FTSE: 8000 by year end?

Today



Are the experts saying '' How low will it go '' ?
Mrs B_R and I both have significant share , bond and ISA tracking investments .... most of the investments took place years ago and have performed well .... we have experienced the ravages of the 2008 crash and the like and still the overall trend has been upwards and certainly well beating other forms of investment that we would have felt comfortable with . I am sure / hope eventually the markets will recover .... anyway we are in that age group most at threat if this virus infection develops into a Pandemic of the scale of the Spanish 'Flu in ~1918 and thus the value of our investments may be of a somewhat lesser concern .
 

Daxx

MIA
Book Reviewer
Mrs B_R and I both have significant share , bond and ISA tracking investments .... most of the investments took place years ago and have performed well .... we have experienced the ravages of the 2008 crash and the like and still the overall trend has been upwards and certainly well beating other forms of investment that we would have felt comfortable with . I am sure / hope eventually the markets will recover .... anyway we are in that age group most at threat if this virus infection develops into a Pandemic of the scale of the Spanish 'Flu in ~1918 and thus the value of our investments may be of a somewhat lesser concern .
Boot size?
 
Today



Are the experts saying '' How low will it go '' ?
The market will recover. The worst thing you could do would be to switch out, as you cannot time the markets.

One bloke here switched to cash about 16 months ago when there was a market blip.
He got very huffy when I pointed out he'd crystallised his losses.

He could not explain how he would decide when the time would be right to reinvest, and missed the rebound.

I did ask before, what made you decide to buy an annuity? And did you use a broker?
 
The market will recover. The worst thing you could do would be to switch out, as you cannot time the markets.
I switched out last year, as I already said upthread.

I did ask before, what made you decide to buy an annuity? And did you use a broker?
1. Army pension from 40yo

2. 2nd Company pension that can be taken anytime from 60.

Retiring at 58, an annuity was the way forward ( For me )
 

Boris_Johnson

ADC
Moderator
DirtyBAT
The market will recover. The worst thing you could do would be to switch out, as you cannot time the markets.

One bloke here switched to cash about 16 months ago when there was a market blip.
He got very huffy when I pointed out he'd crystallised his losses.

He could not explain how he would decide when the time would be right to reinvest, and missed the rebound.

I did ask before, what made you decide to buy an annuity? And did you use a broker?
I'm not going to switch out; much as it pains me this last couple of days with the markets in free fall... checking in on my PP in the mornings with that wince on my face akin to testing out an electric fence to see if it's live or not to see how much has been wiped out overnight...

A bit like in 2008 when I lost £50k from the value of my house, seemingly overnight. As you say, the markets recover.

Given the number of oppos I've known who never lived to see their 50th, I'm loathed to even consider annuity.

I'm therefore planning to draw down at 55, with the amount I'm putting in it will be the equivalent to a full state pension, which based on current estimates, will level out nicely around 68 years old (if I make it that far of course) where the SP can take over.

That in addition to the AFPS should see me through until I cark it.

Not sure if what I'm doing is sensible or not, but I've learned the grass isn't always greener and sometimes it's best to just stay in lane, rather than switch to one that's seemingly moving faster, only for that to come to a grinding halt the minute you do... Figuratively speaking.
 
Not sure if what I'm doing is sensible or not,
I think it is.

You cannot time the markets, so why try? If you come out, when do you go back in?


I'ma fan of passive investment using trackers. Active funds cost more - because they are actively traded - so will need to outperform trackers in order to stay still - so why spend the £ in the first place?

A lot of useful info from Dimensional can be read here: Dimensional Fund Advisors | Dimensional Investing

@Portree Kid - thanks for the explanation.

I actually take the view that, given you already have some pretty solid pension foundation - AFPS and another available from 60 - you wouldn't actually need the certainty of an annuity and there could be a home for say, drawdown.

But if, emotionally, you think you've done The Right Thing, that's actually a pretty good reason to do it.
 
@Portree Kid - thanks for the explanation.

I actually take the view that, given you already have some pretty solid pension foundation - AFPS and another available from 60 - you wouldn't actually need the certainty of an annuity and there could be a home for say, drawdown.
And you would be absolutely correct in what you are saying. Except.

