Gavin Williamson Sacked

Is it not wiser to attempt all of us to moderate and meet somewhere in the middle of the Venn Diagram (where the Unicorns and Buddha really do live?)
Sadly as I have said so often in the last year or so, Venn, has moved to the left... Had the modern Conservatives stayed on the right of centre then. Yes.
 
Thats a given. The civil service head likes the EU and has successfully torpedoed brexit for now, but cozying up to the Chinese? Thats a MUCH more dangerous course of action.
Cosying up to the Chinese? Where have you been for the last 20 years?
 
Eh? The Conservatives had 28.6% of the vote in Scotland in the 2017 General Election. Admittedly, the Ruth Davidson kind of Conservatives. Not yours, apparently.
And that produced how much of a Conservative majority in Scotland exactly?

Oh; it didn't.

What kind of "conservatives" are "Ruth Davidson Conservatives"?

Like the current Westminster crop of Conservatives, i.e. conservative in name only, or neo-liberals as they are more correctly termed?

Needless to say, she's pro Remain...
 
Is it not wiser to attempt all of us to moderate and meet somewhere in the middle of the Venn Diagram (where the Unicorns and Buddha really do live?)
Sadly not in this regard.
The moderate, "centre ground" attempt by Cameron was met by EU intransigence (not that his stance was anything but near acquiescence in any case) & departing the EU in a clear cut manner really is the only rational position left should the UK wish to continue as a truly independent nation.
 
The policy of leaking by Government is something I have always thought as a bad practice, regardless of what colour rosette they wear and it will always come back to bite. There has been so many examples over the last 30 odd years when Government have failed to adhere consistent or coherent policy in dealing with 'Leakers'.

While I dont like 'Leakers' I understand that there are times when leaks are 'whistle-blowing' rather than political opportunism and when they are done by 'whistle-blowers' who have follow both procedure and the law, then I can agree with it, even if I don't like 'Leaking'

Once an organisation be it Government or not, allows leaking to become a thing then they also are encouraging the news media tactic of " A Source Says" to then be able to then push any narrative to a story, that is based on in many cases a fiction or misrepresentation of an 'event'.

This tactic is also why the 'news' media is so distrusted, so many stories told by source who are unnamed... Please give me a break, as far as i care "unnamed source or the gossiping tea lady who hates "X" have same credibility".
 
Cosying up to the Chinese? Where have you been for the last 20 years?
I always knew this was never going to be a good idea or policy, for any government. Sure its a good thing to have a grown up relationship with adversarial nations, but as we all know. No matter how exciting it is too engage with "Danger Fcuks", they always have consequences and are always 'dangerous".
 
Again, sources please for your statement that civil servants signed off "many EU Defence & Security programmes in 2017/8 (post Ref.) without ministerial [or select committee] approval; they only found out after deal was signed off. " I'm interested, really, and it can't be so difficult for you to answer if you've mentioned your sources before. I've put your "or select committee" bit in brackets, because that's constitutionally irrelevant.
Nope, search yourself if you want sources.

eg Parliament TV, msm (-BBC), alt-msm have reported it.

imo you know it's true and are being awkward and attempting to rabbit-hole.

.
Re Maggie changed from being pro-EU to being anti-EU - not overnight, but over months/years.

Margaret Thatcher (1988 ) - Speech to the College of Europe ("The Bruges Speech") - September 21 1988
"We have not successfully rolled back the frontiers of the state in Britain, only to see them re-imposed at a European level"

"Europe will be stronger precisely because it has France as France, Spain as Spain, Britain as Britain, each with its own customs, traditions and identity. It would be folly to try to fit them into some sort of identikit European personality."


.
and later Pro-Brexit

Margaret Thatcher on the EU (1995): Unlike EU federalists, I believe in Britain
“I propose that Britain negotiates its way out… acts to protect our parliamentary and legal sovereignty, declares openly against a single currency, and urges the creation of a North Atlantic Free Trade Area.”

With sub titles
 
It looks like Williamson may be giving a statement to the house or has a question at PMQ's
Appears GW is on recon for best time to launch attack

Andrea Jenkyns MP (Con)
"...She spoke in soft, slow tones. As is often the way of political assassins, she chose to plunge her dagger slowly and precisely.

‘Can I just say to my Right Honourable friend, the Prime Minister, she has tried her best,’ she said. ‘No one could doubt, or fault, her commitment or sense of duty.

‘But she has failed. She has to deliver on her promises…’
...
Williamson, incidentally, had taken up position in almost the exact perch from where Geoffrey Howe delivered his resignation speech that did for Margaret Thatcher’s premiership. It could have been a coincidence, of course..."
 
It looks like Williamson may be giving a statement to the house or has a question at PMQ's
I thought he might ask whether he could bring his tarantula back into the office now he is no longer a minister.

Was the fekkin' thing in a box or did he just let it roam around to frighten his staff?
 
