Firing foreign weapons on ranges ...

Shotgun

War Hero
Actually that's not quite right Shotgun. I know a man who's the armourer for several police forces and a guest armourer here and there who's got a collection of weapons that would make you wince. Churchills Tommy Gun, one of the MP5's that went into the embassy, Sten Gun serial number 00005 etc (and when I say etc I mean 100's of weapons)

All quite legit on his section 5 firearms license. I may have told this story elsewhere on ARRSE once but I was on a range day and I approached said armourer and said something along the lines of "I can't help but feel the Steyr Aug would be better than these SA80's" and he produced the barrel and then the body out of his armourers bag at his side and said "like this". My jaw hit the ground.
I'm sorry to disagree Mr Happy, but he was breaking the law there.

He would have a section 5 for his work, transporting weapons from place to place and the like, and he might even have a dispensation for firing various bits, but only for testing purposes. The various bits that he owned himself would be on his section 5 but only for the purposes of either collecting, as historic arms, or arms with historic interest. Most of what you say might be correct if he was using official licences for testing purposes, but if he was firing his 'own' stuff on auto, or if he was firing them and they were capable of auto fire, he would be breaking the law. I think it more likely, if it was legal, that they weren't his and were part of the police forces own collection, which I think unlikely, and had taken them out for testing purposes on official documentation. The only other way is if they were deacts. Going out fopr jollies with police kit is a no no, and firing your own even under a section five is also a no no unless it has official sanction and purpose.

That's all different from owning and blasting away at a local club as a private individual.
 

Mr Happy

LE
Moderator
We'll have to agree to disagree there Shotgun. I recognise you have some experience in the business from your name but you'll have to accept that I do too.

I've PM'd you with some thoughts.

Mr H
 
Mr Happy said:
All quite legit on his section 5 firearms license. I may have told this story elsewhere on ARRSE once but I was on a range day and I approached said armourer and said something along the lines of "I can't help but feel the Steyr Aug would be better than these SA80's" and he produced the barrel and then the body out of his armourers bag at his side and said "like this". My jaw hit the ground.
Our old battalion armourer was much the same; except the fun stuff that he had (MP5K, MP5SD, Ingram, Steyr, AR18, pump-action sawn-off for hinge removal) did actually belong to the police.

Letting the boys from one of our more.... urban.. Companies loose with the sawn-off was educational ;) About as much as "guess the accent of the student who actually scores a hit on the Molotov range".

We also got the local police along to a range day to show off their toys, while one of our Companies was training for Swiss Raid. They brought G36E, MP5, etc; and I managed a happy hour of unofficial comparative testing between G36, L85, and Steyr on the 30m range :)

Mr Happy said:
On NRA grounds you can pretty much have a ball. I believe the Vickers MMG Fan Club fired some 5,000,000 rounds over 17 days out of one weapon once. Contact the NRA for rules.
It was last summer; early August? 2002, on Stickledown at Bisley. They had eight fully working Vickers, a bunch of SMLE, a Lewis Gun or two, the requisite number of "re-enactors", and about 250,000 rounds of Mk.8Z, mostly Yugoslav. Along with a belt-feeder machine (looks like a table-top mincer; feed rounds into the top hopper, put empty belt in at side, wind handle, create 0.303 belt).

They were letting anyone (who paid) have a cabby on the Vickers. We'd just driven onto camp, heard the sound, and thought "bit slower than a GPMG, that...."
 

Mr Happy

LE
Moderator
Gravelbelly said:
It was last summer; early August? 2002, on Stickledown at Bisley."
That was 100 year anniversary or something like it, I wanted to make it down but couldn't. The millions of rounds job was a few years ago I think.
 
T

Tango34

Guest
Have a look at Limpstone if u r ever down that way, they have "extra" wps in that camp.................. But then they have marines as well, so in that case forget it!
 
V

vespa

Guest
ctauch said:
http://www.knightshooting.com/index.htm

In the tampa bay area...I am attending tactical shooting course (hand gun)there this Sunday if you need more info let me know and I will try and get it for ya...there are a couple of other ranges in the area that also offer full auto shoots.
please do, thanks, any info will be useful before i fly over as well seeing all that Florida has to offer :wink:
 
Bit of a thick civvy question this but it's loosely on the topic of how firearms law applies to serving soldiers:
There's a chap I know who apparently served in GWI with an armoured regiment there are pictures of him in the desert so I have no reason to disbelieve him. He claims that because the Browning pistols that were issued either didn't suit him or were a bit knackered he bought a 9mm Walther (P88?) to use as a sidearm.

My questions are:
a) Was this likely or legal?
b) How would the situation have changed since the Dunblane "Revenge" handgun ban?

I ask this because amongst all the furore over body armour supply I note that some sources claim that the tank commander who was killed in Iraq was let down by his (apparently superannuated) pistol which jammed. I wondered wether it is possible or common to source ones own weapons if the issue stuff is a bit ropey. After all you seem to have to provide everything else yourself.
 

Mr Happy

LE
Moderator
At the risk of sticking my neck out there are quite a few examples of chaps taking their own firearms to the gulf in '90/'91, mostly because they already owned them and there was a proper war for the first time in ages.

So:

a. yes and not sure
b. handguns are banned to private ownership regardless of your employment so all the soldiers had to get rid of theirs just like Joe Civvy.

Of course, if the job issues you a shooter then that's fine. And FYI the 9mm browning is a piece of shit in my opinion but there's a very long thread in the QM's section of this site covering all the arguments so I won't try to start another.
 

yeoman

Old-Salt
If you are military and want to do a fun shoot you can try Shrivenham. They have an extensive collection of firearms, and used to be quite good about letting you have a go. I am a bit out of date, but PM me for the people who used to arrange it.
 

Ard-Elly-o

Old-Salt
vespa said:
does anybody know of a good ranges where you can hire or have a go at some unusual weapons ie AK47, Siminovs, Uzi, HKs etc , i dont think there are any in the UK, so what about on the continent ie Spain, Cyprus etc...........
Get in touch with SO1 ARA at Bisley who may help and for the HK Wpn system contact Secretary of REME Rifle Association who arranges a hands on display and chance to fire a good range of HK Wpns, such as MP5 + variants, G36 variants and PS1 sniper rifle during the OA&S Joint Corps Skill at Arms Meeting at Ash Ranges.

Heckler and Koch (GB) are usually very helpfull.
 
V

vespa

Guest
thanks all , i never expected so many helpful replies, cheers , :D
 

Arkady

Old-Salt
Regarding personal (non-issue) weapons. though technically frowned upon, if you're actually in a war, no-one seems that bothered.
I carried my grand-dad's old Walther P38 around with me and it was mighty fine.
Might get a bollocking if I was still carrying it around Sennybridge though...
 
Arkady said:
I carried my grand-dad's old Walther P38 around with me...
Was your Grandad in the SS :D
 
In GW1 I carried a flintlock, ball and powder that my great, great, great grand daddy left the family. Range was around 10metres. Confused the ragheads.
 
Gunny, during GW 1 you were locked up in Berlin for shoplifting :D
 
mighty_doh-nut said:
Gunny, during GW 1 you were locked up in Berlin for shoplifting :D
Wrong ! I was in Topcliffe pushing and pulling with 24 Air Mobile Bde. All told on a Friday we were on 7 days NTM. Then you lot in Germany got the call instead. The shoplifting was never proven cos the RMPs fcuked up the evidence.
 

New Posts

Latest Threads

Top