1. The taxman would be laughing all the way to the bank.

2. I don't need the money.
 
The market will recover.
I am sure that it will, but since 2009 the UK has had nothing but head winds and there has been no significant sustainable growth

There is talk now that if the current situation continues then interest rates will be lowered, how they are going to achieve that when they are virtually negative at the moment god alone knows

Even 10yr bond yields are dragging their arrse, so there is no quick recovery on the horizon

Archie
 
And you would be absolutely correct in what you are saying. Except.

1. The taxman would be laughing all the way to the bank.

2. I don't need the money.
You didn't take advice, by the looks of it.

1. Nope; you are paying income tax on your annuity ( and I hope you used the 25% tax free cash entitlement?) and you'd pay income tax as and when you accessed the £ under drawdown. Except you could arrange it so that 25% would be tax free.

2. If you don't need the £, why buy an annuity? The majority of it will likely vanish on your death, although you may have purchased a guaranteed level of income plus widow's pension, but if you'd just left the £ in a (drawdown) pension, the whole fund would be available to a nominated beneficiary, free of ALL tax, if you popped your clogs before age 75.
 
You didn't take advice, by the looks of it.

1. Nope; you are paying income tax on your annuity ( and I hope you used the 25% tax free cash entitlement?) and you'd pay income tax as and when you accessed the £ under drawdown. Except you could arrange it so that 25% would be tax free.

2. If you don't need the £, why buy an annuity? The majority of it will likely vanish on your death, although you may have purchased a guaranteed level of income plus widow's pension, but if you'd just left the £ in a (drawdown) pension, the whole fund would be available to a nominated beneficiary, free of ALL tax, if you popped your clogs before age 75.
Uh - Huh

I know.

And if you had been paying attention, it doesn't matter what way I go, the tax man screws me and it was all about minimising my tax liability.
 
Uh - Huh

I know.

And if you had been paying attention, it doesn't matter what way I go, the tax man screws me and it was all about minimising my tax liability.
If you'd been paying attention, you'd have realised that I've said that the course of action you took will mean you're paying tax you dont need to.

Like I said, you didnt take advice, did you?

Reminds me if a firm I was talking to about auto enrolment a year or two ago. They bailed at our 2850 fee, and new HR bod came in, decided she knew best and signed up with NEST.

Because she didn't know what she was doing, she cost her employer about 30k a year.
 
I understand why the FTSE is falling....But why is the £ taking a dive too ?
 
As you haven't a clue what my tax liabilities are - How can you say that ?
Because I know what I'm talking about...

You say you dont need the income, yet you've bought an annuity rather than just leaving the pension alone.

You will be paying income tax on the income you receive. If you don't need the income (and the ensuing income tax) , why did you take it?

And as for the return of fund when you pop your clogs... 100% tax free under a pension if you die before 75...
 
You didn't take advice, by the looks of it.

1. Nope; you are paying income tax on your annuity ( and I hope you used the 25% tax free cash entitlement?) and you'd pay income tax as and when you accessed the £ under drawdown. Except you could arrange it so that 25% would be tax free.

2. If you don't need the £, why buy an annuity? The majority of it will likely vanish on your death, although you may have purchased a guaranteed level of income plus widow's pension, but if you'd just left the £ in a (drawdown) pension, the whole fund would be available to a nominated beneficiary, free of ALL tax, if you popped your clogs before age 75.
I'm astounded that anyone would 'invest' in an annuity. The investor certainly doesn't benefit. I had a FSAVC that I was (mis)sold as a Junior Officer (persuaded that there would be growth rates of 15% p - early 1990s); Through FSA I successfully recovered what I had paid in with a reasonable ROI. It the AVC had run its course, I would have been down by c 30% on what I had paid in.
 
Mrs B_R and I took out Index Tracker investments many , many years ago ... we pay no management charges ... market volatility such as now provides opportunities for Tracker Managers to skilfully purchase on our behalf and increase the value of our investment ... also twice a year if they are performing well we receive additional units added to our investment ... once awarded these units cannot be removed .... seems to have been a wise move as part of our investment portfolio .
 

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