Huawei and the Cameron Connection

"The Huawei scandal has been a long time coming. Huawei started selling software to British telecommunications companies in 2000. It has been supplying hardware since 2003. Within years, the US went public with warnings about Huawei’s links with Chinese espionage, so Tony Blair is the first prime minister to blame for not controlling the risks.
...
in December 2013, Cameron's government’s review of Huawei’s centre at Banbury finally reported, 14 months after the Parliamentary Committee had prompted it. The report recommended that GCHQ should chair the selection of Huawei employees for the centre. How amazing that the government wasn’t already monitoring whom Huawei sent to the centre.

Months later, Cameron’s administration belatedly established a new board to oversee what Banbury was supposed to be doing, with representatives from two of Huawei’s competitors (Vodafone and BT, both of which have removed Huawei’s hardware from their networks since their first procurement in 2005) but also representatives from Huawei.
...
David Cameron is also understood to have met Gavin Williamson on 23 April..."

Cameron (interlocutor between the British and Chinese governments) still very much involved in ruining UK

Blair, Brown, Cameron & May all sticking two fingers to USA and favouring EU-China love-in.
 
Nope, search yourself if you want sources.

eg Parliament TV, msm (-BBC), alt-msm have reported it.

imo you know it's true and are being awkward and attempting to rabbit-hole.

.
Re Maggie changed from being pro-EU to being anti-EU - not overnight, but over months/years.

Margaret Thatcher (1988 ) - Speech to the College of Europe ("The Bruges Speech") - September 21 1988
"We have not successfully rolled back the frontiers of the state in Britain, only to see them re-imposed at a European level"

"Europe will be stronger precisely because it has France as France, Spain as Spain, Britain as Britain, each with its own customs, traditions and identity. It would be folly to try to fit them into some sort of identikit European personality."


.
and later Pro-Brexit

Margaret Thatcher on the EU (1995): Unlike EU federalists, I believe in Britain
“I propose that Britain negotiates its way out… acts to protect our parliamentary and legal sovereignty, declares openly against a single currency, and urges the creation of a North Atlantic Free Trade Area.”

With sub titles
(a) Why are you going on yet again about Maggie and the EU? That's twice now after I apologised for misreading your original post. How many more times? Diversion? (b) More importantly, what's so difficult about providing sources for your statement that civil servants post-Referendum have entered into EU defence agreements "without ministerial authority". I'm genuinely interested, it's a genuinely important point, and referring me and everyone else to "Parliament TV" and "BBC" and (significantly perhaps) "alt-msm" is hardly providing sources.
 
Plausible as Williamson (and many other MPs) is furious that civil servants signed UK up to many EU Defence & Security programmes in 2017/8 (post Ref.) without ministerial or select committee approval; they only found out after deal was signed off.
Let's try this again @pcar964 . I've searched Hansard and elsewhere for the evidence of your very important (if true) claim that "civil servants signed UK up to many EU Defence & Security programmes in 2017/8 (post Ref.) without ministerial ... approval". I haven't found it. The obvious problem is that without knowing what specific programmes you had in mind, I was searching for parliamentary evidence which doesn't exist if it wasn't reported. All I found was evidence of programmes which were reported. To conclude this interesting diversion, all you need to tell us is the name of some of the "many EU Defence & Security programmes in 2017/8" which civil servants signed the UK up to without ministerial approval. Thanks in advance!
 
Let's try this again @pcar964 . I've searched Hansard and elsewhere for the evidence of your very important (if true) claim that "civil servants signed UK up to many EU Defence & Security programmes in 2017/8 (post Ref.) without ministerial ... approval". I haven't found it. The obvious problem is that without knowing what specific programmes you had in mind, I was searching for parliamentary evidence which doesn't exist if it wasn't reported. All I found was evidence of programmes which were reported. To conclude this interesting diversion, all you need to tell us is the name of some of the "many EU Defence & Security programmes in 2017/8" which civil servants signed the UK up to without ministerial approval. Thanks in advance!
I admire your perseverance.

But fear he's too busy firefighting in his knickers to answer you.
 
Let's try this again @pcar964 . I've searched Hansard and elsewhere for the evidence of your very important (if true) claim that "civil servants signed UK up to many EU Defence & Security programmes in 2017/8 (post Ref.) without ministerial ... approval". I haven't found it. The obvious problem is that without knowing what specific programmes you had in mind, I was searching for parliamentary evidence which doesn't exist if it wasn't reported. All I found was evidence of programmes which were reported. To conclude this interesting diversion, all you need to tell us is the name of some of the "many EU Defence & Security programmes in 2017/8" which civil servants signed the UK up to without ministerial approval. Thanks in advance!
You and your need for evidence.
 

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Let's try this again @pcar964 . I've searched Hansard and elsewhere for the evidence of your very important (if true) claim that "civil servants signed UK up to many EU Defence & Security programmes in 2017/8 (post Ref.) without ministerial ... approval". I haven't found it. The obvious problem is that without knowing what specific programmes you had in mind, I was searching for parliamentary evidence which doesn't exist if it wasn't reported. All I found was evidence of programmes which were reported. To conclude this interesting diversion, all you need to tell us is the name of some of the "many EU Defence & Security programmes in 2017/8" which civil servants signed the UK up to without ministerial approval. Thanks in advance!
Please stop asking him, he obviously has no answer and will just fill the thread with irrelevant cut and pastes in a hope of detracting from his previous posts
 

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