an opinion not currently in vogue.

As to JRM
He opposes Gay marriage, abortion and the death penalty as a result of his religious beliefs - They are his opinions - he is entitled to them, and people are entitled to challenge them.

The usual suspects screaming Homophobe at him** - isn't doing that.
I dont agree with Mr Mogg - but I do believe that a tolerant society should allow people to have and express opinions that the moral majority dont agree with - I also believe that tolerance should be extended to peoples religious beliefs (and not just some religions).

Ergo no religious institution should be compelled to marry a gay couple, at the same time a deeply religious family run BnB shouldn't be compelled to accept unmarried straight or gay couples, an opinion I share with Mr Tatchell. At present they are entitled to refuse the former but not the latter, ( effectively Gays have more rights than straight people on this issue)- which is the problem with the whole equal rights legislation - trying to work out whose rights trumps whose. Do my rights to worship and my beliefs trump those of a Gay couple - which of course depends on religion*** - Im yet to see anyone challenging Muslim Imams, businesses, Mosques and politicians for expressing the same views as Christian ones. (For the record all religion can go hang itself in my opinion)

The intolerance and denigration of those who dont agree with something may well see far more support for Mr Mogg in the future - Not because they agree with him - but because this nasty insidious intolerant culture is affecting more and more people, because the demands are getting more extreme and the possibility of avoiding giving offence more and more difficult.

Peter Tatchell, Germaine greer , and other leading rights activists have all been labelled as bigots and stopped from speaking - because they havent endorsed the latest fashionable course or worse in Tatchells case not because he did or said anything offensive but because he spoke out against censorship.

**Whilst of course ignoring the large number of Labour MPs with similar religious beliefs

***I dont claim that's a fact of law - but it does reflect the approach and actions of the activists and perhaps how keen people are to apply the law.

Edit - For clarity - I quoted you and the point - Other than the bit in blue the response isn't to you - its more general
Just in case thanks to poor grammar or use of words - it appears I'm calling you an intolerant activist - Im not and wouldn't -
You're quite right . The moral majority are not a majority at all , they're just louder and shoutier on Twatter than everyone else , and seem to think their opinion is the only one that matters .
They then get shafted at the ballot box and never seem to understand why .
 
I wasn't aware I had an obsession with them. Can you point out the posts that made you think that?
Just a side passing impression. Makes me wonder out loud. So how about it, can we have a "come out and be proud gay" or to "fek with all queers". Sets the record straight so we don't have to guess forever.
 
The original question was to the Irish referendum. It was decided to have a rerun based on more information. It had a different result.

Had the Irish thought they were being coerced or railroaded you can be fairly sure few of them would have bothered their backsides going out to vote.
The original question may have been exactly that, but your post wasn't, it was on Brexit hence my post. Remoaners may well place their hopes on a re-run of the referendum, but it ain't going to happen otherwise we'd end up with a totally ungovernable country with an electorate that refuses to trust politicians.

Besides, it's not the British way, stiff upper lip and carry on don't you know.
 
Any proof/evidence of Brexit being an ongoing strategic disaster?

As for business and industry predictions? The forecasting will be the death of some people & last time I looked the business and industry should be more prepared complete with less excuses, it’s called a business resilience plan.

Recover influential terms?

Anyone would think your comparing Brexit with the damn ice age or a global war.
Or a Mad Max-esque dystopian wasteland...
I did admire DD when he mentioned that, quite apt considering some people’s mindset towards a post Brexit.

‘Open Europe’ take note, life goes on....


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