Former Enemies US & Vietnam Now Military Mates

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by bakerlite, Aug 8, 2010.

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  1. News from The Associated Press

    By MARGIE MASON Associated Press Writer

    Enlightened mutual interest, subtle. (Delete churchillian quotation about eventually doing the right thing)

  2. Allies again, it should say. The US and Viet Minh were allied against the Japanese during WW2 - and ironically US field medics saved Ho's life when he came down with various jungle fevers. At the end, the Viets were told to **** off as sucking up to De Gaulle was a greater imperative.

    It makes sense that the US and Vietnam should be allies; Vietnam has a historically hostile relationship with China, and the countries share a history/national myth of struggle against colonialists.
  3. Why should that be a surprise, we are allies with germany, the usa and even france and look how many wars we have had against them. this is the way the world works with ever changing foreign policy dictating who become new friends and enemies.
  4. Now you've done it! Next you'll mention that Ho was promised US support in his quest for independence and was avowedly pro American until as you say, he was****ed over by the Yanks who fell hook, line and sinker for the French claims Ho was a 'commie'. Of course the French claims were nothing to do with them wanting Vietnam back.

    "…Letter to President Harry Truman, February 16, 1945. The letter was never answered and was not declassified until 1972


    Our VIETNAM people, as early as 1941, stood by the Allies' side and fought against the Japanese and their associates, the French colonialists.

    From 1941 to 1945 we fought bitterly, sustained by the patriotism, of our fellow-countrymen and by the promises made by the Allies at YALTA, SAN FRANCISCO and POTSDAM.

    When the Japanese were defeated in August 1945, the whole Vietnam territory was united under a Provisional Republican Government, which immediately set out to work. In five months, peace and order were restored, a democratic republic was established on legal bases, and adequate help was given to the Allies in the carrying out of their disarmament mission.

    But the French Colonialists, who betrayed in wartime both the Allies and the Vietnamese, have come back, and are waging on us a murderous and pitiless war in order reestablish their domination. Their invasion has extended to South Vietnam and is menacing us in North Vietnam. It would take volumes to give even an abbreviated report of the crisis and assassinations they are committing everyday in this fighting area.

    This aggression is contrary to all principles of international law and the pledge made by the Allies during World War II. It is a challenge to the noble attitude shown before, during, and after the war by the United States Government and People. It violently contrasts with the firm stand you have taken in your twelve point declaration, and with the idealistic loftiness and generosity expressed by your delegates to the United Nations Assembly, MM. BYRNES, STETTINIUS, AND J.F. DULLES.

    The French aggression on a peace-loving people is a direct menace to world security. It implies the complicity, or at least the connivance of the Great Democracies. The United Nations ought to keep their words. They ought to interfere to stop this unjust war, and to show that they mean to carry out in peacetime the principles for which they fought in wartime.

    Our Vietnamese people, after so many years of spoliation and devastation, is just beginning its building-up work. It needs security and freedom, first to achieve internal prosperity and welfare, and later to bring its small contribution to world-reconstruction.

    These security and freedom can only be guaranteed by our independence from any colonial power, and our free cooperation with all other powers. It is with this firm conviction that we request of the United Sates as guardians and champions of World Justice to take a decisive step in support of our independence.

    What we ask has been graciously granted to the Philippines. Like the Philippines our goal is full independence and full cooperation with the UNITED STATES. We will do our best to make this independence and cooperation profitable to the whole world.

    I am Dear Mr. PRESIDENT,

    Respectfully Yours,

    (Signed) Ho Chi Minh…"

    Oh well, 3 wars and a few million dead civilians later, things may finally be put right.
  5. Well, I don't see that as especially controversial. We went to war over the invasion of Poland, yet at the end handed them over to Stalin with a free hand to torment them as he pleased. There was also a bit of unpleasantness with some people who'd worked for us and who were sent East to be murdered.

    Shafting former allies in pursuit of perceived national interest is hardly anything new or surprising. And Ho was 'a commie'. He'd turned to the Soviets for help between the wars when nobody else even pretended to care about non-white colonial subjects.

    After WW2, Stalin told the Viets to **** off as well, as he was hoping that the French would elect a Communist government and didn't want French soldiers being killed by Communist troops in their Empire.
  6. Ho was a socialist by nature. Alas, the US at the time couldn't make the fine demarcation between socialist and communist.
    Looks like a perfectly reasonable document to me: The US dropped the ball big time with Ho Chi Mihn.

    (September 2, 1945)

    All men are created equal; they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable Rights; among these are Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness.

    This immortal statement was made in the Declaration of Independence of the United States of America in 1776. In a broader sense, this means: All the peoples on the earth are equal from birth, all the peoples have a right to live, to be happy and free.

    The Declaration of the French Revolution made in 1791 on the Rights of Man and the Citizen also states: "All men are born free and with equal rights, and must always remain free and have equal rights."

    Those are undeniable truths.

    Nevertheless, for more than eighty years, the French imperialists, abusing the standard of Liberty, Equality, and Fraternity, have violated our Fatherland and oppressed our fellow citizens. They have acted contrary to the ideals of humanity and justice.

