FRES, please delay it two years, weve not got the budget...

Mr Happy

LE
Moderator
#1
to quote Janes:

UK procurement chiefs urge delay to FRES production
UK defence procurement chiefs are pushing for a delay in the launching of full production of the British Army's flagship Future Rapid Effects System (FRES) armoured vehicles by two years because of budget shortfalls. Plans to buy 120 utility vehicles off-the-shelf from an offshore production line to meet a demanding 2011-12 in-service date are also set to be scrapped as unaffordable after a top procurement planning group in the UK Ministry of Defence (MoD) was unable to find money to pay for these vehicles in the next three-year budget period
 
#2
As we've seen before it'll never happen because of the Eurofighter, carriers, F35's , Nimrods etc. need paying for.
There's not enough airlift capacity to move FRES anyway and the money would be better spent on more helicopters and body armour.
 
#3
Mr Happy said:
to quote Janes:

UK procurement chiefs urge delay to FRES production
UK defence procurement chiefs are pushing for a delay in the launching of full production of the British Army's flagship Future Rapid Effects System (FRES) armoured vehicles by two years because of budget shortfalls. Plans to buy 120 utility vehicles off-the-shelf from an offshore production line to meet a demanding 2011-12 in-service date are also set to be scrapped as unaffordable after a top procurement planning group in the UK Ministry of Defence (MoD) was unable to find money to pay for these vehicles in the next three-year budget period
To quote Minister for Defence Equipment and Support, Lord Drayson at the Defence Manufacturers Association reception 16 May 2007

Our Armed Forces are even busier than they were back in 2005. We are now heavily committed on operations in both Iraq and Afghanistan. I’ve seen for myself just what a fantastic job our personnel are doing in incredibly difficult and dangerous environments. Supporting these men and women is keeping us very busy on the equipment side. The sheer pace and scale of these campaigns mean we are dealing with an unprecedented level of Urgent Operational Requirements – so far, £700 million has been earmarked for force protection alone. Force protection is central to this – just look at the Mastiff vehicle which we had built, upgraded, tested and delivered in just 23 weeks. The fact that we are able to turn around an entire project like this so quickly is tangible proof – I believe – that defence acquisition has really entered a new era.
Also - from defence news 7 June 2007:

Defence Minister Lord Drayson said:

"My highest priority is to ensure that our Forces have the equipment they need to achieve success on operations today, tomorrow and in the future. FRES has a vital part to play in the future of the British Army.

"I signalled my commitment to the FRES programme last year and this announcement provides tangible evidence of progress. The selection of these designs for inclusion in the utility vehicle trials is a part of the competitive acquisition strategy developed to ensure that we deliver the best solution for the Army."

General Sir Richard Dannatt, Chief of the General Staff, added:

"FRES is my highest equipment priority and I am determined that we will make this programme a timely success - it is at the heart of the future Army.

"I am therefore very encouraged by the significant progress that has been made in identifying the three best candidate vehicles for us to trial this summer and I look forward to maintaining this momentum in the programme to the next decision point by November this year.

"We need to take this exciting project forward, together with our industrial partners as soon as possible."
 
#6
If it's still the air-portable, Omin-wagon meant to make the politicos look good when they sign us up for the next UN WhereverFOR; then probably not.
 
#7
Blyth_spirit said:
To quote Minister for Defence Equipment and Support, Lord Drayson at the Defence Manufacturers Association reception 16 May 2007

Also - from defence news 7 June 2007:
Well, a week being a long time in politics, how long is 7-8 months in defence procurement?

msr
 

Mr Happy

LE
Moderator
#10
by 'now' do you mean this week or is you crystal ball working fine looking forwards 30 years?

I recognise that you are probably correct period but following thje out of area ops, we are far more likely to need FRES in the future than we are, say, MBT.

Something for everywhere at anytime.

As I've said elsewhere, I woudl personally prefer more UOR for spceific stuff (though ordered earlier, rather than after deployment) rather than have it sitting around for 10 years ready to go. A sort of pre-UOR if you like.
 
