FTRS (FC) Accompanied posting overseas CEA?

Discussion in 'Army Pay, Claims & JPA' started by the_flikker, Dec 22, 2009.

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  1. Guys and Gals,

    I rather naively volunteered to fill a regular post overseas (a fair bit overseas I might add!) whilst serving on an FTRS (FC) contract.

    I am entitled to everything else that a regular soldier would expect and even went through the process of obtaining a "mobility certificate" with the view to claiming CEA (there are NO schools in my new theatre for my daughter!), now my application was signed by my CO, MCM Div and the SCEA and everything was going swimmingly until I banged in my claim for CEA (Board) which was rejected due to me "not serving on a regular engagement or commission".

    Where I am with my move:

    I HAVE to serve a 6 month notice period, I would never try and wriggle out of it, not an option and would not want to.

    In order for me to take up my new position, the MOD have outlayed "A small nations GDP on training me for this post, I would hate to speculate but must be IRO £250K" with no time bar signed by me (regular soldiers sign 4 yr ROS)

    Family flights are booked, well my wife and I. (another small fortune).

    My current problems:

    I am due to fly out very early Jan and everyone is on leave for xmas.

    My daughter is already in position at boarding school, and it needs paying for soon.

    Unless I get CEA, then I will have to outlay £2200 per month on fees, clearly unsustainable regardless of which payscale you are on within the army!

    My daughter will not be entitled to School childrens visits, so she will be stuck homeless on the school steps during end of term closures, clearly freaking my wife out!

    Advice I need:

    Have they got the JSP wrong when it states that "reservists are not entitled to CEA"?

    Has there ever been a special case allowed for specialist circumstances?

    Do I just "bite the bullet, sign off, go unaccompanied, then come back after my 6 month notice period"?

    Let me just say this, we took this move in good faith that we were actually filling a slot that otherwise would have gone to a "pressed man" ruining someones life and it now seems to be shafting us, so my wife has called a halt and will refuse to go unless my daughters needs are catered for, ultimately causing a massive rift in our relationship at a stressful time of the year with a house upturned, removals booked, cars sold, and giving everything in her life up to join me halfway around the world.

    Where do I turn next as by my estimation, records/my unit have 24 hrs to sort something out before they can get a refund on at least one of the tickets out there.

    Come on you admin gurus someone out there must be able to help with experience or advice.

  2. hi mate, im in no means a h.r guru, or whatever they call themselves this year :D . the jsp is jsp 752 sect 5 which covers CEA here is the link to it hope it helps, had a quick flick through it and it doesnt mention reservists not being entitled to CEA, however it does state that you must be on a regular commision or engagement, sure you are on an engagement????
    it also states that you must be in receipt of full receipt of service rates of pay, which i take it you are.

    hope this helps mate, there is no on there for you to ring, give them a bell or chilwell if all else fails
  3. Yea gods - Dec 22nd is not the day to be posting this !!

    I'm also on FTRS FC so I know that schooling is not part of the deal. Sounds like the CoC needs to engage with the very highest levels in APC or whatever AG is called these days. my experience is that up to SO1 at least, all you get is the book quoted back at you.

    I can only wish you good luck in arguing for a special case - I'll bet the tumbleweed is already blowing around in Brown Street.
  4. LOL...

    I do know what you are saying saladin and believe me it wasnt through "bad admin" that this came about, I took the post at very short notice and had to get "brown streets" permission to go in the first place, hence the "short notice" part, but the decision was made by those in a position to make such decisions that I could go.

    I am not depriving a regular from a post...they could not get a regular to take the post without subjecting said regular to "waterboarding" and believe me, they asked at least 10 suitably qualified regular soldiers before allowing me to undertake the training course. The post is a regular post and in effect "unfillable" without a suitably qualified FTRS (FC) volunteer, step forward bloggs!!

    My mobility certificate came through about 5 days before the last day for JPA claims for CEA, so I duly logged on to find my daughter wasnt registered on the system, that my seperation status was wrong (all whilst I was temp attached out of my home theatre, on an intensive course!).

    So, cutting all things long into a short brief statement, I got my claim in on 17th (last day for claims on JPA), my course finished 18th as did the rest of the military admin system. Being a good soldier, I trust that they will do right by me, but my wife thinks Fcuk that you have already given them 30 years service, get it sorted!! so here I am LOL asking advice just before xmas and do you know what, ever the optimist....I still believe they will sort it for me, but it has to be sorted in 1 single day and that is 4 jan. FFS hope glasgow is open then and they dont have a "Special" holiday cos Mrs F is not letting the furniture go on the 5th if its not going to work.

  5. I think where they get me is the following paragraph:

    09.0116. Ineligible Service Personnel. A Service person is ineligible for CEA if they are:
    a. A Reservist.
    b. A retired Service person re-employed or an individual employed specifically to fill an appointment (eg FTRS).

    So there I have it, for want of reading the FQ I may just lose my family for 6 months, and maybe for good....trying to be the good guy got me nowhere in the end!

    You would think I would learn....

    must get on the phone tomorrow to the removals, the DPTA (or whatever they are called, you know flights etc.) and my ""was to be" new boss" and let them know...

    Shame really, such an illustrious career ruined by petty rules, but never mind, the same job will be civvy soon no doubt and I got the course for free!

  6. Sadly I don't think you have a whinge here; we only get CEA to sustain the career path of long term contracts and continuity of education for the child. On an FTRS engagement you are on a fixed term period and therefore at the end of that the child would have (presumably) moved school anyway.

