FRES 2: The Revenge aka MIV

I'm one of the small band of AIRBORNE types that do realise the lesser mortals in the rest of the gang also have a part to play.
STRIKE will be a great thing if we:
1. get the vehicle mix right (whelks with tracks vs all wheels etc)
2. Pull lots of lift out of our hoops to actually move it and support it.

I'm a fan of having dedicated MIV units but also would like to see a pool of RAC crewed MIV to move other light battalions (as someone pointed out earlier ala ww2 kangaroos).
I believe the US 82nd even have some STRYKER lift available.
Like Viking and Warthog?
 
Moving a TES Ajax needs two A400’s. One for the vehicle, one for the armour package and support gubbins
Yes, and making airportability design parameter for anything but the very lightest of armour is insanity of the purest kind. Even the largest aircraft sacrifice significant range to deliver armour and can only do it as a dribble of capability.

"Nicht Kleckern sondern Klotzen! " springs to mind - armour by air cannot achieve that.
 

rampant

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
Happened to notice a multi part article on joint-forces.com about the GTK Boxer by Carl Shulze

Part One - 28th April GTK Boxer Multi-Role Armoured Vehicle ~ Part 1 - Joint Forces News
"Our Senior Correspondent Carl Schulze has photographed the BOXER extensively and in detail, on both exercises and operational deployments, and has written more about this versatile armoured vehicle than almost any other photojournalist. In the light of recent procurements, we are republishing one of Carl’s reports in several parts, accompanied by a library of photos, including some not previously seen."

Part Two - 6th May GTK Boxer Multi-Role Armoured Vehicle ~ Part 2 - Joint Forces News
"In this second part of the Boxer Story, Carl Schulze looks back to the Multi-Role Armoured Vehicle’s Cold War roots."

"To be continued….." I expect there will be subsequent parts in coming weeks.
 
Looks a great bit of kit. Surprised the French never give just us a good deal for a bit if these and VBCI.

Have these for the Cav and Infantry Reece. VBCI for the infantry. Beats the mix of tracked and wheel mix we have now.
here's the skinny

EBRC Jaguar - Wikipedia

Notice the line "The consortium building the "Griffon" and "Jaguar" is contractually obliged to keep the price per Jaguar under €1 million "

This looks better equipped and smaller than Ajax. How the hell did we come up with an oversized shed on tracks when the French have come up with a smaller, better equipped vehicle that can hide ?

BTW. The first missile test in 2015 hit it's target at over 4km..............
 
here's the skinny

EBRC Jaguar - Wikipedia

Notice the line "The consortium building the "Griffon" and "Jaguar" is contractually obliged to keep the price per Jaguar under €1 million "

This looks better equipped and smaller than Ajax. How the hell did we come up with an oversized shed on tracks when the French have come up with a smaller, better equipped vehicle that can hide ?

BTW. The first missile test in 2015 hit it's target at over 4km..............
Creative accounting, at a rough guess. By making some of the systems not count toward that reported cost, it’s not incorrect, but you can’t really use it for comparison. Weapons and radio equipment are commonly left out, but sights, fire control, tax or even appliqué armour could be left out of a total unit cost per vehicle.
 
here's the skinny

EBRC Jaguar - Wikipedia

Notice the line "The consortium building the "Griffon" and "Jaguar" is contractually obliged to keep the price per Jaguar under €1 million "

This looks better equipped and smaller than Ajax. How the hell did we come up with an oversized shed on tracks when the French have come up with a smaller, better equipped vehicle that can hide ?

BTW. The first missile test in 2015 hit it's target at over 4km..............

‘Government Free issue’ parts.

See F-18’s that according to the PTT only cost $64 million.
But US government prices don’t include such useful things as engines, avionics, radar, ejection seats, countermeasures, guns.... all supplied as GFI parts to Boeing for US military orders.
 
Creative accounting, at a rough guess. By making some of the systems not count toward that reported cost, it’s not incorrect, but you can’t really use it for comparison. Weapons and radio equipment are commonly left out, but sights, fire control, tax or even appliqué armour could be left out of a total unit cost per vehicle.
Trying to work out the cost of each vehicle is pretty tricky as every website reports different figures. Anywhere from 2mn Euros to 4mn Euros. One site suggest a cost of 752mn Euros for 1,1916 vehicles.......
 
‘Government Free issue’ parts.

See F-18’s that according to the PTT only cost $64 million.
But US government prices don’t include such useful things as engines, avionics, radar, ejection seats, countermeasures, guns.... all supplied as GFI parts to Boeing for US military orders.
But how does the French MoD calculate vehicle costs ? Do we know that ? For all we know the vehicles do cost 1mn euros each, for the basic hull plus engine plus parts.
 

rampant

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
Well according to armedforces.co.uk an Armd Inf Bn has 86 Warriors, Scimitars and AFV432s.

2 Strike Bdes with 2 MIV Mounted Inf Bns each would ballpark 360 MIVs

So looks like as an absolute minimum all the armour within the Strike Bde would be MIV & Ajax (and some in other Bdes)

That would be a major plus

IF it was to happen
 
Well according to armedforces.co.uk an Armd Inf Bn has 86 Warriors, Scimitars and AFV432s.

2 Strike Bdes with 2 MIV Mounted Inf Bns each would ballpark 360 MIVs

So looks like as an absolute minimum all the armour within the Strike Bde would be MIV & Ajax (and some in other Bdes)

That would be a major plus

IF it was to happen
I afraid we have run out of magic money trees. Williamson wants £20bn more to run MoD and it doesn't look like he is going to get it. The situation is so bad they can't even publish the MDP headlines, because there aren't any to publish.

The Army is at the bottom when it comes to funds and we will struggle to fund, man, support and equip two Strike Brigades and two Armoured Infantry brigades. As for deploying one warfighting Division with the ability to regenerate a second, that is more about preserving 1* and 2* positions than reality. 1 Div could be reduced to a pool of trained manpower as BCRs for regenerating 3 Div should the need arise.
 
I afraid we have run out of magic money trees. Williamson wants £20bn more to run MoD and it doesn't look like he is going to get it. The situation is so bad they can't even publish the MDP headlines, because there aren't any to publish.

The Army is at the bottom when it comes to funds and we will struggle to fund, man, support and equip two Strike Brigades and two Armoured Infantry brigades. As for deploying one warfighting Division with the ability to regenerate a second, that is more about preserving 1* and 2* positions than reality. 1 Div could be reduced to a pool of trained manpower as BCRs for regenerating 3 Div should the need arise.
As far as I know there is no talk about being able to regenerate a 2nd Division.

There will be a 2nd division in name but it is more of less all the forces that are left over after filling the fighting division (regional forces, Cyprus, LONDIST, etc etc)
 

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