Galileo

F

fozzy

Guest
#1
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4555298.stm

Great achievement and good to see SSTL behind this particular satellite - and good to see the old Russian launcher still performing.

However - why?

The European Space Industry is very sucessful, but will this turn into a vast and bloated Euro Project run by the idiots in Brussels? Or will it genuinely bring benefits that GPS doesn't?

Genuine questions from a confused Fozzy.
 
#2
Fozzy,

I think the main reason this project was started was to avoid the dependance the rest of the world has on the US with the GPS Network. If the Yanks decided tomorrow to turn off the (already degraded) signal to the rest of the world, then quite a few people would be upset. With a system like this, there isn't as much as a problem.
 
#3
several spams had been making threats about turning off gps or attacking jamming gaileo in case of terrorist attack so best to have a replacement alternative plus it gives you sub metre accuracy l
 
#4
It is also a step in the EU overseeing even more of our lives, and stripping work away from such as the Civil Aviation Authority. The blurb ob BBC TV this morning was incredible - "With this people will be able to work out where they are". Well, bugger me !.

Private Eye have been running articles on this for a few years, not long before they change from "watch out if this happens" to "We told you so" mode.
 
E

error_unknown

Guest
#5
It's one more step in the Project, a United States of Europe with President Blair at the helm. Well he had to get something in return for betraying us over the rebate!
 
#6
Are the current generation of Sat Nav systems (like the one me dear old Dad had for Christmas) going to be compatible with Gallileo or will they cease to function when the Yanks satellites finally fall out of orbit and burn up in t'atmosphere?
 
#7
Just read the Bliar broadcasting Corporation article. 'Every piece of electronic equipment will have a Gallileo chip in it' and 'it will allow governments to introduce pay-as-you-drive charging'. Wonder if they'll go the whole hog and have chips in your compulsory ID card as well? Might as well have it implanted in your body so you don't lose it. Must go, there's a pizza van which has been parked across the road for a week now, I'll see if he wants some directions.
 
#8
Fozzy - My understanding is that in addition to improved accuracy over GPS and Russian GLONASS it should also provide more coverage... it should be easier to get a fix even in urban environments...


I thought selective availability was now switched off - so civilian receivers are as accurate as military ones? Although as Matelot says the Americans reserve the right to switch it on again.


How does it take power away from the Civilian Aviation Authority? I'm curious to know what Privite Eye's problem with Gailileo is?


Monkfish - why would the yanks allow their GPS constellation to degrade? I think your Dad's receiver is going to work for many years... But I think it will also be possible in the future to buy receivers which are GPS and Gailileo compatible - further improving reliability... Also I think pay-as-you-drive charging is a separate issue to Galileo? Couldn't that have been introduced with the exisiting GPS system?


Tricam.
 
#9
Why dont we get a satillite that beams down on women that makes them more c0ck mad than they are already are!!
god i am in the wrong job! lets put some more in and less out :wink:
 
#10
having a gps system that is not going to be turned off because the spams have a fit.
all the big brother is whatching you stuff could be done with gps
 
F

fozzy

Guest
#12
tricam said:
Fozzy - My understanding is that in addition to improved accuracy over GPS and Russian GLONASS it should also provide more coverage... it should be easier to get a fix even in urban environments...


I thought selective availability was now switched off - so civilian receivers are as accurate as military ones? Although as Matelot says the Americans reserve the right to switch it on again.


How does it take power away from the Civilian Aviation Authority? I'm curious to know what Privite Eye's problem with Gailileo is?


Monkfish - why would the yanks allow their GPS constellation to degrade? I think your Dad's receiver is going to work for many years... But I think it will also be possible in the future to buy receivers which are GPS and Gailileo compatible - further improving reliability... Also I think pay-as-you-drive charging is a separate issue to Galileo? Couldn't that have been introduced with the exisiting GPS system?


Tricam.
Tricam, as you say the SA feature was switched off under a Presidential Directive from President Clinton no less. However, as you say the US reserves the right....

I understand that DGPS had got around the SA issue anyway, by LF broadcasts of correction factors.

GPS is already imbedded in more things than people realise. Several Telecommunications networks use timing extracted from GPS for sync. Its popping up more and more as part of logistical tracking and workforce management (ie men in vans)

I saw an interview with one Prof Heinz Wolf on BBC News 24 who claimed this really was a "me too" type project rather than a real technical breakthrough and the cost is around the same as the US are planning to spend on upgrading their GPS.
 
#13
There are so many non-military uses of GPS now that the idea that the DoD could turn the system off is imho an empty threat. I dont expect an answer to this one in this fora, but no one has ever been able to explain to me how the yanks can turn off the GPS signal in (say) Iraq without taking down GPS reliant systems in the Eastern Med/NAG
 
#14
clanky said:
There are so many non-military uses of GPS now that the idea that the DoD could turn the system off is imho an empty threat. I dont expect an answer to this one in this fora, but no one has ever been able to explain to me how the yanks can turn off the GPS signal in (say) Iraq without taking down GPS reliant systems in the Eastern Med/NAG
Who said that was possible?

I know you could buy a local jammer - but I don't think you could easily jam an entire theatre?


Edited to add: I do agree that the technical gains (improved coverage & accuracy) of Galileo are fairly minimal and that this is a political project. But that doesn't make it a bad idea. Its not healthy for the whole world to be relying on the US.

Tricam.
 
#16
Yank GPS can already provide sub-metre accuracy, it depends on the receiver. Most 'civvy' GPS' (garmin etrex, magellan etc) aren't capable, however survey standard DGPS can provide data to the milimetre.

As for local jammers, I remember hearing ages ago that an old style car-phone with the big rubber aerial can act as one, if you strip and splay the aerial. Not long range for sure, but rumour has it it was able to throw tomahawks off-course during GW1. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on this one.
 
#18
tricam said:
clanky said:
There are so many non-military uses of GPS now that the idea that the DoD could turn the system off is imho an empty threat. I dont expect an answer to this one in this fora, but no one has ever been able to explain to me how the yanks can turn off the GPS signal in (say) Iraq without taking down GPS reliant systems in the Eastern Med/NAG
Who said that was possible?

I know you could buy a local jammer - but I don't think you could easily jam an entire theatre?


Edited to add: I do agree that the technical gains (improved coverage & accuracy) of Galileo are fairly minimal and that this is a political project. But that doesn't make it a bad idea. Its not healthy for the whole world to be relying on the US.

Tricam.
I would tend to agree with you about not relying on the US,except in cases where billions are being spent (virtually) duplicating an existing system, one that the americans have a vested interest in mintaining anyway.


Ineresting link Referendum
 
#19
If the yanks could turn off GPS sats either globally or locally who do you think would suffer the most?
GPS positioning of every vehicle on the ground, issued GPS per man, friendly fire warning systems! in fact they must of turnt them off years ago
 
#20
Fairs fair........I don 't want gps donwgraded in the event of missile throwing. After all it's politicians that get you killed and I'd rather Downing St was hit than my manor!
 

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