    What you are looking for is the Foreign Office system, get the allowance when serving abroad but no allowance when posted home. This would be unsustainable for the Forces.

    You say an illustrious career has been ruined, I don't agree, FTRS is not a career just a way to fill the odd gap here and there and with recruiting on the up then we (here) are not re recruiting FTRS posts.
  7. Easy one - educate her at home. A bit unconventional but feasible. Adapt and overcome.
  8. Thanks for your input, I never set out to "whinge" just wondering how I cater for my daughters education now, if I`m needed to fill a post as you say because of the "odd gap" here and there and the post is accompanied then I clearly have a choice, I can either educate my daughter or I can provide her with a place to live but as the system stands I cant do both, I`m not asking for a cushy package here just the basics of "family life" if my daughter moves with us there is NO school available, there is NO provision for education other than UK based boarding schools, so quote the rules re FTRS if you wish but please dont assume that you know anything about my terms and conditions and can therefore comment on the recruiting policy "With recruiting on the up, we are not re recruiting FTRS posts" that comment is basically flawed. The numbers may be filled in the army but there is a serious lack of expertise in certain areas, one of which is my position.

    I`m not looking for a career, just some basic provisions to enable me to complete my contract and then I can get back in my box.
  9. Not feasable as there is no education support in theatre and to educate at home you have to maintain a basic standard audited externally I believe, no provision for this I`m afraid. Thanks for the input though.
  10. Where are you going to?? - Most places have facilities!
  11. The DIN which sets out all the 'rules and regulations' on FTRS contains the following:

    Allowances, Charges and Entitlements

    "30. Allowances. Personnel serving on FTRS commitments may claim allowances, where they
    qualify in all other respects, in accordance with existing regulations for Regular Army personnel,
    details of which are in Reference H. This includes Longer Separated Service Allowance (LSSA).

    31. FTRS personnel are not authorised to claim or be paid the following allowances:
    a. Recompense in Lieu of Relocation (RILOR), except as provided for in Para 32 below and
    when posted to areas where an entitlement to Recruiting and Retention Allowance (London)
    RRA(L) exists.
    b. Relocation Allowances (removal expenses, storage fees, disturbance allowance, legal
    fees and family travel) except as provided for in Para 32 below.
    c. Continuity of Education Allowance.
    d. Long Service Advance of Pay.
    e. Services’ Home Savings Scheme/Home Savings Allowance.
    f. Officers’ Initial Uniform Grant."

    I hope you read the DIN before you accepted your post.
  12. What school is it, Eton? Can you simply not just put her in a cheaper boarding school?
  13. I think the clue might lie in the posted facts - that he's been in 30 years, it took a long course to be qualified to go and that no Regular wants the post. Something tells me its not the Embassy in Washington.....
  14. Thanks for the input smartarrse - just trying to establish facts before trying to offer any advice - there may be clues there but there are also mentions of "short notice" which does not somehow add up with "long course"

    I'm amazed this wasn't picked up at RTMC before you were taken into service, a case should have been submitted at that point to PACC as, by the normal rules, and as previously posted FTRS of any type does not carry an entitlement to CEA! By the book you probably don't have a leg to stand on as you will have signed to say you are aware of your TACOS but a case may get through if properly submitted. Again as posted above 22 Dec is not the best time to try and get this sorted! Have you got contact details for RTMC, their Admin Cell may still be in work as they support various theatres and may be able to assist! Failing that It will have to be a mad rush on 4 Jan! I would think it would be a good plan to get removals, etc put back a couple of weeks to give you a bit of breathing space! - I really cannot see this being fixed in 1 day!

  15. Thanks Paywog,

    It wasnt a "Long course" it started Oct finished 18 Dec, but was away from home for the whole period, thereby making everything twice as hard to organise. I received my Assignment order early Oct, course 3 weeks later and have been away since then.

    My FTRS (FC) contract was to serve at my current unit, this position(regular) came up and MCM and my unit were struggling to fill it at 3 1/2 months notice, I said I would do it as long as

    a. I was allowed by MCM and

    b. That my TACOS would allow FTRS personnel to take it.

    Obviously, I assumed that I wouldnt be disadvantaged over a regular soldier by taking the position.

    RTMC were not involved in the process to my knowledge as it was MCM driven with my current units support.

    RTMC would not have been able to put any case forward as this was an unforseen move and quite possibly outside of my original terms, but negotiated by my current unit, MCM and myself.

    I was only asking if anyone knows of a case for CEA being authorised for FTRS, I dont want to start a slagging match between you all on my behalf.

    I know that 22 Dec is not the best time to be posting this, but it is what I have got seeing as I was first aware that it would be a problem was on the 17th and I have put my case through MCM and my current unit in the time I had available before Xmas break.

    Where we stand at the moment:

    My current unit have started the process through JPAC for an exemption.

    MCM are aware that it is a problem, and "dont have a problem" with re-enlisting me should the need arise to get around the CEA issue.

    Why I asked on here in the first place was to see if there had been a precedent set, and what timescale would be involved.

    It seems that it has never happened before and would be so long winded that I couldnt keep my daughter at school anyway, leaving me the only option which is to transfer from FTRS back to a regular engagement and this could probably be done "in principle" in 1 day.

    To the numpty who asked about £2200 per month boarding school with the witty comment...each term attracts a CEA of around £5800, parental contribution 10%, means that a lot of these schools are aware of what they can charge....and it works out to be around £2200 per month during term time. So if you have nothing to advise me with then please refrain from typing with your forehead.

    Thanks to all those with genuine advice, it has added a bit of clarity and direction to the emails I must write over the festive period and happy xmas to you all...