• ARRSE have partnered with Armadillo Merino to bring you an ARRSE exclusive, generous discount offer on their full price range.
    To keep you warm with the best of Merino gear, visit www.armadillomerino.co.uk and use the code: NEWARRSE40 at the checkout to get 40% off!
    This superb deal has been generously offered to us by Armadillo Merino and is valid until midnight on the the 28th of February.

Five million paid less than living wage, says KPMG [BBC Article]

#1
One in five workers in the UK is paid less than required for a basic standard of living, a report has said.

The proportion is much higher among waiters and bar staff, at up to 90% of workers, the research for accountants KPMG suggested.

It said that nearly five million people failed to command the living wage - a pay packet that enabled a basic standard of living.

The rate stands at £8.30 an hour in London and £7.20 in the rest of the UK.

This rate is voluntary, unlike the National Minimum Wage - the amount that employers must pay by law, which is set at £6.19 an hour for those aged 21 and over.

"Times are difficult for many people, but of course those on the lowest pay are suffering the most," said Marianne Fallon, head of corporate affairs at KPMG, which has itself signed up to pay the living wage.

"Paying a living wage makes a huge difference to the individuals and their families and yet does not actually cost an employer much more.

"Tackling in-work poverty is also vital if we are to enable more people to improve their life prospects and increase social mobility in this country."

'Tough choices'
The report suggested that Northern Ireland had the highest proportion of people earning below the living wage, at 24% of workers, followed by Wales at 23%.

The lowest levels were in London and the South East of England, both at 16%, it said. In terms of total numbers, London, the North West of England and the South East of England had the most.

When looking at sectors of employers, some 90% of bar staff and 85% of waiters and waitresses failed to get as much as the living wage.

Some 780,000 sales and retail assistants were not paid to living wage level, the highest total of any group of employees, the report suggested.

Frances O'Grady, the incoming general secretary of the TUC, said: "It is shocking that in this day and age, one in five workers is still earning less than is needed to maintain a decent standard of living.


Report author Mike Kelly: "Businesses should look at wages in a more innovative way"
"The living wage is not a luxury, and means that low-paid workers do not have to make tough choices over whether they can afford the everyday things that most of us take for granted, such as their fuel bill or a winter coat for their children.

"Many more employers could afford to adopt the living wage, and we hope that many more decide to pay it in the coming months. Now more than ever is the time for employers to put an end to poverty pay."

But Mike Cherry, policy chairman for the Federation of Small Businesses, said: "Every employer would want to be as reasonable as they possibly can, but in the current economic climate it is not going to be possible for those sectors that have traditionally been unable to pay the national minimum wage."

He said rent and rates were becoming more expensive, and so were energy costs, so the living wage was an aspiration but not affordable for some employers.

He added that the market would determine what was affordable.

A separate report by the CBI said that employers have needed to take a cautious approach to employment and pay given the economic climate, and this is set to continue.

The group said that there would be pay restraint over the next six months, but this was designed to protect employment.
BBC News - Five million paid less than living wage, says KPMG


THIS is the main problem with the UK economy right now, and not one that is easily solved. Increasing the minimum wage is definitely not an option. That will only put people out of business and make the UK even less competitive.

So instead of giving people more money, the only other option is to take less money off them so they have more in their pockets.
I'm looking at Energy firms, public transport, and rental prices (buy to let investors). The prices for those 3 essentials are a lot higher than in most (all?) 1st world countries but are not near as good in comparison.
The added benefit would be that less money is spent on welfare to support people who actually work for their money, lower rental prices will also decrease the housing benefit bill which is by far the most costly of welfare expenses.


There's more to making work pay than cutting benefits.
 
#2
BBC News - Five million paid less than living wage, says KPMG


THIS is the main problem with the UK economy right now, and not one that is easily solved. Increasing the minimum wage is definitely not an option. That will only put people out of business and make the UK even less competitive.

So instead of giving people more money, the only other option is to take less money off them so they have more in their pockets.
I'm looking at Energy firms, public transport, and rental prices (buy to let investors). The prices for those 3 essentials are a lot higher than in most (all?) 1st world countries but are not near as good in comparison.
The added benefit would be that less money is spent on welfare to support people who actually work for their money, lower rental prices will also decrease the housing benefit bill which is by far the most costly of welfare expenses.
Wasn't that the argument for not implicating it in the first place, turned out to be nonsense? The main problem is that the US and Europe is on it's arse not the minimum wage.
 

Bouillabaisse

LE
Book Reviewer
#3
So your solution to low pay is to take money off other people who've earned it? Would you like rent controls, after all, that works so well? Or privatise the energy companies? Subsidise public transport further by making me pay for it when I don't use it?
 
#4
BBC News - Five million paid less than living wage, says KPMG


THIS is the main problem with the UK economy right now, and not one that is easily solved. Increasing the minimum wage is definitely not an option. That will only put people out of business and make the UK even less competitive.

