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FRES labeled the most disastrously managed program

theres a vast range of stuff that could do the job
move people about under Armour with something to shoot with
a recce thing

trying to make it heavier hitting than chally while be air liftable by lynx with windows for advanced war fighters giving you the ability to poke terry on facebook wirelessy while costing £99.95 and being built by single parents in a nulabour marginal :roll:

I could do with some surplus ring binders and I'm sure my son would like a boxer/fres model for his window sill £144 million must be plenty of ring binders and models knocking about :twisted:
pity the lads didn't get anything useful

some branded pens would be nice to ta :twisted:
 
The first thing FRES IPT need to do, is decide exactly what they want the thing to do!

...and that doesn't mean a 300-page URD, that essentially says 'everything...and more"!
 

Bouillabaisse

LE
Book Reviewer
Danny_Dravot said:
Sympathetic_Reaction said:
Danny_Dravot said:
the civil service didn't manage FRES, whilst there may be CS on the project team it remains a military project.

IIRC within DEC GM's remit, please correct if wrong!

I'm pretty sure the head of the FRES IPT is a CS. A chap called Phil Riley if a quick Google is correct.

There may well be Military in the IPT and above it, but the main team will be a DE&S team, which is civil service mainly. I'll wait to be corrected but that's my understanding.

S_R

yes, but don't forget that the IPT dances to the tune of the DEC

Not so. There is what I have heard described as "creative tension" but is less charitably described as competition and mistrust between DEC and DE&S. Essentially in theory military-manned DEC put up the cash and define the requirement, which is then passed to DE&S for procurement. The Requirements Manager, a uniform, is embedded as DEC's man in the IPT to ensure a consistant message and output. Between the various people and backgrounds involved there are competing professional and personal ambitions and opinions that sway the way the programme runs.

The civil service staff (the vast majority of any IPT) are generally seeking a long term career in the organisation and have no interest in risk or innovation, since a failure using a safe path is rarely punished but a failure having taken a risk is career limiting. This we get the same old process and thinking. This is made worse at the moment by the drive for redundancies in Abbey Wood, which means arrse covering and job saving are the main priority. In theory decision making rests with the IPT leader or DG. In practice nothing is doen without concensus within the IPT. Thus responsibility is shared and blame diverted. The CS have years of experience in political dealings and generally are able to "lead" DEC and the requirement.

Military staff are driven by their need to achieve the outcome - in FRES' case vehicles - with stupid rules that say they can't ask for a vehicle but must define "capability" in rather vague terms. They have to achieve their goals within a 2-3 year posting, with the junior military staff taking 4-6 months to learn the MOD ropes if its their first appointment. Coupled with that is their career need for a "successful" MOD tour so that they're seen as potential general/admiral/airship candidate. In a 2 year appointment staff are just getting to the point where they understand the unwritten rules and then get moved on.

It is not uncommon to find that perceived project requirements differ wildly between DEC, DE&S civil staff and the DE&S Req manager. It is to industry's advantage to exploit these differences and opportunities to influence the requirement to favour their products and services.

Finally, pretty much anyone on this site could list 5 major procurement programmes over the last 20 years that have been delayed, cost vastly more than they were supposed to and failed to deliver what was really required, or turned out that the requirements have changed. Every time this happens new processes are put in to try to prevent this. These processes take time and effort and add cost and time to a programme. These costs roll out at all levels - planning time, procurement preperation, industry bidding and in the supply process after contract award.

In summary, all that FRES money has been spent to "De-risk" the programme and DE&S have done so because their rules tell them they have to. No CS is going to rock the boat because it will kill their career and DEC lack the control or experience to change it. No one's career will suffer because of it.

I could go on, but its depressing me. And I work in this mix.
 
Gassing_Badgers said:
The first thing FRES IPT need to do, is decide exactly what they want the thing to do!

No. Requirements set by the EC community. IPT merely execute their part of the overall plan.

Gassing_Badgers said:
...and that doesn't mean a 300-page URD, that essentially says 'everything...and more"!

Which is why key requirements are so important.

In reality, with the tensions caused by tightening budgets, political interference and gerrymandering, and Arms and Service rivalries, I'm surprised that we even manage to introduce something as simple as barrack clothing into service.
 
has even that been achieved? or is barrack dress 2000 still an aspiration :twisted:
 
From a site for “Grown ups” . . .

“ The Polish and Slovakian governments have agreed terms for Slovakia to purchase 30 Rosomak armoured vehicles.


Assuming the reported figures are correct, that is just over £20 million for 30 base vehicles, let’s just say three-quarters of a million each, which is not far off one-tenth of the cost of an SV Scout, give or take. Different vehicles I know, but still interesting from a comparison perspective . . .

How many FV432’s are still in service?

http://www.thinkdefence.co.uk/2015/07/an-8x8-for-less-than-four-hundred-thousand-million-gazillion/

 
Did you really need to do a search for "FRES" and put this post on every thread you found?
 
Did you really need to do a search for "FRES" and put this post on every thread you found?
If it helps distribute useful, pertinent, related and appropriate information, to others - who have specifically already shown their interest by contributing to relevant threads (some of which have been dormant for 5-6 years), then . . . YES!

That is what the inter-web, and forum such as this, are about . . . the distribution, dissemination of, and subsequent discussion of, information.

For what reason, justification, exactly, to you see the necessity to behave as a self appointed censor ?!
 

MoleBath

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
There were faults at both Army and Civil service levels. However, the real fault was the last Labour administration who continually changed ministers of defence, usually appointing tired party hacks(anyone mentioned Bob Ainsworth?) Blair liked pouting on stage but denied long term committed funds to MOD.
 
If it helps distribute useful, pertinent, related and appropriate information, to others - who have specifically already shown their interest by contributing to relevant threads (some of which have been dormant for 5-6 years), then . . . YES!

That is what the inter-web, and forum such as this, are about . . . the distribution, dissemination of, and subsequent discussion of, information.

For what reason, justification, exactly, to you see the necessity to behave as a self appointed censor ?!

because 6 threads in a row appearing in the timeline is taking the piss frankly, all with the same cut'n'paste comment in them.
 
Blair liked pouting on stage but denied long term committed funds to MOD.

Think it's more Bliar liked pouting and posing on the world stage whilst his uncontrollable Chancellor did his own thing.

Can anyone else think of a Government where the PM and Chancellor were effectively and practically doing completely different things ?
 

Tuffty

War Hero
FRES 'Most Disastrously Managed Program'

Now that is a statement considering Dii and Bowman but to name 2.

I am sure fellow ARRSEers can name more
 

Guns

ADC
Moderator
Book Reviewer
Frankly the Brits are minor league compared to the LCS for the US Navy and Cyclone for the Canadians.
 

Guns

ADC
Moderator
Book Reviewer
Is FRES still even a thing????
 

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