#11
Mr Happy said:
by 'now' do you mean this week or is you crystal ball working fine looking forwards 30 years?

I recognise that you are probably correct period but following thje out of area ops, we are far more likely to need FRES in the future than we are, say, MBT.

Something for everywhere at anytime.

As I've said elsewhere, I woudl personally prefer more UOR for spceific stuff (though ordered earlier, rather than after deployment) rather than have it sitting around for 10 years ready to go. A sort of pre-UOR if you like.
The problem with UOR is in the title...Urgent Operational Requirement....Fine if you want new body armour, or new T-shirts, or new LMG's off the shelf. New MBT? that's at least 10 years or second hand stock cos noon is going to build 300 MBT's on the off chance someone needs a spare tank fleet on Monday morning at 9am for Tuesday lunchtime. New A/C ohhhhhh...20 years or third hand fleets 5 years out of date....
 
#12
Kitmarlowe said:
Mr Happy said:
by 'now' do you mean this week or is you crystal ball working fine looking forwards 30 years?

I recognise that you are probably correct period but following thje out of area ops, we are far more likely to need FRES in the future than we are, say, MBT.

Something for everywhere at anytime.

As I've said elsewhere, I woudl personally prefer more UOR for spceific stuff (though ordered earlier, rather than after deployment) rather than have it sitting around for 10 years ready to go. A sort of pre-UOR if you like.
The problem with UOR is in the title...Urgent Operational Requirement....Fine if you want new body armour, or new T-shirts, or new LMG's off the shelf. New MBT? that's at least 10 years or second hand stock cos noon is going to build 300 MBT's on the off chance someone needs a spare tank fleet on Monday morning at 9am for Tuesday lunchtime. New A/C ohhhhhh...20 years or third hand fleets 5 years out of date....
And UOR's are quite handy when a someone forgot that a large fleet of NEW vehicles MAY need to have some form of self protection when in a convoy in, lets say for example, Iraq or Afghanistan!!! 8O
"Gun Mounts?? Pah! Just drive faster, now back to Pims and Scones in the Mess dear chap" :roll:
 
#13
FRES looks set to go the way of all the other projects with 'Future' in the title. No wonder Drayson PVR'd.
 
#15
Meridian - Drayson jumped as he was sick of not being allowed to make decisions in a resonable time, based on hard data (the selection of the Fr veh was done on Trial and cost - not politics) and continually being sniped at by the committee type decision making of some of our beloved Lords and Masters. Can't blame him.

3-1 On we won't see anything until the Big And Expensive proposed date of - at a push -2014.

I suppose that means that we will have to have a new vehicle downselect too as of course, there will be so much more that they can offer then.

Any want to bet against? :roll:
 
#16
Sorry, I phrased my post poorly. As you say, he decided enough was enough and walked, the spin doctors using the racing thing as a cover story.

The whole FRES thing is a story of incompetence and indecision at every level. If it weren't so serious it would be serious.
 
#17
in_the_cheapseats said:
3-1 On we won't see anything until the Big And Expensive proposed date of - at a push -2014.
Might I respectfully suggest that if the decision hadn't been made to throw away all the time and money that had been put into FSCS/TRACER and start all over again you could have seen it a damned sight sooner. :roll:
 
#19
trackbasher said:
As we've seen before it'll never happen because of the Eurofighter, carriers, F35's , Nimrods etc. need paying for.
There's not enough airlift capacity to move FRES anyway and the money would be better spent on more helicopters and body armour.
Eh? Are we going to go everywhere by helicopter or foot? A protected mobility vehicle might have quite a few uses in the future. Perhaps you know something that no-one else does?
 
#20
fres is a vauge idea mod has been looking for a 432 replacement since the 1970s
how ******* hard can it be :twisted:
box on wheels gun make it rpg resistant room for 8 blokes kit and bowman
give me 5 years I could do it :twisted:
3 years of that would be a crash course in engineering
1 year build a factory
1 year production run
 

Similar threads

Latest Threads

Top