So instead of giving people more money, the only other option is to take less money off them so they have more in their pockets.
I'm looking at Energy firms, public transport, and rental prices (buy to let investors). The prices for those 3 essentials are a lot higher than in most (all?) 1st world countries but are not near as good in comparison.
The added benefit would be that less money is spent on welfare to support people who actually work for their money, lower rental prices will also decrease the housing benefit bill which is by far the most costly of welfare expenses.


There's more to making work pay than cutting benefits.
Why not cut the price of gin, video games and kebabs?

Not essentials, no. But sold by private companies/individuals... Just like energy, transport & homes.
 
#7
So your solution to low pay is to take money off other people who've earned it?
No.
More efficient services.
The consumer is currently being ripped off right left and centre by companies providing a crap service.

Energy and transport companies are raising their prices by at least double the inflation rate every year. This puts pressure on households, people have less money, in the end the government has to relieve them by chipping in on their rent. So the government is indirectly subsidizing energy and transport companies. Not to mention some of the companies being foreign to add insult to injury.

Would you like rent controls, after all, that works so well?
Funny, works in most places.
The UK property market is broken and it is not only a burden on quality of life, but also on the economy.

Subsidise public transport further by making me pay for it when I don't use it?
A good transport infrastructure would have a very positive effect on the economy, which you would benefit from as well.
Personally I could not care less if you don't use PT, and I wouldn't if I don't either, I want my country to function.

At the moment it's costing the consumer thousands of pounds a year for a substandard service. If it was cheaper and more reliable/efficient it would provide a double wammy boost to the economy in the form of more disposable income which would be spent on goods, and a more efficient transportation network.
 

Bouillabaisse

LE
Book Reviewer
#9
What is it about ****ing socialists that they can't look at a probelm without wanting to spend my money? Some observations:

Bashing big businesses may sound good at a union rally but doesn't stand up to scrutiny of hard fact.
If people want a living wage then they should have paid more attention at school.
Most of the bar staff and wiaters in London who "need" £8.20 an hour are foreigners. If they can't live on it then they should go back to whatever little paradise they left to get here.
If the last labour government hadn't encouraged mass immigration of cheap foreign labour then employers would have to pay higher wages, solving the problem.
 
#12
The whole country needs a shake up. The politicians (inc local) look after themselves nicely. Living on benefits is now a life-style choice not a safety net. Poor immigration controls make lawyers rich. The police have lost focus on what their job is. Energy companies have formed a cartel.
I'm off for a drink.
 
#13
Where did I even mention big business?

This is about 20% of the UK's workforce needs support from the state because they can't live on their wage. If you think that's fine then I hope you're in a minority, because our economy is doomed if you're not.

Now, is there anybody pragmatic around who would like to discuss the topic and doesn't just seem to copy/paste posts from angry_reactionary_drivel.doc from his desktop?
 

Bouillabaisse

LE
Book Reviewer
#14
You mentioned energy firms. or do you think they're small to medium enterprises? And tell me I'm wrong about the price of labour versus the available supply of labourers?
 
#15
Where did I even mention big business?

This is about 20% of the UK's workforce needs support from the state because they can't live on their wage. If you think that's fine then I hope you're in a minority, because our economy is doomed if you're not.

Now, is there anybody pragmatic around who would like to discuss the topic and doesn't just seem to copy/paste posts from angry_reactionary_drivel.doc from his desktop?
My mate Marek thinks the UK is great. So much so that he travelled all the way from Poznan with his Mrs. to live in our doomed, broken economy. Both of them seem to be able to work and play with no bother...

Bloody foreigners, eh?
 
#16
Five million paid less than living wage .... What you all complaining about ?

This is exactly how our government like it.

Our government would have us all working for nothing if they could get away with it.
 
#17
Five million paid less than living wage .... What you all complaining about ?

This is exactly how our government like it.

Our government would have us all working for nothing if they could get away with it.

I know, bastards!

Underpaying the waiters & barstaff in all those State owned pubs & restaurants.
 

Bouillabaisse

LE
Book Reviewer
#18
It's all the fault of the rich - they're not tipping enough. The government should act to introduce a mandatory 20% tip. Means tested of course, so the poor don't have to pay.
 
#19
The phrase "a decent standard of living" is used a lot in that report.

Who decides what that is, what it consists of in the way of must haves and how much it is supposed to cost
 
#20
The phrase "a decent standard of living" is used a lot in that report.

Who decides what that is, what it consists of in the way of must haves and how much it is supposed to cost
Listen you lackey of the fat-cat corporate banksters.

I'll have you know that since I went short hours I can't buy my PS3 games full price and have to wait until they come out on budget. More to the fecking point, at the end of the month I have to buy my meat from supermarkets. Sometimes I have to use the "short date" freezer too.

It's new age serfdom, that's what it is.
 

Latest Threads