    In the field of politics, they have deprived our people of every democratic liberty.

    They have enforced inhuman laws; they have set up three distinct political regimes in the North, the Center, and the South of Viet-Nam in order to wreck our national unity and prevent our people from being united.

    They have built more prisons than schools. They have mercilessly slain our patriots; they have drowned our uprisings in rivers of blood.

    They have fettered public opinion; they have practiced obscurantism against our people.

    To weaken our race they have forced us to use opium and alcohol.

    In the field of economics, they have fleeced us to the backbone, impoverished our people and devastated our land.

    They have robbed us of our rice fields, our mines, our forests, and our raw materials. They have monopolized the issuing of bank notes and the export trade.

    They have invented numerous unjustifiable taxes and reduced our people, especially our peasantry, to a state of extreme poverty.

    They have hampered the prospering of our national bourgeoisie; they have mercilessly exploited our workers.

    In the autumn of 1940, when the Japanese fascists violated Indochina's territory to establish new bases in their fight against the Allies, the French imperialists went down on their bended knees and handed over our country to them.

    Thus, from that date, our people were subjected to the double yoke of the French and the Japanese. Their sufferings and miseries increased. The result was that, from the end of last year to the beginning of this year, from Quang Tri Province to the North of Viet-Nam, more than two million of our fellow citizens died from starvation. On March 9 [1945], the French troops were disarmed by the Japanese. The French colonialists either fled or surrendered, showing that not only were they incapable of "protecting" us, but that, in the span of five years, they had twice sold our country to the Japanese.

    On several occasions before March 9, the Viet Minh League urged the French to ally themselves with it against the Japanese. Instead of agreeing to this proposal, the French colonialists so intensified their terrorist activities against the Viet Minh members that before fleeing they massacred a great number of our political prisoners detained at Yen Bay and Cao Bang.

    Notwithstanding all this, our fellow citizens have always manifested toward the French a tolerant and humane attitude. Even after the Japanese Putsch of March, 1945, the Viet Minh League helped many Frenchmen to cross the frontier, rescued some of them from Japanese jails, and protected French lives and property.

    From the autumn of 1940, our country had in fact ceased to be a French colony and had become a Japanese possession. After the Japanese had surrendered to the Allies, our whole people rose to regain our national sovereignty and to found the Democratic Republic of Viet-Nam. The truth is that we have wrested our independence from the Japanese and not from the French. The French have fled, the Japanese have capitulated, Emperor Bao Dai has abdicated. Our people have broken the chains which for nearly a century have fettered them and have won independence for the Fatherland. Our people at the same time have overthrown the monarchic regime that has reigned supreme for dozens of centuries. In its place has been established the present Democratic Republic.

    For these reasons, we, members of the Provisional Government, representing the whole Vietnamese people, declare that from now on we break off all relations of a colonial character with France; we repeal all the international obligation that France has so far subscribed to on behalf of Viet-Nam, and we abolish all the special rights the French have unlawfully acquired in our Fatherland.

    The whole Vietnamese people, animated by a common purpose, are determined to fight to the bitter end against any attempt by the French colonialists to reconquer their country. We are convinced that the Allied nations, which at Teheran and San Francisco have acknowledged the principles of self-determination and equality of nations, will not refuse to acknowledge the independence of Viet-Nam.

    A people who have courageously opposed French domination for more than eighty years, a people who have fought side by side with the Allies against the fascists during these last years, such a people must be free and independent.

    For these reasons, we, members of the Provisional Government of the Democratic Republic of Viet-Nam, solemnly declare to the world that Viet-Nam has the right to be a free and independent country—and in fact it is so already. The entire Vietnamese people are determined to mobilize all their physical and mental strength, to sacrifice their lives and property in order to safeguard their independence and liberty.
  7. Do you have to turn every thread into an anti-Septic dribblefest? OK, they're all cnuts and they smell of wee. Now can we please discuss something without you trying to slip turds into Mom's apple pie every five minutes?
  8. P_F
    If he's not turning threads into an anti-Septic rant then he's doing the same on an anti-Crab bias......

    I think Simple_Flid must have been touched "under the bridge" by some big butch Yank or Crab pilot in his formative years - it'd certainly explain a lot..........
  9. jim24

    jim24 Book Reviewer

    Churchill did the same thing to the Poles in 1945, just forgot they were there,they were not even invited to the London Parade
  10. They started it…

    …the Vietnam war that is. It was a massive political fuckup by the Yanks period.
  11. the_boy_syrup

    the_boy_syrup LE Book Reviewer

    Shouldn't that be ...Fuckup by the Yanks Fullstop?
    Period is an American term

    Don't let them influence you!!
  12. They are pals with the French again; linky.

  13. the_boy_syrup

    the_boy_syrup LE Book Reviewer

    Surrender Monkeys teach Vietnamese Army the tricks of the trade
    Then the Yanks turn up again..........

    I love it when a plan comes together
  14. Looks like the Americans are viewing the Chinese as a potentional threat

    The Vietnamese and Chinese have previous form on this, in both 1979 and 1984 Chinese forces invaded Vietnam. As far as I can tell they've never liked each other since about 5000 BC !