Discussion in 'Aviation' started by Muttley, Apr 12, 2006.

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  1. Watch out for a reconstituted FRI for AH crews only. I believe its the reason everyone lost the FRI in march in order to allow a larger payment to encourage those in the programme to stay as well as increase the volunteer rate. Good news for AH drivers but will it just drive a wedge between AH and other aircraft types?

    Muttley out
  2. Should that not read bigger?
  3. Non-AH, but I wouldn't begrudge the AH punters some sort of incentive for all of the work they have to put into it for little flying and a seemingly s**t quality of life.
  4. Good luck to 'em. I choose life.
  5. Heard a rumour it was supposed to be £100K . . . hmmm seems a bit high to me, but if it's going to encourage them to stay . . .

    My worry is . . . surely there must be something fundamentally wrong if these kinds of sums of money are being thrown at the problem. On the one hand, I think that they should review the AH guys "life regime" and see about improving that rather than just throw a wad of cash at it, hoping the problem will go away.

    Then again, I suppose £100K is cheaper than having to put a new pilot (ab initio or not) through the CTT & CTR system . . .

    Best of luck, guys . . .
  6. It sounds a lot but didn't Harrier pilots get a similiar deal when they threatened to leave in droves ? My memory is failing but I recall something along the lines of £150k, 50k a year for 3 years ?, not sure what the return of service requirements were. Cue lots of whinging from every other airforce type bloke, see every third post on PPRUNE.

    Money helps, but it isn't everything, and of course it will have a knock on effect to other a/c types. The civil heli market is expanding rapidly, lots of jobs about at the mo and ex-forces seem to be the in choice, especially with the introduction of NVG to certain civil areas. I think that for the older guys it's more a question of life quality and even a 6 figure sum may not swing it, the young Officers are unlikely to care and see it for what it is..a yahoo banzai bonus! (and so they should).

    All IM(very)HO of course.

    Can't wait to see the display of cars at Dishforth, maybe they can start swapping the 911's for Ferraris.
  7. There was a targetted FRI at RN Harrier pilots a few years back. £50k one-off payment. RAF Harrier pilots were not included. Cue situation last year where FRI cancelled for RAF aircrew, but RN aircrew on same sqns, doing same thing, with same time away got the FRI. Now that was messed up!
  8. Things dont fly without Groundcrew support, when are they going to realise that even moving to the higher pay band would be enough for the AAC Groundcrew, who lets face it have always played second fiddle to the Aircrew, sometimes deservedly, however you dont get one without the other.

  9. There is also though a growing trend for what were once considered dedicated fixed-wing commercial pilots, taking up helis as a form of insurance against being made redundant from the fixed. Anyone's guess if/what impact it would have on the civil heli job market but may be worth bearing in mind for some.
  10. Nobody here doubts the enormous contribution to Aviation that the groundcrew perform. I agree that a change to the higher payband should exist for those that work within the squadrons.

    People within the Corps are working extremely hard as is the majority of the Army, with the various appointments around the globe and the AAC needs to remain involved in order to secure its future, but at what cost? As usual a policy will be adopted after the horse has bolted, whereas it needs to be addressed before the stable door is opened. What is needed is a better management system where good work is rewarded with the things we took for granted in the past: R & R, long weekends, being stood down when on reverse cycle and not expected to come in in order to suit RHQ hours, greater family inclusion, and above all may I suggest something which I have noticed as being scantily regarded this last few years, a thank you.

    Muttley out
  11. If I could have written a course critique type thing for my time within the Corps it would have mirrored the above to the letter.
  12. Thanks MDN, In the words of Roy Walker...say what you see!
  13. Re: FRI
    Posted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 5:32 pm

    Things dont fly without Groundcrew support, when are they going to realise that even moving to the higher pay band would be enough for the AAC Groundcrew, who lets face it have always played second fiddle to the Aircrew, sometimes deservedly, however you dont get one without the other.

    Couldnt agree more, look after all not the few - an ex qhi.
  14. I do have to ask the question, "where did you get this information from" :?: If true this will be a step in the right direction in order to retain highly qualified Apache pilots especially when you consider the cost of training them. They are generally highly motivated and intelligent soldiers who if not given some reward will walk. I'm sure that the undercurrent and rumours of pilots leaving the Army post thier time bar, is more than a simple rumour it is actually highly probable. The civilian market for pilots is at present very bouyant for pilots and especially instructors with Apache experience there is a vast amount of employment in this country and abroad.
    £50,000 or what ever the figure is rumoured to be is a small price to pay for retaining these individuals who lets face it cannot be replaced in the immediate future (12 months training required). Some argue that we are already scraping the bottom of the barrel looking for suitable candidates, even more reason for a financial incentive.
    Financial incentives are not new and are routinly used in civilian street to retain the quality individuals that business wish to retain.
    As far as the groundcrew pay is concerned surely this has nothing to do with FRI and should if you feel it neccesary be the subjecct of another debate. But for the record in the US Army the groundcrew (FARP personnel) refuelers etc are the lowest paid individuals and they see no reason to change their pay. So if you want more pay my top tip is to apply for aircrew training at your earliest opportunity.